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Thread: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

    Quote Originally Posted by FadeToBlack&Gold View Post
    Agreed. Ohio is part of Dumb-Dumb Land for the foreseeable future though.
    I would definitely downgrade Ohio vs some of the other states. I base that on the state party having like zero presence anywhere for statewide races. Far different from places like IA, NC, MI, WI and PA where the Dems control some or in the case of the latter 3 all statewide offices (non-judiciary). Ohio Dems need to start from scratch, and this is one of those places where progressives should try to gain a foothold. There's nowhere to go but up, so see if voters there want a helping of democratic socialism!
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

    Quote Originally Posted by FadeToBlack&Gold View Post
    Agreed. Ohio is part of Dumb-Dumb Land for the foreseeable future though.
    As is North Carolina, Georgia, and Texas.
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

    Quote Originally Posted by Rover View Post
    I would definitely downgrade Ohio vs some of the other states. I base that on the state party having like zero presence anywhere for statewide races. Far different from places like IA, NC, MI, WI and PA where the Dems control some or in the case of the latter 3 all statewide offices (non-judiciary). Ohio Dems need to start from scratch, and this is one of those places where progressives should try to gain a foothold. There's nowhere to go but up, so see if voters there want a helping of democratic socialism!
    Unfortunately Whitmer is proving to be a boring conservadem governor thus far, in part because she has to work with a legislature full of Nazis, but unlike trix I'm OK with that. The State Dems need to make a hard push to win State Rep/Senate seats and local races in 2020.
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    Quote Originally Posted by FadeToBlack&Gold View Post
    Unfortunately Whitmer is proving to be a boring conservadem governor thus far, in part because she has to work with a legislature full of Nazis, but unlike trix I'm OK with that. The State Dems need to make a hard push to win State Rep/Senate seats and local races in 2020.
    Exactly! The GOP ascendancy was/is due to their concentration on local/state races. The Ds looked at DC as the big prize and oopsed.

    You've realized that error and moved to correct it. Good.

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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

    Quote Originally Posted by joecct View Post
    Exactly! The GOP ascendancy was/is due to their concentration on local/state races. The Ds looked at DC as the big prize and oopsed.

    You've realized that error and moved to correct it. Good.
    Umm Joe, I've realized this error for several years now. It's the State Dem parties who need to get a fooking clue.
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

    Quote Originally Posted by FadeToBlack&Gold View Post
    It's the State Dem parties who need to get a fooking clue.
    It wasn't the states, the states were (and always are) screaming for support. Support is driven by the national party and the national party under both Clinton and Obama was very bad about supporting state and local. Under Clinton it was because everything was for the Greater Glory of Clinton. Under Obama it was because the nuts and bolts people in the DNC were still Clintonistas and they were prepping for Hillary, and the Obama people never did figure out what they were doing.

    I don't know whether it's gotten any better to be honest. I do know that on activist sites like Kos it's all anyone ever talks about these days, so that's a good sign.

    I think this is yet another thing in America that is improving exactly proportionately to the death rate of Boomers.
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

    No offense but I put zero stock in anything that is bandied about on Daily Kos.

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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

    Quote Originally Posted by Handyman View Post
    No offense but I put zero stock in anything that is bandied about on Daily Kos.
    Especially if there's weird azz chit about somehow the DNC under Obama was really working for Hillary Clinton?

    Look, I thought Obama was a great Prez, but he had two flaws. One was that it took too long for the laws he passed to actually get implemented. The second was his total inattention to politics as he perceived himself as a post-partisan President. Such a thing doesn't exist as he found out the hard way and way too late. That's on him and the dead-enders like Rahm Emmanuel and Tom Daschle that he chose to keep employed.
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

    LOL what?

    Rahm was only on staff for 21 months before he bailed to run for Mayor of Chicago.

    Before that, he spent six years as a US Rep for Illinois.

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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

    Quote Originally Posted by aparch View Post
    LOL what?

    Rahm was only on staff for 21 months before he bailed to run for Mayor of Chicago.

    Before that, he spent six years as a US Rep for Illinois.
    Rahm has been a failure in every job he's had and his intense rivalry with Howard Dean, who was the best DNC chairman ever, caused Dean to be blocked out of any role in the Obama admin or subsequent Dem campaigns. An absolute disastrous decision that Obama must unfortunately own despite the many good things that he did.
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

    Quote Originally Posted by Handyman View Post
    No offense but I put zero stock in anything that is bandied about on Daily Kos.
    I'm not talking about Kos himself or the featured diarists, some of whom are execrable, and I'm not talking about the yahoo posters. I'm talking about the workshops and activist threads where the work gets done. Those are the people actually making things happen at the grassroots and they are well aware that we need to build state and local and contest everywhere. It's a big improvement.

    As with everything else, the topline is always the last to know. By the time a campaign, let alone the DNC, let alone the media, is talking about something the ship has long sailed. Those folks are like CEOs, they stand around and preen and take credit. The real work has been done for years in the trenches by obscure people who will never be interviewed and who have long since graduated past anybody's Kool Aid. And those people, right now and for the past couple years, have been busting their butts building local Democratic organizations, recruiting, registering voters, building databases, getting people used to volunteering, educating people.

    Can't hurt.
    Last edited by Kepler; 08-16-2019 at 11:57 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by FadeToBlack&Gold View Post
    Umm Joe, I've realized this error for several years now. It's the State Dem parties who need to get a fooking clue.
    Sorry, the plural you, not singular. Vous instead of tu.

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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

    Quote Originally Posted by Kepler View Post
    I'm not talking about Kos himself or the featured diarists, some of whom are execrable, and I'm not talking about the yahoo posters. I'm talking about the workshops and activist threads where the work gets done. Those are the people actually making things happen at the grassroots and they are well aware that we need to build state and local and contest everywhere. It's a big improvement.

    As with everything else, the topline is always the last to know. By the time a campaign, let alone the DNC, let alone the media, is talking about something the ship has long sailed. Those folks are like CEOs, they stand around and preen and take credit. The real work has been done for years in the trenches by obscure people who will never be interviewed and who have long since graduated past anybody's Kool Aid. And those people, right now and for the past couple years, have been busting their butts building local Democratic organizations, recruiting, registering voters, building databases, getting people used to volunteering, educating people.

    Can't hurt.
    Eh still too out there for me. And seeing as it is often the go to source for the wackadoo Lefty wing doesnt help.
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

    Quote Originally Posted by Handyman View Post
    Eh still too out there for me. And seeing as it is often the go to source for the wackadoo Lefty wing doesnt help.
    You know the joke: it's broad and deep.

    There are parts of Kos I don't go near without a HAZMAT suit. There are diarists on Kos who, and I know you'll be shocked to hear this, I have completely alienated because I am "too economically deterministic" and others I have completely alienated because I am "too driven by spiritual considerations." Like any big group the attendees are a Gaussian distribution and at least a third of them are worthless. But there are also fantastic people there -- nuanced, introspective, experienced, above all active. Unlike most of the internet the gasbag-to-producer ratio there is only about 100:1 whereas most places it's in the thousands.
    Last edited by Kepler; 08-19-2019 at 10:34 AM.
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

    Just curious. I watch the national political news pretty closely.

    Has the Republican Party floated a single idea worth voting for this cycle? If they have I haven't heard one. All I've heard them do (Chaffetz this morning for example) is complain about how far left the Democrats have drifted. Which I personally find hilarious because there is nothing left about any of it. Every position Warren and Sanders support is a centrist position, not a far left one. Far left would be true communism or true socialism. None of that exists in any of their policy ideas.

    Meanwhile there is massive amounts of fascism in the Republican platform. Massive. Not only has the power of the Presidency increased 20 fold under Trump, the AG if he is in lock step with the President he/she is under has increased in power by 40 fold.

    That's pure fascism on a grand scale.

    I'm open to what ideas Republicans actually have for the country but I haven't heard any yet.
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

    Quote Originally Posted by ScoobyDoo View Post
    I'm open to what ideas Republicans actually have for the country but I haven't heard any yet.
    Once they get rid of everyone who isn't white skinned and prefers the opposite sex, they'll see where they stand then.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ScoobyDoo View Post
    Just curious. I watch the national political news pretty closely.

    Has the Republican Party floated a single idea worth voting for this cycle? If they have I haven't heard one.
    This is a great question, worth asking of everyone as food for thought, and the answer is clearly no. But they do have some big ideas: deregulation of everything, destroying the federal government from within, burning up every scrap of fossil fuel that can be located, glorifying Donald Trump for all eternity as His true and faithful worshippers, disseminating guns & ammo, stepping on the necks of the lower class.
    I refuse to believe a majority will vote for more of this.

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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

    stay the course
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

    Quote Originally Posted by ScoobyDoo View Post
    Just curious. I watch the national political news pretty closely.

    Has the Republican Party floated a single idea worth voting for this cycle? If they have I haven't heard one. All I've heard them do (Chaffetz this morning for example) is complain about how far left the Democrats have drifted. Which I personally find hilarious because there is nothing left about any of it. Every position Warren and Sanders support is a centrist position, not a far left one. Far left would be true communism or true socialism. None of that exists in any of their policy ideas.

    Meanwhile there is massive amounts of fascism in the Republican platform. Massive. Not only has the power of the Presidency increased 20 fold under Trump, the AG if he is in lock step with the President he/she is under has increased in power by 40 fold.

    That's pure fascism on a grand scale.

    I'm open to what ideas Republicans actually have for the country but I haven't heard any yet.
    Anything the Dems want? We are not wanting that! And we aren't Hillary! 'Murica!

    I think that's about it. I think that is all they can comprehend.
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers IV: Culling the Herd

    Quote Originally Posted by geezer View Post
    This is a great question, worth asking of everyone as food for thought, and the answer is clearly no. But they do have some big ideas: deregulation of everything, destroying the federal government from within, burning up every scrap of fossil fuel that can be located, glorifying Donald Trump for all eternity as His true and faithful worshippers, disseminating guns & ammo, stepping on the necks of the lower class.
    I refuse to believe a majority will vote for more of this.
    I doubt a majority will. If a majority actually believed in the republican platform of racism and hypocrisy we'd already have had the second civil war.

    Our problem is that too many believe in it. Look at the damage done by it. Through gerrymandering, weak kneed democrats and treasonous republicans, they've allowed somewhere between 30%-40% of voters to dictate to the rest of us and propagate hate and division.

    My guess is unless you see an overwhelming response in 2020 (huge gains in the Senate, winning the White House picking up even more suburban and exurban HOuse seats and continued success by democrats in more states like we saw in 2018) we will simply return to the gridlock we have seen in our politics for more than a generation now.

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