2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

[trixR4kids]

Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

Yeah nobody outside of me can see that Biden's surrogates have been telling everyone that M4A would take away their healthcare and give it to illegal aliens (which totally isn't racist).

[Kepler]

Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

Yeah nobody outside of me can see that Biden's surrogates have been telling everyone that M4A would take away their healthcare and give it to illegal aliens (which totally isn't racist).

That's always how the game is played. Carter did that to Ted Kennedy. Bill Clinton did it to Gore of all people.

Centrists have huge systemic advantages in the Democratic domination process. Some are cynical: the deliberate forestalling of a true left in this country by corporate and wealthy interests who have gained a lot of access and power in the DNC through their wealth. Some aren't so much insidious as psychological: Boomer liberals have been terminally deprived of any spine or bravery by what happened to them in their formative years in the 1980s. They are, not to put too fine a point on it, p-ssies.

But the Boomers are dying off. The wealthy ticks will be with us until we methodically burn them off, which will happen under Bernie and perhaps even under Warren.

The days of the Alexandria Yacht Club running the DNC may be about over.

[Rover]

Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

Yeah nobody outside of me can see that Biden's surrogates have been telling everyone that M4A would take away their healthcare and give it to illegal aliens (which totally isn't racist).

I'd ask you to point out those surrogates so I could see if they're as ridiculous as well known Bernie surrogate Susan Sarandon, but we know how that'll end up. So, lets move on. What you and your ilk need to realize is that what's popular with the Bernie crowd isn't necessarily popular with the rest of the Dems or the general electorate. If they were, Bernie would be leading right now the nomination unless Debbie Wasserman Schultz is doing her evil genius thing again!

So, here's the deal. Dems 1) like Barack Obama and his policies, 2) want to expand the ACA over M4A, 3) aren't on board with open borders, 4) Don't want to raise taxes on the middle class. Now I'm going to go cash my checks from the fossil fuel industry and corporate centrist think tanks so I'll be back in a little bit, but I'd like those points to penetrate your skull a little by the time I return!

[trixR4kids]

Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

Ah yes, ACA was so popular after it was clearly going to be replaced by nothing, which proves that people were happy that their health insurance costs were still rising and people loved going into medical bankruptcy. Let's not act like you're talking to anyone outside the donor class and people making under 100k when you're making these assessments. Also literally no candidate wants "open borders" but nice job with that Fox News talking point. And even if the middle class's taxes get raised we all know having zero deductibles, copays, or denial of insurance will easily make up for that and most people will come out ahead under that proposal but we all know you aren't capable of arguing in good faith on literally any topic.

But anyhow way to shift the argument after it's clear that Biden's surrogates are being racist as he!! and I don't think anyone has forgotten about him reminiscing on the good ol' days of working with segregationists.

[Rover]

Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

Ah yes, ACA was so popular after it was clearly going to be replaced by nothing, which proves that people were happy that their health insurance costs were still rising and people loved going into medical bankruptcy. Let's not act like you're talking to anyone outside the donor class and people making under 100k when you're making these assessments.

Its not my fault that you can't get a decent paying job. Try not to project next time, okay? I will note though that as a party of educated people with its strengths in high paying coastal areas you'd be wise not to demonize everybody who's making six figures for a living....

[trixR4kids]

Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

Right, except I didn't do that and your reading comprehension needs work.

[Rover]

Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

Right, except I didn't do that and your reading comprehension needs work.

What part of raising taxes on the middle class is a political loser are you not understanding? Any money you plan on raising from them would be better gotten by shifting an even higher burden onto the super rich. That's what people want, not tax hikes on the 50K and up crowd. You're asking people to give you a 100 bucks today in exchange for 120 bucks next year, while at the same time having the Republicans not exploit the middle class' economic fears or if they do don't worry because the media will tell the truth about GOP lies. Good luck with all that.

[trixR4kids]

Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

What do you not understand about the average person coming out ahead under M4A? If people no longer have to pay premiums and no longer have a deductible, no longer have the threat of medical bankruptcy, no copays, drug costs go down drastically, and your healthcare isn't tied to your job, even if middle class taxes went up slightly the average person would come out ahead. This isn't even remotely difficult to comprehend.

[Kepler]

Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

He and his friends can't make money off it. He's not interested.

[trixR4kids]

Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

He and his friends can't make money off it. He's not interested.

I mean I think we all know that's the answer but it becomes more obvious when he belittles anyone who makes under 100k as if that's anywhere near what the average worker makes in this country.

[Kepler]

Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

I mean I think we all know that's the answer but it becomes more obvious when he belittles anyone who makes under 100k as if that's anywhere near what the average worker makes in this country.

Yep. $100k was the 70th percentile for American households for 2017 incomes.

According to this,

The Bureau of Labor Statistics reported a median personal income of $865 weekly for all full-time workers in 2017. The U.S Bureau of the Census has the annual median personal income at $31,099 in 2016.

Source.

Not everybody lives in DC, NYC, or San Francisco. Most people are hurting. Real inflation-adjusted personal income has stagnated in the United States since we began to pull back from the New Deal / Great Society in the 1970s. Meanwhile productivity, profits, and the income and wealth of the 1% have gone through the roof.

The rich have stolen tens of trillions of dollars from the middle class, and unless we peacefully repatriate that money to the people who earned it, history shows it will happen eventually through bloodshed.

[Rover]

Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

What do you not understand about the average person coming out ahead under M4A? If people no longer have to pay premiums and no longer have a deductible, no longer have the threat of medical bankruptcy, no copays, drug costs go down drastically, and your healthcare isn't tied to your job, even if middle class taxes went up slightly the average person would come out ahead. This isn't even remotely difficult to comprehend.

Because people don't live in your Bernie world. There's no reason to tax the middle class for M4A when you can get the same $$$ from the rich instead. Astounding that you're too dumb to figure this out. DO NOT RAISE TAXES ON THE MIDDLE CLASS OR THEY WILL VOTE GOP! Few people give a flying fuk about your pie in the sky ideal world. Do all of the things you'd like, but get the revenue from the rich, not the little guy. Get it?

[SJHovey]

Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

The days of the Alexandria Yacht Club running the DNC may be about over.

There have been a lot of predictions/prognostications thrown about over the years here in Cafe, but I personally think this one is the least likely to occur.

[Kepler]

Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

There's no reason to tax the middle class for M4A when you can get the same $$$ from the rich instead. Astounding that you're too dumb to figure this out. DO NOT RAISE TAXES ON THE MIDDLE CLASS OR THEY WILL VOTE GOP!

This is a conflation of two completely different things.

M4A is a program.

How you pay for it is a separate mechanism.

Personally, I would cut taxes on all wage intervals across the board until you hit $1M, then go to 50%, 70% above $10M and 90% above $100M.

[Kepler]

Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

There have been a lot of predictions/prognostications thrown about over the years here in Cafe, but I personally think this one is the least likely to occur.

But, to be fair, you need it not to come true. Because if it does then one of your favorite excuses for continuing to vote for the Nazis -- that both parties are co-opted -- goes away.