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Thread: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

  1. #861
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    Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Gray View Post
    Yup, we have no control over our actions. Heinous of him to suggest human beings can make choices. That's just totally wacko!
    Wow.
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    Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

    Quote Originally Posted by ScoobyDoo View Post
    Wow.
    You're response says it all. Might as well close the thread.
    Quote Originally Posted by Priceless View Post
    Good to see you're so reasonable.
    Quote Originally Posted by ScoobyDoo View Post
    Very well, said.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rover View Post
    A fair assessment Bob.

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    Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Gray View Post
    You're response says it all. Might as well close the thread.
    I'm sorry, Bob. I really am. The science is pretty clear on this issue.
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    Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

    Quote Originally Posted by St. Clown View Post
    Are you saying that homosexual feelings should be supressed because they're harmful to the person?
    Depends on your religion or lack thereof. Being a religious argument, I don't see how this discussion can be productive. We'll all live our lives as we see fit and as guided by our own principles.
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    Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

    Quote Originally Posted by ScoobyDoo View Post
    I'm sorry, Bob. I really am. The science is pretty clear on this issue.

    Your "science" means nothing here.

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    Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

    Quote Originally Posted by Gurtholfin View Post
    Your "science" means nothing here.
    True. Science means nothing in this country. Especially in politics. My bad.
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    Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

    This is my last comment on the topic.

    Personally, I've been listening to a lot of people refer to themselves as "recovering alcoholics" lately. I've never heard anyone, including either of my gay friends, announce they had a gay problem and start calling themselves "recovering homosexuals". Just saying, I don't think you can 12 Step that one, try as some Christian groups might, because it's not a chemical substance that rewires the brain over time in an attempt to take over your life. That is because the brain is already oriented that way at birth.
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    Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Gray View Post
    Hey, when there's ten people to respond to, responses get lumped together a bit. As I'm sure you can understand, reading back through this thread, where others have implied that. I knew people would melt down over the concept of people having the ability to make choices in their life, as if you acknowledge that, you then have to be willing to accept the consequences of those choices, a concept that has been waning in this country for a good while now.
    Just to be clear, am I correct to assume that you are implying homosexuality is a choice, and a bad/poor/whatever one at that?
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    Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

    Quote Originally Posted by FadeToBlack&Gold View Post
    This is my last comment on the topic.

    Personally, I've been listening to a lot of people refer to themselves as "recovering alcoholics" lately. I've never heard anyone, including either of my gay friends, announce they had a gay problem and start calling themselves "recovering homosexuals". Just saying, I don't think you can 12 Step that one, try as some Christian groups might, because it's not a chemical substance that rewires the brain over time in an attempt to take over your life. That is because the brain is already oriented that way at birth.
    No, apparently it's not. God doesn't make mistakes like that.
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    Originally Posted by First Time, Long Time-Always knew you were nothing but a troll.

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    Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

    Quote Originally Posted by XYZ View Post
    Just to be clear, am I correct to assume that you are implying homosexuality is a choice, and a bad/poor/whatever one at that?

    He won't answer that directly.

    He never answers anything like that directly.

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    Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

    Quote Originally Posted by XYZ View Post
    Just to be clear, am I correct to assume that you are implying homosexuality is a choice, and a bad/poor/whatever one at that?
    This question misses the point somewhat. "Homosexuality" (broadly) is no more a choice than jealousy or vanity or generosity, but some people question whether your actions and lifestyle ought to be guided by any of those things. What parts of ourselves do we want to live in fulfillment of? Or you could say that homosexual inclinations are beyond our control, but sodomy is a choice.
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  12. #872
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    Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

    Quote Originally Posted by geezer View Post
    This question misses the point somewhat. "Homosexuality" (broadly) is no more a choice than jealousy or vanity or generosity, but some people question whether your actions and lifestyle ought to be guided by any of those things. What parts of ourselves do we want to live in fulfillment of? Or you could say that homosexual inclinations are beyond our control, but sodomy is a choice.

    Can you say the same thing(s) about Heterosexuality?

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    Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

    Quote Originally Posted by Gurtholfin View Post
    Can you say the same thing(s) about Heterosexuality?
    Of course. You could also say it about eating grapefruits (you might be hungry as all get-out for citrus, but for whatever reason feel a need to resist). Everyone has their own principles to live by. I know what kind of person I want in my bed, but I'm not here to judge someone else.
    The point being that everything we do is a choice, but what we are and what we feel are not.
    Last edited by geezer; 06-13-2014 at 01:22 PM.
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    Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

    Quote Originally Posted by Gurtholfin View Post
    Can you say the same thing(s) about Heterosexuality?
    Depends - how hot is she?
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    Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

    Quote Originally Posted by FadeToBlack&Gold View Post
    Depends - how hot is she?
    Depends - how much have I had to drink?
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    Quote Originally Posted by geezer View Post
    This question misses the point somewhat. "Homosexuality" (broadly) is no more a choice than jealousy or vanity or generosity, but some people question whether your actions and lifestyle ought to be guided by any of those things. What parts of ourselves do we want to live in fulfillment of? Or you could say that homosexual inclinations are beyond our control, but sodomy is a choice.
    Bob's inclinations to speak out in a bigoted manner against gays may be beyond his control, but his actually doing so is a choice.

    Is that the logic we're going with?

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    Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

    Quote Originally Posted by ScoobyDoo View Post
    True. Science means nothing in this country. Especially in politics. My bad.
    Well we know the church has always been anti-science. Heck as far back as the 16th century Galileo was ostracized by the church when he had the gall to suggest that the Earth might actually rotate around the sun.

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    Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

    Quote Originally Posted by geezer View Post
    Depends on your religion or lack thereof. Being a religious argument, I don't see how this discussion can be productive. We'll all live our lives as we see fit and as guided by our own principles.
    His comparisons were not religious, though; they were based upon healthy living. Excessive alcohol and chocolate consumption is bad for your health, so don't make those choices. Also, don't choose to act out on your gay instincts, same thing.
    "The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." George Orwell, 1984

    "One does not simply walk into Mordor. Its Black Gates are guarded by more than just Orcs. There is evil there that does not sleep, and the Great Eye is ever watchful. It is a barren wasteland, riddled with fire and ash and dust, the very air you breathe is a poisonous fume." Boromir

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    Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

    Quote Originally Posted by unofan View Post
    Bob's inclinations to speak out in a bigoted manner against gays may be beyond his control, but his actually doing so is a choice.

    Is that the logic we're going with?
    Exactly right. But I didn't read back far enough to see anything bigoted from him, I was actually trying to support the point I saw him making about alcoholism.
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    Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

    Quote Originally Posted by St. Clown View Post
    His comparisons were not religious, though; they were based upon healthy living. Excessive alcohol and chocolate consumption is bad for your health, so don't make those choices. Also, don't choose to act out on your gay instincts, same thing.
    I don't understand that argument, whether from Bob or any of the various nutjob politicians. I guess I was speaking more to a traditional Christian understanding of the inclination to sin. Perhaps he was comparing the damage of alcoholism to a sin-damaged soul? Bob?
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