Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

2020 Democratic Challengers Vi: The Undiscovered Country

Collapse
This topic is closed.
X
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Originally posted by The Rube View Post
    Those jobs are real jobs. They are honest jobs. But they are not careers, nor are they meant to be. They are starter jobs. Jobs that are meant to move into management within the same company, or to move on to other jobs with more responsibility. They are at best, "learning jobs," and at worst "supplemental income" jobs. There is no shame in having that job. NONE. But they are not meant for a career.
    Sorry but that is just wrong. I know in an ideal world with proper conditions that is how it is supposed to be but in the real world it couldn't be farther from the truth. Unless you think the 40 year old working at Speedway wants a career in putting donuts in the case. These jobs aren't starter jobs...they are "needed to get above the poverty level" jobs. Not every job is a career...

    You are basically punishing anyone who can't find a "real job" and saying they don't deserve the right to a living wage.

    And ya know...maybe if businesses hadn't been fighting this for years they could have better prepared. It isn't the workers fault the cost of living went up.

    And don't give the sad internet rebuttal about "unfilled jobs" that is on the business not the worker. Make the job worth working. Offer benefits and pay that make people want to work for you. If people would rather work at McDonald's that means you're job sucks.
    "It's as if the Drumpf Administration is made up of the worst and unfunny parts of the Cleveland Browns, Washington Generals, and the alien Mon-Stars from Space Jam."
    -aparch

    "Scenes in "Empire Strikes Back" that take place on the tundra planet Hoth were shot on the present-day site of Ralph Engelstad Arena."
    -INCH

    Of course I'm a fan of the Vikings. A sick and demented Masochist of a fan, but a fan none the less.
    -ScoobyDoo 12/17/2007

    Comment


    • Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers Vi: The Undiscovered Country

      Passing off minimum wage jobs as entry level / high school kids and thus No Real Person Involved is a time-honored tactic used to justify treating those workers like crap. Wanna have a good time with Neoliberals? Talk about a union of all minimum wage employees. The very idea that low wage workers might have representation drives them into an insane lather.
      Cornell University
      National Champion 1967, 1970
      ECAC Champion 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1973, 1980, 1986, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2005, 2010
      Ivy League Champion 1966, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1977, 1978, 1983, 1984, 1985, 1996, 1997, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2012, 2014, 2018, 2019, 2020

      Comment


      • Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers Vi: The Undiscovered Country

        At what level does a job become a career? Why should the HVAC employee be paid well when he could be an engineer who designs the systems? Why should the plumber be paid well when he could be the head of city water works?
        Go Green! Go White! Go State!

        1966, 1986, 2007

        Go Tigers, Go Packers, Go Red Wings, Go Pistons

        Comment


        • Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers Vi: The Undiscovered Country

          Originally posted by Spartanforlife4 View Post
          At what level does a job become a career? Why should the HVAC employee be paid well when he could be an engineer who designs the systems? Why should the plumber be paid well when he could be the head of city water works?
          People will define a career job like this: It's when the worker is in a place that they want to remain for an extended period of time (10+ years) without significant change. Pay and working conditions are satisfactory on all ends.

          In reality, you also have what you need to do to survive. For me, it's been in retail. I'm trying desperately to find things elsewhere, but I haven't found that line to pull myself out of the current quagmire as of yet. There are select circumstances where I'd willingly stay in retail, but those are more or less a pipe dream (I'd gladly manage a non-big box fishing/outdoor store for $14-16/hour with some schedule flexibility). But for the most part, retail is a career I'm in by default, not by choice.
          It's never too early to start the Pre-game festivities

          Go Cats!!! GO BLACKHAWKS!

          Cuck the Fubs... Let's Go WHITE SOX!!!

          Wildcat Born, Wildcat Bred....

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Spartanforlife4 View Post
            At what level does a job become a career? Why should the HVAC employee be paid well when he could be an engineer who designs the systems? Why should the plumber be paid well when he could be the head of city water works?
            No idea what the eff you're trying to get at. Not everyone wants to be, or is qualified to be an engineer or the head of a water works dept.

            And last I knew, plumbers get paid very well. Very well indeed.
            What kind of cheese are you planning to put on top?

            Comment


            • Originally posted by rufus View Post
              No idea what the eff you're trying to get at. Not everyone wants to be, or is qualified to be an engineer or the head of a water works dept.

              And last I knew, plumbers get paid very well. Very well indeed.
              (that’s the point)

              If the argument is that certain jobs shouldn’t pay a living wage because there’s something “better” to attain, then where is that line?
              Go Green! Go White! Go State!

              1966, 1986, 2007

              Go Tigers, Go Packers, Go Red Wings, Go Pistons

              Comment


              • Originally posted by spartanforlife4 View Post
                (that’s the point)

                if the argument is that certain jobs shouldn’t pay a living wage because there’s something “better” to attain, then where is that line?
                CEO.

                (Caps)
                U-A-A!!!Go!Go!GreenandGold!
                Applejack Tells You How UAA Is Doing...
                I spell Failure with UAF

                Originally posted by UAFIceAngel
                But let's be real...There are 40 some other teams and only two alaskan teams...the day one of us wins something big will be the day I transfer to UAA
                Originally posted by Doyle Woody
                Best sign by a visting Seawolf fan Friday went to a young man who held up a piece of white poster board that read: "YOU CAN'T SPELL FAILURE WITHOUT UAF."

                Comment


                • Originally posted by rufus View Post
                  No idea what the eff you're trying to get at. Not everyone wants to be, or is qualified to be an engineer or the head of a water works dept.
                  I think that’s the point.

                  Comment


                  • Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers Vi: The Undiscovered Country

                    Originally posted by Spartanforlife4 View Post
                    At what level does a job become a career? Why should the HVAC employee be paid well when he could be an engineer who designs the systems? Why should the plumber be paid well when he could be the head of city water works?
                    I can't speak to the rest of the country, but my brother is an HVAC guy, and he's done quite well for himself, attaining a master's certification. Around here, the Pipefitter's Union handles both plumbers and HVAC fields. Here's a good estimates of the hourly wages he gets (he's on the high end), and this does not include benefits, which are another 50-60% of his wages. LINK.

                    From the stories I've heard, they're paid well because when they're installing roof top heaters and A/C units, either the engineers or the manufacturing plant have fouled them up so much that they require a massive overhaul just to work.

                    And he didn't get an engineering degree because he couldn't hack it in a classroom. He does quite well when you put a tool in his hand, though. It's almost savant-like, what he can do with something mechanical.
                    "The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." George Orwell, 1984

                    "One does not simply walk into Mordor. Its Black Gates are guarded by more than just Orcs. There is evil there that does not sleep, and the Great Eye is ever watchful. It is a barren wasteland, riddled with fire and ash and dust, the very air you breathe is a poisonous fume." Boromir

                    "Good news! We have a delivery." Professor Farnsworth

                    Comment


                    • Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers Vi: The Undiscovered Country

                      Originally posted by St. Clown View Post
                      I can't speak to the rest of the country, but my brother is an HVAC guy, and he's done quite well for himself, attaining a master's certification. Around here, the Pipefitter's Union handles both plumbers and HVAC fields. Here's a good estimates of the hourly wages he gets (he's on the high end), and this does not include benefits, which are another 50-60% of his wages. LINK.

                      From the stories I've heard, they're paid well because when they're installing roof top heaters and A/C units, either the engineers or the manufacturing plant have fouled them up so much that they require a massive overhaul just to work.

                      And he didn't get an engineering degree because he couldn't hack it in a classroom. He does quite well when you put a tool in his hand, though. It's almost savant-like, what he can do with something mechanical.
                      They get paid well because not everyone can or wants do their job just like any other profession.
                      I swear there ain't no heaven but I pray there ain't no hell.

                      Maine Hockey Love it or Leave it

                      Comment


                      • Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers Vi: The Undiscovered Country

                        Originally posted by walrus View Post
                        They get paid well because not everyone can or wants do their job just like any other profession.
                        Right. My point is this, though: they get paid well, much better than the average person in my office building, because their skillset is rarer than most other peoples'. Don't get me wrong, there are people here earning well over what the Pipefitters Union members are earning, but the mead/median/mode are likely all below the union's labor rates - especially with the benefits package. And most of the people here paid for a 4-yr degree while my brother attended the vo-tech school for two years.

                        Then again, it's always 72F and fluorescent in my office building, not raining, blistering hot, or mind-numbingly cold like the union guys face.
                        "The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." George Orwell, 1984

                        "One does not simply walk into Mordor. Its Black Gates are guarded by more than just Orcs. There is evil there that does not sleep, and the Great Eye is ever watchful. It is a barren wasteland, riddled with fire and ash and dust, the very air you breathe is a poisonous fume." Boromir

                        "Good news! We have a delivery." Professor Farnsworth

                        Comment


                        • Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers Vi: The Undiscovered Country

                          Anybody here want to teach school? They face difficult conditions and they aren't paid jack sh-t.

                          Rarity of skill is only one of several causes of salary. Unpleasant work tends to pay terribly even though most people aren't willing to do it. The major driver of salary is status, unless very strong unions are involved. The rich control compensation and rig it to compensate themselves the most. It's exactly like feudalism.

                          Science and sports are meritocratic. Everything else is naked power.
                          Cornell University
                          National Champion 1967, 1970
                          ECAC Champion 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1973, 1980, 1986, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2005, 2010
                          Ivy League Champion 1966, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1977, 1978, 1983, 1984, 1985, 1996, 1997, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2012, 2014, 2018, 2019, 2020

                          Comment


                          • Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers Vi: The Undiscovered Country

                            Blitzkrieg on Warren tonight. Everyone trying to get a piece of her.
                            Go Green! Go White! Go State!

                            1966, 1986, 2007

                            Go Tigers, Go Packers, Go Red Wings, Go Pistons

                            Comment


                            • Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers Vi: The Undiscovered Country

                              I LOVE Warren’s plan to require 40% of the board be elected by employees. I didn’t know this was part of her plan for years.
                              Code:
                              As of 9/21/10:         As of 9/13/10:
                              College Hockey 6       College Football 0
                              BTHC 4                 WCHA FC:  1
                              Originally posted by SanTropez
                              May your paint thinner run dry and the fleas of a thousand camels infest your dead deer.
                              Originally posted by bigblue_dl
                              I don't even know how to classify magic vagina smoke babies..
                              Originally posted by Kepler
                              When the giraffes start building radio telescopes they can join too.
                              He's probably going to be a superstar but that man has more baggage than North West

                              Comment


                              • Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers Vi: The Undiscovered Country

                                Why doesn't Steyer's face move?
                                Go Green! Go White! Go State!

                                1966, 1986, 2007

                                Go Tigers, Go Packers, Go Red Wings, Go Pistons

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X