Page 25 of 26 FirstFirst ... 151617181920212223242526 LastLast
Results 481 to 500 of 514

Thread: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!

  1. #481
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Aug 1999
    Posts
    7,560
    Quote Originally Posted by MissThundercat View Post
    My paid job is Tyson Foods in Zeeland, MI. I asked the chaplain (basically a counselor) to write a letter of reference for me for Every Woman's Place, a domestic violence/sexual assault/human trafficking women's shelter that I interviewed at for an internship.
    Oh, ok. I read chaplain in the religious leader sense and I thought I had remembered that you worked for a large commercial company, so it confused me.

  2. #482
    If Only You Knew MissThundercat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    At a Coffee Shop or out running
    Posts
    41,942

    Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!

    Either way, all ends well. I got my three letters of reference, and the chaplain and I are done, even if that's going to suck for a little while.
    twitter: PipersHouse920, instagram: bobambermarie
    “Don't bend; don't water it down; don't try to make it logical; don't edit your own soul according to the fashion. Rather, follow your most intense obsessions mercilessly.”
    ― Franz Kafka
    Adventures With Amber Marie

  3. #483
    If Only You Knew MissThundercat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    At a Coffee Shop or out running
    Posts
    41,942

    Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!

    Oh my gravy, I told this woman I got the internship regardless of what she thought. She's "happy." Woman, you told me I wasn't qualified because I wasn't a cis female.

    I thought about complaining to HR, but I have a hunch they'll tell me to settle it with her. So I'll tell her she's bad and she should feel bad.
    twitter: PipersHouse920, instagram: bobambermarie
    “Don't bend; don't water it down; don't try to make it logical; don't edit your own soul according to the fashion. Rather, follow your most intense obsessions mercilessly.”
    ― Franz Kafka
    Adventures With Amber Marie

  4. #484

    Join Date
    Nov 1999
    Location
    My god. It’s full of stars.
    Posts
    67,342

    Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!

    Quote Originally Posted by SJHovey View Post
    Oh, ok. I read chaplain in the religious leader sense and I thought I had remembered that you worked for a large commercial company, so it confused me.
    It's weird, you were right. It sounds like big companies in the south and prairie started doing this about 20 years ago to CYA in case there were in-plant incidents and they didn't offer any kind of psychological counseling. Their employees are used to Jesus so they went with Jesus. I'm surprised they didn't use NASCAR.

    Meh. Can't hurt, I suppose. It's an endorsement of religion but whatever, they're private they can put a Satan statue in the lobby if they want.
    Cornell University
    NCAA Champion 1967, 1970
    ECAC Champion 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1973, 1980, 1986, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2005, 2010
    Ivy League Champion 1966, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1977, 1978, 1983, 1984, 1985, 1996, 1997, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2012, 2014, 2018, 2019

  5. #485
    If Only You Knew MissThundercat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    At a Coffee Shop or out running
    Posts
    41,942

    Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!

    This is the email I sent back to her:

    Judy,

    I don't think you understand.

    You denied a letter of recommendation to me because I'm not a cis female. I asked if it was because I wasn't raised as/socialized as a female, and you didn't answer. You're supposed to be the person I ask at Tyson for references like these, and now I doubt I can go to you for another reference in the future, all because I'm not a cis female.

    For the past few days, I've been struggling with this. I seriously doubt I can trust you again, and I believe this contributes to a more hostile work environment for me. HR keeps telling me they don't need education or sensitivity training on LGBTQ issues, but I believe you all sincerely do. I've been willing to talk with all of you, but you don't want to listen.

    I also thought about bringing this to the new HR manager or to Eric Safin, but I feel they would tell me to settle it with you first, just like everything else there. I'm fortunate my pastor, a board member from OOTL, and my former supervisor at Faithful to Felines cat shelter all stepped up to write these letters, because if the third letter hinged on you, I'd have been doomed. I was looking forward to coming back, but now, I don't know. Andy, Donna, and Alicia all keep telling me to see you with issues, but now I don't know. Because I'm not cis.

    And for the record, I didn't write this in haste or in anger. I wrote this with time and with sadness.

    Have a day.
    twitter: PipersHouse920, instagram: bobambermarie
    “Don't bend; don't water it down; don't try to make it logical; don't edit your own soul according to the fashion. Rather, follow your most intense obsessions mercilessly.”
    ― Franz Kafka
    Adventures With Amber Marie

  6. #486
    If Only You Knew MissThundercat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    At a Coffee Shop or out running
    Posts
    41,942

    Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!

    Quote Originally Posted by Kepler View Post
    It's weird, you were right. It sounds like big companies in the south and prairie started doing this about 20 years ago to CYA in case there were in-plant incidents and they didn't offer any kind of psychological counseling. Their employees are used to Jesus so they went with Jesus. I'm surprised they didn't use NASCAR.

    Meh. Can't hurt, I suppose. It's an endorsement of religion but whatever, they're private they can put a Satan statue in the lobby if they want.
    This one is low-key on the religion; she is a Christian but isn't forceful with it. Still, I don't know if you read what I wrote to her, but if this is the way she's going to behave, she is bad and she should feel bad.
    twitter: PipersHouse920, instagram: bobambermarie
    “Don't bend; don't water it down; don't try to make it logical; don't edit your own soul according to the fashion. Rather, follow your most intense obsessions mercilessly.”
    ― Franz Kafka
    Adventures With Amber Marie

  7. #487
    Veteran leswp1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    31,420

    Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!

    Quote Originally Posted by MissThundercat View Post
    This one is low-key on the religion; she is a Christian but isn't forceful with it. Still, I don't know if you read what I wrote to her, but if this is the way she's going to behave, she is bad and she should feel bad.
    I had a very visceral reaction to this statement and I can't help but respond. (Unsolicited advice. well meant)

    You are going to school for social work I think? You are going to run into this kind of thing from patients or clients. A. Lot. Period. The people that have the most need for help are usually the ones who are nastiest to you as a person and their motivations will be a lot nastier. You will hear stuff that isn't good, is inappropriate, attacks you as a person, or sometimes attacks what the person thinks you are even when you aren't. They will actively seek to say things that will be terribly insulting and hurtful. They pick anything they think you will be most hurt by. Sometimes they will hit the mark. Are you going to decide that they are bad and should feel bad?

    What she did was not good. It didn't feel good and felt like a betrayal. It shows a lack of a lot of things including knowledge about the issue at hand and more importantly how to process it. She should absolutely know better and doesn't. A better question might be- Do you think she did this to be malicious? Was she actively trying to harm you? Was this her honest assessment no matter how incredibly misguided?

    You don't have to like what she did. You don't need to accept her opinion but do you want her to rent space in your head or can you use some of the stuff you are learning and figure out how to put it in its place? That doesn't mean ignore it, not say anything or let it slide. None of those things are healthy. But- what purpose does labeling her as bad or wishing she feel bad. It doesn't make what she said hurt less. Label the behaviour- what she did sucked. That doesn't mean everything she did sucked. She probably was helpful to you at some points. Screwing up now doesn't mean she didn't help before even if it wasn't perfect. Clearly you can't trust her to provide the support when you need it. That sux. But you have been awesome at building of a support network that you can lean on and this place of employment is to pay the rent and bills til you get to do what you really want to.

    It took me a long time when I was in practice to figure out humans do not all respond in a good way if I did it right. Humans have a lot of failings. They self select to come for help when they are at their most unlovely. They can be downright nasty. If you learn to label the behaviour rather than the person it allows you to deal with them without it eating you alive.

  8. #488
    I got nothing Slap Shot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Clark Freeport Zone, Philippines
    Posts
    31,456

    Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!

    Did she specifically say why she wouldn't provide the reference? What exactly did she say?

  9. #489
    If Only You Knew MissThundercat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    At a Coffee Shop or out running
    Posts
    41,942

    Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!

    Quote Originally Posted by Slap Shot View Post
    Did she specifically say why she wouldn't provide the reference? What exactly did she say?
    I told her I would be working with sexual assault, domestic violence, and human trafficking victims. She basically said because I'm not a cis female, I wouldn't understand, therefore I'm not fit to work with these people.
    twitter: PipersHouse920, instagram: bobambermarie
    “Don't bend; don't water it down; don't try to make it logical; don't edit your own soul according to the fashion. Rather, follow your most intense obsessions mercilessly.”
    ― Franz Kafka
    Adventures With Amber Marie

  10. #490
    If Only You Knew MissThundercat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    At a Coffee Shop or out running
    Posts
    41,942

    Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!

    As a general rule, cisgender, heterosexual men grind my gears. I know, I know, #NotAllMen, but enough of them.

    I identify as pansexual, but it would take an extremely special cis male to break that wall.
    twitter: PipersHouse920, instagram: bobambermarie
    “Don't bend; don't water it down; don't try to make it logical; don't edit your own soul according to the fashion. Rather, follow your most intense obsessions mercilessly.”
    ― Franz Kafka
    Adventures With Amber Marie

  11. #491
    Lucia Apologist
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    29,246

    Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!

    Quote Originally Posted by MissThundercat View Post
    As a general rule, cisgender, heterosexual men grind my gears. I know, I know, #NotAllMen, but enough of them.

    I identify as pansexual, but it would take an extremely special cis male to break that wall.
    Wouldn’t a cis-het man by definition not be attracted to a trans woman? I’m asking because I’m not sure I fully understand the most modern definitions of sexual attraction and gender identity. I guess I always assumed a heterosexual man is one who is attracted to cis female. Is there a term for someone who is attracted to both cis and trans women? Is there one for a man who is attracted to only trans women?

    I honestly feel like there might need to be. Because we’ve gotten more specific in our terminology for how people identify. Shouldn’t we become more specific in how we describe attraction?

  12. #492
    If Only You Knew MissThundercat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    At a Coffee Shop or out running
    Posts
    41,942
    Quote Originally Posted by dxmnkd316 View Post
    Wouldn’t a cis-het man by definition not be attracted to a trans woman? I’m asking because I’m not sure I fully understand the most modern definitions of sexual attraction and gender identity. I guess I always assumed a heterosexual man is one who is attracted to cis female. Is there a term for someone who is attracted to both cis and trans women? Is there one for a man who is attracted to only trans women?

    I honestly feel like there might need to be. Because we’ve gotten more specific in our terminology for how people identify. Shouldn’t we become more specific in how we describe attraction?
    We have a term: pansexual.

  13. #493
    I got nothing Slap Shot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Clark Freeport Zone, Philippines
    Posts
    31,456

    Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!

    Why shouldn't a hetero man be attracted to another that has transitioned if the attraction is real. Obviously any attraction in that regard needs to be mutual, but are we not trying to reduce boundaries rather than set more of them?

  14. #494
    Has Anger Issues FadeToBlack&Gold's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    A Headshrinker's Office
    Posts
    32,624

    Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!

    Quote Originally Posted by Slap Shot View Post
    Why shouldn't a hetero man be attracted to another that has transitioned if the attraction is real. Obviously any attraction in that regard needs to be mutual, but are we not trying to reduce boundaries rather than set more of them?
    Agreed, labels are unnecessary in this case.
    Michigan Tech: "Working with scraps and guys from places so remote that Houghton seems like a metropolis"

  15. #495
    Veteran leswp1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    31,420

    Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!

    I have to admit I get thoroughly confused with all the various labels and struggle to keep up with what is OK, the latest nomenclature. Every time I read something new there is another term. I get the wanting to be recognized but I feel like I can't keep up and I am going to offend someone if I don't keep up. I vote with Slap Shot about less boundaries.

    I've struggled with the label thing for as long as I can remember. (could this be because I was a non-conformist child of the 60s??) As a a young kid I was baffled when people thought labels were important. We were all God's children (I was very literal) why did we need them? I remember asking why anyone cared who loved who if they loved each other. It caused parental consternation- both of my parents looked at me like I was some kind of interesting bug. I couldn't figure out why the question freaked them out.

    I think of people in terms of being human not who they are attracted to or what gender they identify with. The world is supposedly now enlightened, accepting people and relabeling everyone. I still struggle with labels. On some level I understand people feeling the need for recognition but it it seems to me that when people label each other it is equal opportunity for recognition and another way to segregate people out for seclusion.

    As to the dudes being jerks - It would seem it isn't their gender identity or their sexual orientation that makes them tools. It is coz they are a jerk.

  16. #496
    Lucia Apologist
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    29,246

    Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!

    Quote Originally Posted by Slap Shot View Post
    Why shouldn't a hetero man be attracted to another that has transitioned if the attraction is real. Obviously any attraction in that regard needs to be mutual, but are we not trying to reduce boundaries rather than set more of them?
    I didn’t say someone couldn’t or shouldn’t. I’m wondering if there’s a term for it.

    It has literally nothing to do with boundaries. Everyone gets bent out of shape about whether someone is “he”, “she”, “none”, etc. that’s fine and I have no issues with it. Some people prefer to use specific terminology. For some people it’s actually very important. It’s their identify. Some people prefer to use specific terminology. Others don’t.

    I think you’ve all seriously misinterpreted my intentions
    Last edited by dxmnkd316; 09-13-2019 at 07:05 PM.

  17. #497
    Veteran leswp1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    31,420

    Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!

    Quote Originally Posted by dxmnkd316 View Post
    I didn’t say someone couldn’t or shouldn’t. I’m wondering if there’s a term for it.

    It has literally nothing to do with boundaries. Everyone gets bent out of shape about whether someone is “he”, “she”, “none”, etc. that’s fine and I have no issues with it. Some people prefer to use specific terminology. For some people it’s actually very important. It’s their identify. Some people prefer to use specific terminology. Others don’t.

    I think you’ve all seriously misinterpreted my intentions
    I agree. I understand some people want a label. I have a hard time when people get mad when I don't know what the right terminology is according to that person. I feel like intent is important too. If someone is a jerk and up a person's grill about using the labels requested that isn't Ok.

  18. #498
    If Only You Knew MissThundercat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    At a Coffee Shop or out running
    Posts
    41,942

    Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!

    Quote Originally Posted by dxmnkd316 View Post
    I didn’t say someone couldn’t or shouldn’t. I’m wondering if there’s a term for it.

    It has literally nothing to do with boundaries. Everyone gets bent out of shape about whether someone is “he”, “she”, “none”, etc. that’s fine and I have no issues with it. Some people prefer to use specific terminology. For some people it’s actually very important. It’s their identify. Some people prefer to use specific terminology. Others don’t.

    I think you’ve all seriously misinterpreted my intentions
    There is. I say I'm pansexual. There's also polysexual. It's nice to people like me because now we have terminology for this stuff. And in 1999, when I started figuring all this out... all we had was LGBT. But even in Muskegon High School, liberal as it was, I didn't dare say it.
    twitter: PipersHouse920, instagram: bobambermarie
    “Don't bend; don't water it down; don't try to make it logical; don't edit your own soul according to the fashion. Rather, follow your most intense obsessions mercilessly.”
    ― Franz Kafka
    Adventures With Amber Marie

  19. #499
    Anti-Semantic The Rube's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Chez Rube
    Posts
    118,818

    Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!

    Quote Originally Posted by leswp1 View Post
    I have to admit I get thoroughly confused with all the various labels and struggle to keep up with what is OK, the latest nomenclature. Every time I read something new there is another term. I get the wanting to be recognized but I feel like I can't keep up and I am going to offend someone if I don't keep up. I vote with Slap Shot about less boundaries.

    I've struggled with the label thing for as long as I can remember. (could this be because I was a non-conformist child of the 60s??) As a a young kid I was baffled when people thought labels were important. We were all God's children (I was very literal) why did we need them? I remember asking why anyone cared who loved who if they loved each other. It caused parental consternation- both of my parents looked at me like I was some kind of interesting bug. I couldn't figure out why the question freaked them out.

    I think of people in terms of being human not who they are attracted to or what gender they identify with. The world is supposedly now enlightened, accepting people and relabeling everyone. I still struggle with labels. On some level I understand people feeling the need for recognition but it it seems to me that when people label each other it is equal opportunity for recognition and another way to segregate people out for seclusion.

    As to the dudes being jerks - It would seem it isn't their gender identity or their sexual orientation that makes them tools. It is coz they are a jerk.
    Yeah, I mean, if I meet a woman, who is transgender (unknown to me), she is just a woman. Period. If I'm attracted or not attracted, doesn't matter. She's a woman. Then say, later on, she says she's transgender. To her, that label is important. To me, it doesn't matter because to me, she's simply a woman, which is what she wanted to be called in the first place. It's confusing and frustrating at times.
    Never really developed a taste for tequila. Kind of hard to understand how you make a drink out of something that sharp, inhospitable. Now, bourbon is easy to understand.
    Tastes like a warm summer day. -Raylan Givens

  20. #500
    If Only You Knew MissThundercat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    At a Coffee Shop or out running
    Posts
    41,942

    Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!

    Quote Originally Posted by The Rube View Post
    Yeah, I mean, if I meet a woman, who is transgender (unknown to me), she is just a woman. Period. If I'm attracted or not attracted, doesn't matter. She's a woman. Then say, later on, she says she's transgender. To her, that label is important. To me, it doesn't matter because to me, she's simply a woman, which is what she wanted to be called in the first place. It's confusing and frustrating at times.
    Lately, I come out way after I've been introduced. The rarity has been with the board and team at Out On The Lakeshore. I needed to.

    And yes, the labels are important to us. I just slide that into conversation... most reasonable people are like "oh, okay, cool." The only people who lose their **** are right wing religious types, like my aunt and the woman who was my best friend. Both those people told me I was going to hell for being anything other than a cisgender, heterosexual male.

    Even though it can be confusing, roll with us.
    twitter: PipersHouse920, instagram: bobambermarie
    “Don't bend; don't water it down; don't try to make it logical; don't edit your own soul according to the fashion. Rather, follow your most intense obsessions mercilessly.”
    ― Franz Kafka
    Adventures With Amber Marie

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •