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Thread: UNH Hockey: Treading Water or Trending Upward

  1. #401
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    Re: UNH Hockey: Treading Water or Trending Upward

    If Yukon ties Maine tomorrow night in Bridgeport, UNH will be all alone in ninth place, without MBPBEGAM postseason games. Fortunately, we will still have some games in hand over both those teams, so all is not lost.

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    Re: UNH Hockey: Treading Water or Trending Upward

    Quote Originally Posted by Snively65 View Post
    If Yukon ties Maine tomorrow night in Bridgeport, UNH will be all alone in ninth place, without MBPBEGAM postseason games. Fortunately, we will still have some games in hand over both those teams, so all is not lost.
    A tie arguably would be the best result from a UNH perspective. Temporarily one point behind two mediocre teams (not to say UNH isn't necessarily in that category too), but with an additional game in hand on both. I crunched the numbers on standings over the weekend at HR's direction, and I think UNH already has about 2-3 HE games in hand on both UMaine & Luce Canaan AC before tomorrow's game. And while UNH will need to finish ahead of at least one of them to make the playoffs, they'll want/expect to finish ahead of both (and others?) to maximize their chances of a favorable seeding, and then to get to Boston in mid-March.

    Added WIS bonus would be for Luce to get lost in *beautiful* downtown Bridgeport while looking for a post-game haunt. The place makes Lowell look like frickin' Beverly Hills by comparison Ö
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    Re: UNH Hockey: Treading Water or Trending Upward

    Quote Originally Posted by wildcatdc View Post
    When my college-age uncle found out that I was starting to get serious about drums, he popped a cassette into his ďboom boxĒ. A Farewell to Kings on one side, 2112 on the other.
    Not white haired?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Murray View Post
    A tie arguably would be the best result from a UNH perspective. Temporarily one point behind two mediocre teams (not to say UNH isn't necessarily in that category too), but with an additional game in hand on both. I crunched the numbers on standings over the weekend at HR's direction, and I think UNH already has about 2-3 HE games in hand on both UMaine & Luce Canaan AC before tomorrow's game. And while UNH will need to finish ahead of at least one of them to make the playoffs, they'll want/expect to finish ahead of both (and others?) to maximize their chances of a favorable seeding, and then to get to Boston in mid-March.

    Added WIS bonus would be for Luce to get lost in *beautiful* downtown Bridgeport while looking for a post-game haunt. The place makes Lowell look like frickin' Beverly Hills by comparison Ö
    Would LG have said "I would rather be stabbed in Bridgeport than a black bear in Maine"?

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    Quote Originally Posted by NCAA watcher View Post
    Not white haired?
    Nice reference! One day I will have a gleaming alloy air car.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Snively65 View Post
    Would LG have said "I would rather be stabbed in Bridgeport than a black bear in Maine"?
    No it was New Britain where Vlae is
    Or maybe Lowell!

  7. #407
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Murray View Post
    A tie arguably would be the best result from a UNH perspective. Temporarily one point behind two mediocre teams (not to say UNH isn't necessarily in that category too), but with an additional game in hand on both. I crunched the numbers on standings over the weekend at HR's direction, and I think UNH already has about 2-3 HE games in hand on both UMaine & Luce Canaan AC before tomorrow's game. And while UNH will need to finish ahead of at least one of them to make the playoffs, they'll want/expect to finish ahead of both (and others?) to maximize their chances of a favorable seeding, and then to get to Boston in mid-March.

    Added WIS bonus would be for Luce to get lost in *beautiful* downtown Bridgeport while looking for a post-game haunt. The place makes Lowell look like frickin' Beverly Hills by comparison Ö
    Someone is encouraging incoming fire! :-)

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    Re: UNH Hockey: Treading Water or Trending Upward

    Quote Originally Posted by e.cat View Post
    No it was New Britain where Vlae is
    Or maybe Lowell!
    "Vlae" is in New Haven

    CCSU is in New Britain.
    UNH

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    Re: UNH Hockey: Treading Water or Trending Upward

    To be fair, Bridgeport is far from alone in ranking the "garden spots" of CT. Whether it's New London, New Britain, New Haven or Hartford, there's lots of candidates to put up against (and trounce) the likes of Lowell or Bangor, or even our lovely ManchV.egas. But in only one of these fair burghs have I literally needed step-by-step pedestrian directions to get me (safely) from a parking garage to the courthouse, only a block-and-a-half away. As in "Leave the garage on X level at the Y exit, cross in the crosswalk directly to the hotel across the street, go into the back hotel entrance, walk straight through the foyer to the front hotel entrance, cross in another crosswalk, and use the middle door at the courthouse".

    And that was in Bridgeport. Make of that what you will. Good luck tomorrow night, Luce!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott View Post
    "Vlae" is in New Haven

    CCSU is in New Britain.
    No Yale is in New Haven. Vlae is in lala land.

    Lol! Where am I?

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    Re: UNH Hockey: Treading Water or Trending Upward

    That Griffin-van Riemsdyk trade was a hell of a lose-lose in the end.

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    Re: UNH Hockey: Treading Water or Trending Upward

    Quote Originally Posted by TheRevengeance View Post
    That Griffin-van Riemsdyk trade was a hell of a lose-lose in the end.
    Today on Instagram Robby Griffin announced he's leaving the sport...if that's what you're talking about. Wish him all the best...enjoyed his time with us albeit brief.
    Last edited by HockeyRef; 01-14-2020 at 09:05 PM.

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    Re: UNH Hockey: Treading Water or Trending Upward


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    Re: UNH Hockey: Treading Water or Trending Upward

    Quote Originally Posted by HockeyRef View Post
    Today on Instagram Robby Griffin announced he's leaving the sport...if that's what you're talking about. Wish him all the best...enjoyed his time with us albeit brief.
    Weird, I was wondering why he'd been playing so rarely, I guess this is the answer.

    "Leaving the sport" does sound kind of drastic. Unusual, to say the least. Hard to think of similar past examples, I guess Eddie Caron is the closest one that comes to mind from a UNH perspective, but even he went back and forth on his decision(s) several times. I guess sometimes it can be hard trying to live up to other peoples' expectations, when your heart really isn't into it Ö ???

    Just one of those things that make you say hmmm ... at least he "cleared" the UNH program of blame, which might not even have been necessary, had it not been for some recent media comments from BvB. Wonder if he's staying in school, or branching out in other directions? Just out of sheer curiosity, it will be interesting to see where he lands in the end. If he's genuinely and sincerely done with the game, it's hard not to admire the kid for making a tough decision that many others might delay, or not make at all.
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    Re: UNH Hockey: Treading Water or Trending Upward

    Good for him. I know his dad went to Tufts, so presumably academics is important to the family. I wonder if he was lured to UNH with more of an academic scholarship vs. a hockey scholarship, so if the money remains the same, it makes sense to focus on academics and move on.

    In the end, once a player realizes that hockey may not be their path forward, and that education is important, they can make informed decisions for their own long-term well-being. We can guess BvR reached the same conclusion in some form, and moved on with his education. Rather than complain about kids who make their own decisions as being spoiled brats, I welcome it. (Especially if they are diplomatic and don't throw bombs on the way out.)

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    Re: UNH Hockey: Treading Water or Trending Upward

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon View Post
    Speaking of a series that Dares Not Speak Its Name, the one thing I learned from briefly watching NU/UNH on Saturday is the Goons need to stay the hell out of overtime.
    Here's some outsider scouting info. on the Friars, cribbed from Mike Peters column on ESPN.com:

    Super Sophomores Keeping Providence in the [Postseason] Discussion

    The Providence Friars could have easily taken a step back this season following key losses from a team that made it to the Frozen Four in 2019. But a pair of super sophomores took their games to another level to fill gaps left by departing players.

    Vegas Golden Knights draft pick Jack Dugan entered college after an extra year of junior hockey, was a standout freshman in 2018-19 and is now a bona fide Hobey Baker favorite as a sophomore. The Pittsburgh native is in the midst of one of the most productive college hockey seasons of the past 20 years. With 41 points through 23 games, he is the nation's scoring leader and is very near the scoring pace that Johnny Gaudreau put together during his 80-point Hobey Baker-winning campaign as a junior. Only two other players topped 80 points in the 2000s prior to Gaudreau doing so in 2013-14.

    But it isn't a one-man or one-line show. The Friars are also getting big production out of sophomore Tyce Thompson, a fourth-round draft choice of the New Jersey Devils in his third year of eligibility. Thompson is tied for the national goal-scoring lead, with 17, and is second in the nation behind Dugan, with 36 points. Then there are junior Greg Printz, sophomore defenseman Michael Callahan (Arizona Coyotes), freshman Parker Ford (2020 draft-eligible) and freshman Patrick Moynihan (Devils). Also, graduate transfer Michael Lackey has a .927 save percentage while playing in 97% of the minutes for Providence.

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    Re: UNH Hockey: Treading Water or Trending Upward

    Quote Originally Posted by Dan View Post
    I canít tell if you generally agree or disagree with me, but you make a fair point about the PPG against and taking two penalties. Gildon has four penalties in the past four games - too many. I would just ask that if we harp on that we do so with any player (as expectations aside every penalty puts UNH at the same disadvantage). Or we chalk it up to hockey for each kid. I think either can come without hyperbole or getting personal...

    Youíre post noting the penalties and wishing for better is entirely reasonable, IMO. Expecting better production stats and fewer penalties is fair game.

    That said when discussing flukey occurrences (and not entirely reliable stats) - itís just that when the UNH PK kills all three non-Gildon penalties and surrenders goals on both of his.

    And any night with two PPG against should focus much of that blame to the PK. UNHís PK has hurt them all season. They rank 54th nationally in killing penalties. And how about this stat - UNH has had fewer PK opportunities than all but 14 teams this season, yet has given up more PPG than all but five...

    For all the talk about goaltending of late both are between .910 and .915 at even strength when UNH has allowed just 1.5 GA/PG five on five. Theyíve given up about another full goal on the PK every night. Certainly the goalies are part of that, but it speaks volumes about team 5x5 defense against PK defending. No matter who is in the box...

    You are right that +\- doesnít tell the whole story and in his case it severely undervalues Gildon. Gildon Is currently a plus-4 on the season, despite getting no credit for SIXTEEN power-play points. Meanwhile your other top two defenseman are the stalwarts on the aforementioned PK and get no negative for that units performance. Additionally, recent struggles aside, the UNH PP still rates thirteenth best in the country...

    Gildon had a better +\- than both Wyse and Maass in each of the last two seasons (and again, got no credit for seven more PPG and who knows how many PPA).

    Heís a defenseman playing huge minutes and heís on the ice for FAR more goals for than against. Period. What more should we want?

    I can review and crunch the numbers on his breakout/turnover performances over the last few games - it wasnít popular last time I did, but Iíd bet this stretch tells the same story. Which is he still handles far more breakouts than anyone else and succeeds at a notably higher rate. Itís been the case since his FR year despite a few gaffes and being held to the highest of standards. And thatís before we even get into splitting hairs between Gildon turning it over on a pass or a deke while others turn it over every bit as dangerously when they simply fire pucks up the wall or the slot. Or simply rack up failed clears because they canít skate pucks out nearly as effectively. Turnovers happen to everyone in hockey itís the nature of the game...

    I personally take heart in the fact that while heís not playing up to his own lofty standard the rest of the team is playing very well for the most part. Fair enough considering how often he has carried an extreme measure of the load...

    I donít care for any argument that tries to play armchair psychologist into what Gildon may be thinking about his pro future. We have zero insight into that possibility. We blamed Poturalski for the same thing (and argued he should be benched) when all he did for the team was score 20% of their goals and figure in half...

    It was ridiculous then and itís ridiculous now. Maybe, just maybe, he has lulls in his production because he still canít purchase a legal beer (And wonít be able too until the end of this season no matter how far they advance). Maass is a true freshman classmate, but heís nearly eight months older than Gildon. Wyse was Gildonís current age almost as soon as he stepped foot on campus. That shouldnít be forgotten...

    Also donít forget that it took Watcher pointing it out a number of weeks into the season for anyone to even acknowledge that Gildon was (at the time) playing like someone who could skate right into an NHL line-up. Playing at an elite level was just taken for granted...

    There are areas in which he needs to improve on how he has played if late. I wish that could just be stated with specifics instead of venting rants, but thatís my problem I suppose...
    Probably a little of both, Dan. I was primarily just zeroed in on the recent few games. I'm just not a big fan of +/-. Its fun for fans because it's an easily understandable metric; neutral in calculation.

    As a player, it's barely more than "entertaining", like, when you jump the bench just in time the escape a MINUS (and then get rung-up for a bad change!) Better than half the time, a plus or minus is incidental. I'd rather see stats on blocked shots, face-off wins and back-check steals, frankly -- stuff that is tracked but not easily found.

    Anyway, I'm generally aligned with your discussion (case) flow; +/- doesn't really account for all the contribution (or lack thereof). Gildon likely leads the team in TOI. The kid is an elite talent carrying the D load; 5x5 and special units. That means lots of exposure to both the good and bad things. I'd be stunned if he comes back next year. Shrunk rink or not , we're gonna miss him...

    Lastly, kinda supporting your take, I recall that a few years ago Alexander Ovechkin was like a minus-40 or something! Such a slacker...
    Shrink-The-Rink, Win a Title

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    Re: UNH Hockey: Treading Water or Trending Upward

    Quote Originally Posted by jeteye1717 View Post
    Here's some outsider scouting info. on the Friars, cribbed from Mike Peters column on ESPN.com:

    Super Sophomores Keeping Providence in the [Postseason] Discussion

    The Providence Friars could have easily taken a step back this season following key losses from a team that made it to the Frozen Four in 2019. But a pair of super sophomores took their games to another level to fill gaps left by departing players.

    Vegas Golden Knights draft pick Jack Dugan entered college after an extra year of junior hockey, was a standout freshman in 2018-19 and is now a bona fide Hobey Baker favorite as a sophomore. The Pittsburgh native is in the midst of one of the most productive college hockey seasons of the past 20 years. With 41 points through 23 games, he is the nation's scoring leader and is very near the scoring pace that Johnny Gaudreau put together during his 80-point Hobey Baker-winning campaign as a junior. Only two other players topped 80 points in the 2000s prior to Gaudreau doing so in 2013-14.

    But it isn't a one-man or one-line show. The Friars are also getting big production out of sophomore Tyce Thompson, a fourth-round draft choice of the New Jersey Devils in his third year of eligibility. Thompson is tied for the national goal-scoring lead, with 17, and is second in the nation behind Dugan, with 36 points. Then there are junior Greg Printz, sophomore defenseman Michael Callahan (Arizona Coyotes), freshman Parker Ford (2020 draft-eligible) and freshman Patrick Moynihan (Devils). Also, graduate transfer Michael Lackey has a .927 save percentage while playing in 97% of the minutes for Providence.
    Oh yeah they are loaded (as usual), well coached, the real deal. I've always loved our series with them and look forward to this weekend. More times than not we give them a game and I'm hoping for that (and more). Bring 'em on, but leave your mascot home
    Let's Go SouzaCats!

  19. #419
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    Quote Originally Posted by HockeyRef View Post
    Oh yeah they are loaded (as usual), well coached, the real deal. I've always loved our series with them and look forward to this weekend. More times than not we give them a game and I'm hoping for that (and more). Bring 'em on, but leave your mascot home
    Who will stop Jack Dugan and Tyce Thompson? And, Greg Printz and Mike Callahan?

    Did not get the tie we wanted in Bridgeport tonight, so Yukon moves up to sixth, tied with Terriors, leaving Cats and Black Bears tied for eighth. Who will join the Warriors and Catamounts on the outside looking in this season?

    Updated PWR places UNH alone in 22nd, just behind Army (who?) in 21st, separated by a mere 0.0001 in RPi. Maine, you ask? They are now all the way down to 32nd in PWR. And, earlier there was a tangential reference to Bobby V's AHA team in reference to Bridgeport; Sacred Heart is now 26nd in PWR.
    Last edited by Snively65; 01-15-2020 at 10:24 PM.

  20. #420
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    Re: UNH Hockey: Treading Water or Trending Upward

    Quote Originally Posted by bakchk20 View Post
    Probably a little of both, Dan. I was primarily just zeroed in on the recent few games. I'm just not a big fan of +/-. Its fun for fans because it's an easily understandable metric; neutral in calculation.

    As a player, it's barely more than "entertaining", like, when you jump the bench just in time the escape a MINUS (and then get rung-up for a bad change!) Better than half the time, a plus or minus is incidental. I'd rather see stats on blocked shots, face-off wins and back-check steals, frankly -- stuff that is tracked but not easily found.

    Anyway, I'm generally aligned with your discussion (case) flow; +/- doesn't really account for all the contribution (or lack thereof). Gildon likely leads the team in TOI. The kid is an elite talent carrying the D load; 5x5 and special units. That means lots of exposure to both the good and bad things. I'd be stunned if he comes back next year. Shrunk rink or not , we're gonna miss him...

    Lastly, kinda supporting your take, I recall that a few years ago Alexander Ovechkin was like a minus-40 or something! Such a slacker...
    I'll jump in here in defense of plus/minus … overall, I think it's a fairly accurate indicator of a player's all-around impact on the game. Are there situations where players get dinged unfairly, or avoid blame (or unfairly credited from an attacking standpoint)? Sure, and you guys have done a pretty good job identifying some of those situations. Small sample size, can be misleading … however, over the course of a full season (or career) I think it gives you a pretty decent picture of a player.

    As far as the Ovechkin example, I think it's actually illustrative … over the course of what's been a 15 year career up to now, he's been a consistently plus player on the plus/minus front. Yes, he did have a -35 in the 2013/2014 season, and other than that, his worst year was a -19 in his second year (2006/2007). But … guess what? Those were two of only three seasons when Washington didn't make the playoffs (they also missed when he was a rookie and posted a +2). Coincidence? Maybe … or maybe for whatever reason, Ovechkin (who's had a mercurial reputation at times in his career) just wasn't that into it during those seasons, and his taking it somewhat easy at the other end showed up?

    Having said that, he's posted a -13 so far this season - comfortably the worst on his team as I write this - but the Caps are doing just fine. I don't think anyone's looking to trade the guy out of town, let's put it that way. And if I had to guess, he'll pull that number back closer to even-up by the end of the season. Or not. But it won't change the fact that he's an elite player, no matter what plus/minus tells you, in small or larger windows of time. But it's also fair to say he's had some ups and downs in his career.

    Obviously, he's one of the best ever on the power play, which does not even register on the plus/minus. And barring injury, he'll probably become the first player ever to reach 1,000 regular season NHL goals in their career (he's almost at 700 and is still only 34 yrs. old), which is no small feat in the present-day NHL. Lots to chew on there. Now, back to your local programming …
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