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Thread: World Soccer XXIX: Pro/Rel USA! just kidding!

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    Re: World Soccer XXIX: Pro/Rel USA! just kidding!

    Quote Originally Posted by The Rube View Post
    I have no idea, either, but salary/bonuses should be based on revenue earned, regardless of gender. See also: women's hockey or WNBA.
    not sure mookie would use "should", as that is a code word which can be twisted... but rube is right. the pay comes out of the pot. if one wants more pay, generate more revenue. just on its face, mookie can't see tv revenue being equal for men and women for the wc. if it is however, let's cut the check
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    Quote Originally Posted by MinnesotaNorthStar View Post
    Which would then beg the question, would the women draw as much as the men at the higher price?

    (FTR...I have no idea)
    According to the 2018 numbers the WNT was drawing around 10k less on average.

    WNT 2018
    MNT 2018

    I will say this. One of the biggest beliefs among the WNT players and the WoSo community, and where these lawsuits and ďEqual Pay!Ē come from, is that the Men are cashing in on the Womenís success and the USSF is constantly screwing them out of ďtheirĒ money. Most famously was after 99 and MLS offered to help run a WMLS with the players, the players basically told them to f- off, youíre not leeching off of us and founded WUSA. Of course WUSA folded in 2003 while MLS contracted in 2001 but expanded in 2004.

    The reality of all this? Itís everything in the US leeches off of Mexico. Thatís why thereís a friendly every year against them. Thatís why most of sponsors are with US Soccer. Thatís why Mexico plays all their friendlies in the US. Thatís why Liga MX is the most watched league in the US. Everything starts with Mexico.

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    Re: World Soccer XXIX: Pro/Rel USA! just kidding!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jimjamesak View Post


    :facepalm:

    I would like to congratulate Mexico and Canada on their wonderful joint hosting effort of the 2026 World Cup.
    What do they mean by equal pay? From NT participation or all in all? imho league salaries should not factor into it at all especially since revenues from the men's league dwarfs that of the women, and many of the men are not being paid via MLS but from European leauges.

    What was the average income per player from NT activities in 2018 for both? How about average NT income from NT appearances? Not sure I've ever seen this publicized.

    [edit] This is likely a factor in their consternation.

    During World Cup Years, the Max Earnings for the USMNT Is Estimated at $1.1 Million While It Is $200,000 for the USWNT
    The Guardian conducted a study on the pay discrepancies between the menís and womenís U.S. teams. With a World Cup win, the max earnings for a USWNT player is $200,000, while a USMNT player could earn $1.1 million with a title. The USWNT would also get a four-game victory tour which means players would earn an additional $60,869, per The Guardian.

    The massive difference in World Cup pay is somewhat tied to the disparity in FIFA purses. France earned $38 million for winning the 2018 World Cup, while the USA received $4 million for their 2019 win. This number is double the $2 million the USWNT earned after their 2015 World Cup title.
    Ok but that's a FIFA "problem" not a UNST problem and again I imagine total revenues from the men's WC is immensely higher than for the women's. So tough ***ties if you will.
    Last edited by Slap Shot; 07-10-2019 at 02:32 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jerphisch View Post
    Because FIFA pays the players directly, or because FIFA is US Soccer's sole source of income?
    Because FIFA sets the payouts for world cup competitions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Slap Shot View Post
    What do they mean by equal pay? From NT participation or all in all? imho league salaries should not factor into it at all especially since revenues from the men's league dwarfs that of the women, and many of the men are not being paid via MLS but from European leauges.

    What was the average income per player from NT activities in 2018 for both? How about average NT income from NT appearances? Not sure I've ever seen this publicized.

    [edit] This is likely a factor in their consternation.



    Ok but that's a FIFA "problem" not a UNST problem and again I imagine total revenues from the men's WC is immensely higher than for the women's. So tough ***ties if you will.
    The biggest thing is we donít really know what people mean by ďequal payĒ since none of the people talking about it have said any specifics.

    The only thing we really have in the players lawsuit against the USSF for sex discrimination. Hereís a breakdown but itís an article from The Athletic:
    https://theathletic.com/864905/2019/...ual-treatment/

    The way I read it is the players want their cake and to eat it too, i.e. they want their yearly salary (plus benefits and guaranteed roster slot and guaranteed NWSL salary) AND the same bonus amounts as the men.

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    Quote Originally Posted by unofan View Post
    Because FIFA sets the payouts for world cup competitions.
    In fairness to this, I donít think itís unreasonable to say that FIFA should increase the payout amounts to a level closer to the Menís tournament despite the revenue differences as FIFA can afford it.

    Now, as to how that money is spent is a different debate (with people like me who believe that money should go toward the NWSL and professional development).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimjamesak View Post
    In fairness to this, I donít think itís unreasonable to say that FIFA should increase the payout amounts to a level closer to the Menís tournament despite the revenue differences as FIFA can afford it.

    Now, as to how that money is spent is a different debate (with people like me who believe that money should go toward the NWSL and professional development).
    Evidently they will be increasing payouts for the next World Cup, as well as expanding it. Iím not sure if expanding is the best answer, as North Korea was the only team that really felt left out. Idk if adding three more UEFA, Mexico, and the other confederations will help, but I suppose exposure canít be a bad thing.

    I also saw that if women were paid in ratio to menís ratings, the US should have won around 110 million rather than 30 million. FIFA estimates 1 billion viewers compared to 3.6 billion for the men.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimjamesak View Post
    In fairness to this, I donít think itís unreasonable to say that FIFA should increase the payout amounts to a level closer to the Menís tournament despite the revenue differences as FIFA can afford it.
    Right. But the people to ***** to about that is FIFA, not US Soccer. Blaming US Soccer for not giving the women higher World Cup payouts is going after the wrong entity.

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    Re: World Soccer XXIX: Pro/Rel USA! just kidding!

    Quote Originally Posted by unofan View Post
    Right. But the people to ***** to about that is FIFA, not US Soccer. Blaming US Soccer for not giving the women higher World Cup payouts is going after the wrong entity.
    There's some logic to this. Bear with me.

    1. Most obviously this is empty political posturing so it doesn't matter if it's effective. It's designed to goose some cynical pol's chick cred.

    2. In a situation in which you have no leverage over the entity that actually sets the rates (FIFA) but you do have some leverage over a connecting entity (USA Soccer), go ahead and make life unpleasant for the latter. That incentifies them to try to do something. Boycott WalMart to get China to relax child slavery.

    But, mostly, 1.
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    Re: World Soccer XXIX: Pro/Rel USA! just kidding!

    I think the simple answer is to go to a structure where they each get similar pay/bonuses/per diems etc with the National Team but USSF gives each NWSL team so much money towards their player salary budget. That way the players are paid similarly for their NT team but USSF is still helping to keep NWSL from going under and investing in that league so it can grow.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shirtless Guy View Post
    I think the simple answer is to go to a structure where they each get similar pay/bonuses/per diems etc with the National Team but USSF gives each NWSL team so much money towards their player salary budget. That way the players are paid similarly for their NT team but USSF is still helping to keep NWSL from going under and investing in that league so it can grow.
    Except the USSF offered that in the last CBA negotiation and the players refused.

    Thatís thing with the WNT, theyíre an onion. On the surface they seem wholesome and heroic, peel back a few layers and you see theyíre a selfish bunch that care not about growing the game but only lining their pockets.

    And theyíre really good at controlling the narrative.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kepler View Post
    There's some logic to this. Bear with me.

    1. Most obviously this is empty political posturing so it doesn't matter if it's effective. It's designed to goose some cynical pol's chick cred.

    2. In a situation in which you have no leverage over the entity that actually sets the rates (FIFA) but you do have some leverage over a connecting entity (USA Soccer), go ahead and make life unpleasant for the latter. That incentifies them to try to do something. Boycott WalMart to get China to relax child slavery.

    But, mostly, 1.
    They donít really have any leverage over the USSF. Theyíve threatened a strike a few times and balked every time. Inside they know that a replacement team would likely still medal (the player pool is that deep) and that would not help their cause.

    Though I would honestly love to see that scenario happen.

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    Re: World Soccer XXIX: Pro/Rel USA! just kidding!

    Quote Originally Posted by Kepler View Post
    1. Most obviously this is empty political posturing so it doesn't matter if it's effective. It's designed to goose some cynical pol's chick cred.
    Like Joe Manchin...

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    Re: World Soccer XXIX: Pro/Rel USA! just kidding!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jimjamesak View Post
    They donít really have any leverage over the USSF. Theyíve threatened a strike a few times and balked every time. Inside they know that a replacement team would likely still medal (the player pool is that deep) and that would not help their cause.

    Though I would honestly love to see that scenario happen.
    I think he meant Congress, not the players. In this case Joe Manchin (D-WV), which reflexively causes me to question the motives behind the move.

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    Re: World Soccer XXIX: Pro/Rel USA! just kidding!

    On the Menís front, CONCACAF announced the new WCQ format:


    Translation: https://youtu.be/0BoO3_5tU8A

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    Re: World Soccer XXIX: Pro/Rel USA! just kidding!

    Does mean mean Canada is ranked 7th

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    Re: World Soccer XXIX: Pro/Rel USA! just kidding!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jimjamesak View Post
    On the Menís front, CONCACAF announced the new WCQ format:


    Translation: https://youtu.be/0BoO3_5tU8A
    So god forbid the cutoff between 6 and 7 is very close? I like that they found a way to keep the hex, but the fact that the other 30ish teams are playing for a quarter shot at making the world cup seems a little too low...
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    Re: World Soccer XXIX: Pro/Rel USA! just kidding!

    Why don't we just have an auto bid for the US and then a tournament for who plays Mexico for the other one?

    That's the way to squeeze the most ad dollars out of this, right?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kepler View Post
    Why don't we just have an auto bid for the US and then a tournament for who plays Mexico for the other one?

    That's the way to squeeze the most ad dollars out of this, right?
    Gotta get some bucks to pay he broads....

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    Re: World Soccer XXIX: Pro/Rel USA! just kidding!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jimjamesak View Post
    On the Men’s front, CONCACAF announced the new WCQ format:


    Translation: https://youtu.be/0BoO3_5tU8A
    I guess it's good that we don't have to worry about stubbing our toe at some random Caribbean away match pre-Hex and putting the whole thing in question. But overall it's the same 6 teams for the 3.5 spots so nothing different really...
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