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Thread: ACHA D1 to NCAA D1

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    ACHA D1 to NCAA D1

    After watching ND/Minn it goes to show how great of a product NCAA hockey is as well as having big name schools involved. I know Terry Pegula's do not grow on trees but who next is realistic to make jump? Here are some recent articles:

    Illinois...does not seem like the school will help as this is a recent article:
    https://www.dailyillini.com/salary_gu...a4bcf6878.html

    Nebraska-Lincoln....new Pinnacle arena as well as two new sheets by 2014 plus Osborn (who hated the idea of adding anything) is gone:
    https://www.letsplayhockey.com/online...-programs.html

    Others:
    https://b1gicehockey.blogspot.com/201...ey-invite.html


    One blogger said if Iowa State played in Des Moines at the new Wells Fargo ($130 Mill arena) the hockey program would easily be financially self sufficient. Also, someone on this board (MN Cyclone) mentioned ISU does NOT have to add a women's team. Iowa State has about 23 Male scholarships to give out before their scholarship % equals their schools male/female ratio.

    For them to go D1 they need to go outside the box and play some games in Des Moines. Maybe some big weekend games.

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    Re: ACHA D1 to NCAA D1

    There is already a lengthy thread on this very topic although there has not been a post in it since October:

    https://board.uscho.com/showthread.ph...g+10+division1

    FYI, unless Iowa State had a way better arena deal than UNO has in the Centurylink Center, I have my doubts that your statement about finances is true. Otherwise they'd be in the same boat in this regard. The only way UNO has kept afloat is because they have been in the top 10 in attendance every year of the program's existence (most of those years in the top 5). The ONLY revenue UNO derives from playing in the Centurylink Center is from ticket sales. This is the reason that UNO is building it's own on-campus arena, which any program that is truly serious about hockey must have. Our situation is also different because it is THE revenue sport at UNO so it matters here more than it might at ISU.
    Last edited by Red Cows; 01-08-2013 at 10:48 PM.

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    Re: ACHA D1 to NCAA D1

    Quote Originally Posted by Red Cows View Post
    This is the reason that UNO is building it's own on-campus arena, which any program that is truly serious about hockey must have.
    If Minnesota State moved to an on-campus arena, attendance would probably drop, because alcohol sales are allowed at the civic center and would not be if it was on campus.
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    Re: ACHA D1 to NCAA D1

    Quote Originally Posted by MavsFan View Post
    If Minnesota State moved to an on-campus arena, attendance would probably drop, because alcohol sales are allowed at the civic center and would not be if it was on campus.
    Is not going to be an issue here because the development the arena is going to be in is being done in conjunction with and leased from a private developer even though it is on university soil. Clever, huh?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hockey Monk View Post
    One blogger said if Iowa State played in Des Moines at the new Wells Fargo ($130 Mill arena) the hockey program would easily be financially self sufficient.
    That one blogger must not have been around for the Iowa Stars and Iowa Chops of the AHL.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aparch View Post
    That one blogger must not have been around for the Iowa Stars and Iowa Chops of the AHL.
    You don't think university branding can make a difference?

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    Re: ACHA D1 to NCAA D1

    Quote Originally Posted by Patman View Post
    You don't think university branding can make a difference?
    It can. But will it? And the point is that playing at the Wells Fargo arena is hardly a guarantee that the program will make oodles of money. And don't forget, you also have a very well established USHL team in Des Moines. That certainly didn't help the Stars/Chops. Also, those crowds of 4,000 on a good night still make a $117 million dollar, 16,000 seat rink look pretty empty.
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    Re: ACHA D1 to NCAA D1

    I read the blog. I hate to be a negative Nancy but there just is no way any of the schools mentioned will have hockey in the next ten years. Obviously, anything can happen like Pegula writing a check but there just is no way I see them jumping into the ice box.
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    Re: ACHA D1 to NCAA D1

    Seems to me that Northwestern would be the most logical choice, but I have no idea if there's any interest on their end. Being in Chicago and the fact that more and more talent is coming out of Illinois.

  10. #10

    Re: ACHA D1 to NCAA D1

    Quote Originally Posted by 4four4 View Post
    I read the blog. I hate to be a negative Nancy but there just is no way any of the schools mentioned will have hockey in the next ten years. Obviously, anything can happen like Pegula writing a check but there just is no way I see them jumping into the ice box.
    Of those mentioned below, Iowa State is probably the most likely due to Title IX.

    That being said, my guess is that the college hockey landscape is vastly different in ten years than it is now (or even next year)...either for the good or the bad.
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    Re: ACHA D1 to NCAA D1

    I think the landscape has already trended downward and I'm afraid to think what the sport looks like in 10 years.

  12. #12

    Re: ACHA D1 to NCAA D1

    Quote Originally Posted by J.D. View Post
    I think the landscape has already trended downward and I'm afraid to think what the sport looks like in 10 years.
    Two ways to look at it.

    Option A: The Good Trend
    - At least one or more Big Ten schools add hockey
    - Schools like Iowa State and Lindenwood are then spurred to add hockey programs
    - The nWCHA flourishes with the changes
    - Other schools, including a few big name schools, decide to jump aboard the college hockey train, bringing the D-1 program total to 65-70 schools, and the future looks bright

    Option B: The Bad Trend
    - No B1G schools join
    - With revenues decreasing from new schedules, several schools are forced to abandon their programs. The nWCHA basically becomes a graveyard, leaving only those most committed to keep trying to save the league. Perhaps a few Atlantic Hockey schools go by the wayside, and perhaps a few join the remnants of the nWCHA to attempt to survive
    - The most talented kids go to Canada by the masses, leaving college hockey a watered down, leftover league
    - With only 45-50 programs left, the NCAA forces college hockey to return to an 8 or 12 team Tournament, further taking away attention to the sport

    Obviously, those are both extremes, and reality will probably be somewhere in between. I hope for the best, but fear for the worst.
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    Re: ACHA D1 to NCAA D1

    Even though there is only (extreme) anecdotal evidence to support this, I remain firmly convinced that the University of Nebraska is either going to establish a D-1 program or they are, at the very least, going to give it a very serious look.

    1. UNL's soon to be completed Pinnacle Bank Arena has been built (and, this was an add-on after construction began) with all the piping necessary in the concrete floor to make ice although the other ancillary equipment has not yet been purchased.

    2. Besides the construction of the Pinnacle facility, the Breslow Ice Arena is about to be built right next to it!!! Read between the lines of this article:

    https://journalstar.com/news/local/go...6fbc46cc4.html

    Plus, this facility is specifically being built so that seating can be added to the nominal amount it's getting out of the box.

    3. UNL's new Athletic Director is the man behind the building of the Kohl Center at Wisconsin and comes from a hockey background.

    If this isn't in the thought process here, why on Earth is all this being done? These are both UNL operated facilities. Perhaps we're just building places to play hockey, that are operated by the university, all in the same area of town where Haymarket Park and Memorial Stadium are located, just for the heck of it. All these facilities are walking distance from each other!

    Trust me, the money to do this is NOT an issue an at Nebraska. The NU Foundation, in the article above as much as says so, by remarking they don't know what the Breslow Ice Arena is going to cost, and the project lead didn't make it sound like she even cared what the final tab is going to be. The NU Foundation is rumored around here to have mountains of cash. Let us not forget that the richest man in the world is a graduate of this school and that his middle name is "philanthropy".

    If it looks like a duck, and walks like a duck, and sounds like a duck, it's a duck.

    And, for the UNO fans around here reading this, I find the notion that there was or is any sort of quid pro quo between Trev Alberts and Tom Osborne about hockey at UNL absurd (as it supposedly related to the abolishment of both wrestling and football at UNO). Frankly, I think UNO might even benefit from UNL having a team. Plus, they would be in a totally different conference. Instant rivalry? Uh, yeah, I think so. The Omaha Lancers have certainly benefited from the Lincoln Stars presence, however I think UNL going D-1 might not be a good thing for the Stars. It is a lot smaller town than Omaha and there are only so many hockey dollars there.

    The press here has even openly speculated about this now:

    https://twitter.com/ericolson64/stat...10335921692672

    Eric Olson is the Husker beat writer for the Lincoln Journal Star. If this happens, it'll be sooner than he says, I think.

    Interesting Husker Hockey (ACHA, Div. 3) tidbit. They don't even play in Lincoln! They play at Sidner Ice Arena in Fremont, Nebraska. That is something that is changing for sure once the Breslow facility is built.
    Last edited by Red Cows; 01-09-2013 at 02:13 PM.

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    Re: ACHA D1 to NCAA D1

    Quote Originally Posted by J.D. View Post
    I think the landscape has already trended downward and I'm afraid to think what the sport looks like in 10 years.
    Yeah, people seem to have already started turning a blind eye to the unknown future of the Island of Misfit Toys. The impact of all the "name" schools leaving the leftover WCHA and CCHA schools behind has yet to be seen. Will attendance drop enough that some of those programs fold up their tent, because people no longer see their schools as being in a "big-time" conference? We don't know yet.
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  15. #15

    Re: ACHA D1 to NCAA D1

    Quote Originally Posted by MavsFan View Post
    Yeah, people seem to have already started turning a blind eye to the unknown future of the Island of Misfit Toys. The impact of all the "name" schools leaving the leftover WCHA and CCHA schools behind has yet to be seen. Will attendance drop enough that some of those programs fold up their tent, because people no longer see their schools as being in a "big-time" conference? We don't know yet.
    Very true. What will be interesting is to see how attendance does at the programs that start to win more often than they used to. Is a winning program more important than the schedule in regards to attendance? The next few years in several of the conferences (not just the WCHA) will provide ample evidence to support one of those two positions I would imagine.
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    Re: ACHA D1 to NCAA D1

    Quote Originally Posted by Red Cows View Post
    Even though there is only (extreme) anecdotal evidence to support this, I remain firmly convinced that the University of Nebraska is either going to establish a D-1 program or they are, at the very least, going to give it a very serious look.

    1. UNL's soon to be completed Pinnacle Bank Arena has been built (and, this was an add-on after construction began) with all the piping necessary in the concrete floor to make ice although the other ancillary equipment has not yet been purchased.

    2. Besides the construction of the Pinnacle facility, the Breslow Ice Arena is about to be built right next to it!!! Read between the lines of this article:

    https://journalstar.com/news/local/go...6fbc46cc4.html

    Plus, this facility is specifically being built so that seating can be added to the nominal amount it's getting out of the box.

    3. UNL's new Athletic Director is the man behind the building of the Kohl Center at Wisconsin and comes from a hockey background.

    If this isn't in the thought process here, why on Earth is all this being done? These are both UNL operated facilities. Perhaps we're just building places to play hockey, that are operated by the university, all in the same area of town where Haymarket Park and Memorial Stadium are located, just for the heck of it. All these facilities are walking distance from each other!

    Trust me, the money to do this is NOT an issue an at Nebraska. The NU Foundation, in the article above as much as says so, by remarking they don't know what the Breslow Ice Arena is going to cost, and the project lead didn't make it sound like she even cared what the final tab is going to be. The NU Foundation is rumored around here to have mountains of cash. Let us not forget that the richest man in the world is a graduate of this school and that his middle name is "philanthropy".

    If it looks like a duck, and walks like a duck, and sounds like a duck, it's a duck.

    And, for the UNO fans around here reading this, I find the notion that there was or is any sort of quid pro quo between Trev Alberts and Tom Osborne about hockey at UNL absurd (as it supposedly related to the abolishment of both wrestling and football at UNO). Frankly, I think UNO might even benefit from UNL having a team. Plus, they would be in a totally different conference. Instant rivalry? Uh, yeah, I think so. The Omaha Lancers have certainly benefited from the Lincoln Stars presence, however I think UNL going D-1 might not be a good thing for the Stars. It is a lot smaller town than Omaha and there are only so many hockey dollars there.

    The press here has even openly speculated about this now:

    https://twitter.com/ericolson64/stat...10335921692672

    Eric Olson is the Husker beat writer for the Lincoln Journal Star. If this happens, it'll be sooner than he says, I think.

    Interesting Husker Hockey (ACHA, Div. 3) tidbit. They don't even play in Lincoln! They play at Sidner Ice Arena in Fremont, Nebraska. That is something that is changing for sure once the Breslow facility is built.
    I think Nebraska and Penn State mirror eachother. Solid football programs and weak basketball programs with a need for winter/spring entertainment. Basketball will never be anything special at either school yet both schools have an abundance of hockey talent in their back yards. I would say Nebraska has more of an advantage recruiting hockey players than football players with all the talent in the USHL in Neb/Iowa. Nebraska also has an awesome fan base that supports the school. I could only imagine what the turnout and atmosphere would be when the big dogs like Minn, Wisco, Mich, UNO, etc roll into Lincoln.

    Both are going to have new shinny barns so my fingers are crossed and I would even donate to the school if they made hockey happen.

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    Re: ACHA D1 to NCAA D1

    Lacrosse is the **** sport to add these days, not hockey.
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    Re: ACHA D1 to NCAA D1

    Possibly significant breaking news today about Nebraska that might impact my little soliloquy above about Husker Hockey.

    I did not even mention or examine the possible Title 9 implications of the Huskers adding hockey above. Today, the Huskers added a new D-1 sport to the women's side of that ledger:

    https://www.huskers.com/ViewArticle.d...CLID=205896263

    Note that the article says the NCAA considers it a separate sport so I assume that any crossover players from the regular volleyball squad (who are eligible) that elect to play in this sport are, I assume, separate additional female athletes. I believe that Title 9 regs cover the number of athletes by gender at a school, and not necessarily the total number of sports available by gender? I am sure somebody knows better than I, here. I am not real up to speed on the actual nuts and bolts of the legislative wording of Title 9, which was part of an education law enacted by Congress in the early '70's.

    In any event, this can't help but be a positive thing for the Title 9 perspective of adding hockey at Nebraska one would think. If you're an unabashed optimist, you could even wonder if this was seen/done as a necessary precursor to doing so.

    One thing I don't know a lot about is the actual Title 9 situation at Nebraska. Perhaps somebody here can enlighten us. It certainly is going to play a roll in any school's desire to add hockey. It legally has to.

    I'll say this, sand volleyball cannot be very expensive to run and it isn't going to even start out as a scholarship sport at NU, either.

    Whether or not this has anything overtly to do with hockey at Nebraska, it's a positive sign in the realm of the possibilities of it.

    edit: This now makes 14 women's sports and 10 men's at NU.

    There is also now threads at Huskermax in the both the volleyball and football forums where there is some hockey speculation going on as a result of this announcement today. A lot of it dumb beyond words, I might add.
    Last edited by Red Cows; 01-09-2013 at 11:38 PM.

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    Re: ACHA D1 to NCAA D1

    Quote Originally Posted by Red Cows View Post
    Possibly significant breaking news today about Nebraska that might impact my little soliloquy above about Husker Hockey.

    I did not even mention or examine the possible Title 9 implications of the Huskers adding hockey above. Today, the Huskers added a new D-1 sport to the women's side of that ledger:

    https://www.huskers.com/ViewArticle.d...CLID=205896263

    Note that the article says the NCAA considers it a separate sport so I assume that any crossover players from the regular volleyball squad (who are eligible) that elect to play in this sport are, I assume, separate additional female athletes. I believe that Title 9 regs cover the number of athletes by gender at a school, and not necessarily the total number of sports available by gender? I am sure somebody knows better than I, here. I am not real up to speed on the actual nuts and bolts of the legislative wording of Title 9, which was part of an education law enacted by Congress in the early '70's.

    In any event, this can't help but be a positive thing for the Title 9 perspective of adding hockey at Nebraska one would think. If you're an unabashed optimist, you could even wonder if this was seen/done as a necessary precursor to doing so.

    One thing I don't know a lot about is the actual Title 9 situation at Nebraska. Perhaps somebody here can enlighten us. It certainly is going to play a roll in any school's desire to add hockey. It legally has to.

    I'll say this, sand volleyball cannot be very expensive to run and it isn't going to even start out as a scholarship sport at NU, either.

    Whether or not this has anything overtly to do with hockey at Nebraska, it's a positive sign in the realm of the possibilities of it.

    edit: This now makes 14 women's sports and 10 men's at NU.

    There is also now threads at Huskermax in the both the volleyball and football forums where there is some hockey speculation going on as a result of this announcement today. A lot of it dumb beyond words, I might add.
    I'm pretty sure that if it's not a scholarship sport, the numbers won't count. I think you have to offer a proportional number of scholarships.
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    Re: ACHA D1 to NCAA D1

    Quote Originally Posted by Red Cows View Post
    edit: This now makes 14 women's sports and 10 men's at NU.
    Well dayum, why isn't the ACLU on this like slop on a hog? Clearly, it's a case of discrimination against Husker men!
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