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Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?

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  • Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?

    Just re-watching the "highlights" from the ND game on your Blog. Ruikka really got eaten alive out there.
    Boston University: 2009 NCAA Champions

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    • Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?

      Originally posted by ericredaxe View Post
      What are you basing that on? I was a student athlete at BU and the ammount of support available from the university to help the student athletes succeed accademically is pretty impressive, and my understanding is that it has gotten even better since I was there. I also believe I read somewhere that in high school Coyle was given some award for the combination of academic and athletic acheivement (not sure if this is true). That would indicate that Coyle had the ability to do well in class, but chose not to and chose to not take advantage of any of the academic support available. Are you suggesting that Parker discourages the players from doing well in school?
      I am basing my comment on what you just elaborated on....the significant resources and support that is in place to assist the student athlete at BU. Where did you get that I'm suggesting Parker discourages players from doing well? That is silly.

      I am saying that as the CEO he can do much to stay on top of players academics. When I competed my coaches knew how each of us was doinig in every class. They knew if we missed a class and they didn't let things get to the point where a smart kid, which I take Coyle to be, is in a position of flunking out. If Coyle was pushed to get help and just blew it off that's a different matter and for it to suddenly arise now should not happen....at least Parker should have been well aware of his circumtances before this semester even started.

      There is a difference between shutting down academically because he's made the decision to leave (I think that was the case) and not being able to meet the academic demands. If he shut down because he'd decided BU wasn't gving him what he believes he needs to further his hockey career it was a bi-product of him leaving BU either way.

      Originally posted by Federal League View Post
      This is correct- both about the amount of support and about Coyle winning that award in HS. Based on conversations I've had with student-athletes, pretty much any student-athlete who wants to pass his or her classes can. The only way they end up failing is if they simply don't try- whether that's by not going to class, not taking advantage of tutoring or not doing the work. That's on the student-athlete, not the coach or the program. They're not little kids. They shouldn't have to be woken up in the morning and have their hand held on the walk to class.
      That is correct....so if he consciously blew off school because he didn't want to be there it goes back to reasons more fundemental then his academic record.....If that is the case, Coyle had decided BU didn't meet his hockey needs going forward and has as much right to quit a program not meeting his needs as Parker does to kick a kid off that isn't meeting his needs or arbitrary standards. Parker kicked Vic Sapponari off the team for what? Vic was a very good student and did nothing I'm aware of other then being Vinnie's brother to be removed. If Parker makes that decision it's his right but it creates the culture that permeates this program now...and everyone here knows what that is because we've been writing about it for the last month.

      Originally posted by Rogie21 View Post
      What’s your point? That Parker elaborated on Coyle’s departure but not Saponari’s? It’s nothing new. He commented publicly when Mike Grier departed—at Jack’s suggestion—as well as when Mike Pomichter left early—a move he didn’t agree with. When players are asked to leave the program (Bartlett, Walsh, Bennett), he doesn’t expound on the details. He didn’t and won’t go public with the exact infractions that sealed Vinny’s fate--and it wasn’t Puckstar or not showing up on time. Trivino, obviously was an exceptional circumstance.

      Rogie your nose is so far up the BU of the 90's A** that you don't see this program for what it is today in the eyes of the players....going to your point below give me one example or name of a player these last 5-7 years that Parker has maintained a positive relationship with besides possibly the bulldog.

      Typical cfo6 claim with no substance to support it, just a transparent agenda. Like your recent implication that Parker doesn’t “care about any of his players beyond what they can do for him on the ice,” which has to be the most willfully ignorant--and easily disproved--post made here in recent memory by anyone who’s not a fan of the team up the block.
      I make my comments in a thoughtful manner and there are levels of shared detail, which you adhere to as well, as a program insider, that you aren't going to share on a message board. Hokeydad and others routinely don't post details that could embarrass a player or other individual and there are many things that can be discussed in broad generalities here that specific details aren't appropriate. That said, I'd love to hear who you think continues to have a positive relationship with Parker that has played for him in the last 7 classes. Some may have a neutral attitude but I cannot think of one besides Joe P that I'd characterize wanting to have an ongoing relationship with the coach.
      Last edited by collegefan06; 01-02-2012, 06:20 PM.

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      • Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?

        Originally posted by collegefan06 View Post
        There is a difference between shutting down academically because he's made the decision to leave (I think that was the case) and not being able to meet the academic demands. If he shut down because he'd decided BU wasn't gving him what he believes he needs to further his hockey career it was a bi-product of him leaving BU either way.


        That is correct....so if he consciously blew off school because he didn't want to be there it goes back to reasons more fundemental then his academic record.....If that is the case, Coyle had decided BU didn't meet his hockey needs going forward and has as much right to quit a program not meeting his needs as Parker does to kick a kid off that isn't meeting his needs or arbitrary standards.
        While I get what you're saying, what really frosts my cookies is that he was there to go to school and play hockey. If the team was not meeting his needs from a hockey perspective, that's one thing. To me it does not give him the right to shut down academically. Go to ****ing class and do the work. If you want to leave because you feel that you're not progressing and you want to focus on hockey, then leave before the season starts. Why subject yourself to suffering through classwork? If you make the decision to go back to school and play, then GO TO SCHOOL. As others here (and you yourself) have posted, there are resources available for student athletes that are better than for regular students. There is no excuse to shut down academically.

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        • Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?

          Originally posted by Scarlet View Post
          While I get what you're saying, what really frosts my cookies is that he was there to go to school and play hockey. If the team was not meeting his needs from a hockey perspective, that's one thing. To me it does not give him the right to shut down academically. Go to ****ing class and do the work. If you want to leave because you feel that you're not progressing and you want to focus on hockey, then leave before the season starts. Why subject yourself to suffering through classwork? If you make the decision to go back to school and play, then GO TO SCHOOL. As others here (and you yourself) have posted, there are resources available for student athletes that are better than for regular students. There is no excuse to shut down academically.
          This.

          From what I know from Parker, Coyle, and those close to Coyle at school, Coyle would have been able participate as a player on next semester's team. I don't know exactly how bad his grades were, but I know he didn't do much to fix whatever was wrong. I heard at the end of October/early November that Coyle's family was trying to encourage him to use the tutoring at his disposal. I know for a fact that Coyle took one of his finals early without seemingly studying for it and did not pay attention in class, instead choosing to watch game film or fool around on his computer. If his grades were an issue, there is no sign that he was putting the necessary effort in to remedy the situation. Whatever academic issues Coyle had was on him. You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink.

          There are a lot of things people can blame Parker for concerning this team, but it isn't Parker's fault that Coyle abandoned his teammates halfway through the season. Coyle should have known at the end of last season if school was too difficult to manage on top of hockey. He should have known at the end of last year exactly what playing system BU employs, and if that didn't fit his game, he had a full year of it under his belt to determine this summer that BU was not the route for him. Coyle was also likely going to leave at the end of this season. Therefore, instead of sticking it out for six more months, Coyle chose to abandon the teammates that he committed to playing with when he chose to return this season.

          It was also unbelievably rude of him to not tell Clendening before the media approached him at the airport what was going on. According to Coyle himself, Coyle made the decision to leave BU by the week after Thanksgiving. This isn't something that was decided on last minute. He informed Parker before getting on the plane to World Juniors that he wouldn't be back. I can understand not wanting to tell the media what was going on - Parker said Coyle wanted to keep it quiet until after the tournament - but that doesn't mean you don't tell your roommate and travel partner what is going on.

          Coyle was one of the players that I personally knew best on the team. I always thought of him as a polite, well-behaved, generally good guy. Coyle is not interested in bringing random girls back to his room or acting like an entitled brat in public like some hockey players do. He doesn't drink, only went out to bars when his teammates would beg him to come, and he'd always get water. He's pretty shy and takes the team's failures (and his own) very personally. He still refuses to talk about the Beanpot last season because he's so embarrassed, and he turns red whenever you ask him about a turnover or a mistake during a game. For him to abandon his team and treat his teammates like this, to me, is very disappointing.

          If it turns out Saint John is better for his development, great. The way he handled the situation however, shows me that he could still learn a thing or two about what commitment means and how to better respect your teammates.
          http://thebostonhockeyblog.blogspot.com/

          Places I've watched college hockey: Agganis Arena, Alfond Arena, Bright Center, Conte Forum, DCU Center, Fenway Park, Houston Field House, Lawler Arena, Madison Square Garden, Matthews Arena, Mullins Center, Scottrade Center, TD Garden, Tsongas Center, Verizon Center, Verizon Wireless Arena, Walter Brown Arena, Whittemore Center

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          • Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?

            Originally posted by collegefan06 View Post
            That said, I'd love to hear who you think continues to have a positive relationship with Parker that has played for him in the last 7 classes. Some may have a neutral attitude but I cannot think of one besides Joe P that I'd characterize wanting to have an ongoing relationship with the coach.
            That I know of off the top off my head, one other member of the incoming class in 07-08 who has spent time in both the AHL and NHL talks to him regularly on the phone, whenever he is in town, gives him more credit than any other person for his on ice development, and will jump down the throat of anyone outside the team who criticizes him for things they speculate he does behind closed doors. I can only assume there are more.

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            • Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?

              Originally posted by reBlur View Post
              Coyle was one of the players that I personally knew best on the team. I always thought of him as a polite, well-behaved, generally good guy. Coyle is not interested in bringing random girls back to his room or acting like an entitled brat in public like some hockey players do. He doesn't drink, only went out to bars when his teammates would beg him to come, and he'd always get water. He's pretty shy...
              Talk about investigative reporting!

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              • Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?

                Originally posted by claver2010 View Post
                Talk about investigative reporting!
                These things are very important to the Freep stories.

                'Please contact me if Trivino gave your kid a puck one time!!!'

                Great stuff.

                Happy New Year everyone.

                I was not necessarily surprised with the result in S. Bend but I was shocked to see Jack standing back there watching how his bench was reacting to the last few ND goals. He looked like Umile back there just doing nothing. I would have expected him to be screaming or at least give the Jack Parker cough for the camera but... nothing. What can be read into this? Probably nothing but I found it interesting. Was he watching a game unfold the way he expected it to? I'm sure Coyle wouldn't have helped though!
                Originally posted by Greg Ambrose on 3/7/2010
                The fact that you BC fans revel in the superiority of your team in an admittedly weak league leads me to believe you will be more sorely disappointed when the end comes than we will.

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                • Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?

                  On the coyle thing...isn't it possible that no matter what resources were available the guy just didn't want to do the work if he instead could be playing hockey all day? Wouldn't be the first college kid to decide that doing something other than studying appealed to them.

                  Kids who have paid to go to college do it all the time... a guy with no skin in the game, knowing he will never be there long enough to get a degree, missing classes playing in international tournaments and with the opportunity to play hockey vs. study over breaks etc.

                  We all knew somebody that wasted the opportunity for a degree that had paid a ton of tuition already...and many of us knew somebody who had enough family money that it didn't really matter what they did and we'vre read about plenty of athletes that didn't appreciate how good they had it in college and left/got kicked out. Coyle may have been a mix of those and no amount of parental or athletic department coaxing was going to change him.

                  That he may have been a good high school student is informative but it's not like all college dropouts were morons...that Gates guy is a good example.
                  I believe in life, and I believe in love, but the world in which I live in keeps trying to prove me wrong.

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                  • Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?

                    Originally posted by Nick Papagiorgio View Post
                    These things are very important to the Freep stories.
                    Still not to the SteveF level of noting what clothes people wore, but these are students we're talking about, and they're decades behind. Give them a little time.
                    Bugs Bunny - 96
                    Gas House Gorillas - 95

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                    • Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?

                      I didn't realize Coyle was BU's version of Tim Tebow! I really need to read the Freep more.

                      Anyway, if a guy doesn't want to be here, why lament the fact that he left halfway through the year? Aside from bozos like brassbonanza who somehow thought Coyle was going to explode for 30 goals in the second half, its pretty obvious that for whatever reason (his teammates, style of play, coaching, etc) it wasn't working out for him at BU. I don't blame him for leaving if he felt that way. Not sure why you wouldn't show up at your finals to earn the credits but that's his problem.

                      Regarding Parker, I don't blame him for any of these individual incidents. Trivino has to lay off the sauce and figure out what the word "no" means before he winds up in prison. Coyle clearly believes he has a long and prosperous future playing professional hockey, something I haven't seen any signs of with his time at BU, but again that's his decision and not on the coach. What I will say is that I don't get the sense of community and 'we're all in this together' between the coaches and players. IMHO some of this behavior might be mitigated if the players related better with the coaching staff.
                      Last edited by Rover; 01-03-2012, 01:44 PM.
                      Legally drunk???? If its "legal", what's the ------- problem?!? - George Carlin

                      Ever notice how everybody who drives slower than you is an idiot, and everybody who drives faster is a maniac? - George Carlin

                      "I've never seen so much reason and bullsh*t contained in ONE MAN."

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                      • Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?

                        I can honestly tell you that the LAST word I would use to characterize Coyle's family is wealthy. They are decent, hard-working, blue collar people who value a college education more than most.
                        I can tell you that going into this thing it was all about getting a great free education. Then came being a 1st round pick, which immediately infers that if one lives up to his potential, one likely will not stay for 4 years.
                        At this point he is not necessarily in a better place, but more like the best of his remaining options.

                        No inside direct knowledge here, but I know the family well enough to say that I'm certain a few family members would not be happy with the way things have turned out academically.
                        Last edited by steakbomb; 01-03-2012, 01:03 PM.
                        Spaulding get your foot off the boat!

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                        • Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?

                          Originally posted by claver2010 View Post
                          Talk about investigative reporting!
                          As far as I'm aware, these boards aren't a newspaper. They're a forum for opinion. I shared my opinion.
                          http://thebostonhockeyblog.blogspot.com/

                          Places I've watched college hockey: Agganis Arena, Alfond Arena, Bright Center, Conte Forum, DCU Center, Fenway Park, Houston Field House, Lawler Arena, Madison Square Garden, Matthews Arena, Mullins Center, Scottrade Center, TD Garden, Tsongas Center, Verizon Center, Verizon Wireless Arena, Walter Brown Arena, Whittemore Center

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                          • Originally posted by reBlur View Post
                            As far as I'm aware, these boards aren't a newspaper. They're a forum for opinion. I shared my opinion.
                            reBlur: Why even respond? Don't take the bait. Believe me, the majority here are admirers of yours.

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                            • Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?

                              Originally posted by srsterrier View Post
                              reBlur: Why even respond? Don't take the bait. Believe me, the majority here are admirers of yours.
                              Allow me to repost.....

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                              • Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?

                                Originally posted by collegefan06 View Post
                                I'd love to hear who you think continues to have a positive relationship with Parker that has played for him in the last 7 classes. Some may have a neutral attitude but I cannot think of one besides Joe P that I'd characterize wanting to have an ongoing relationship with the coach.
                                Do we need to list the roster of the past seven classes, and go player by player?
                                Take a poll -
                                A.) Would you go out to dinner with Jack?
                                B.) Do you ever call your old coach?
                                C.) Do you send him a Christmas card?
                                D.) Been there, done that, past that?
                                The last seven classes? Why not the last eight? Or nine? Or four?

                                I think the only person that knows the answer to your question is Jack Parker, himself.
                                And what he would consider a positive relationship, what the former players might consider a positive relationship, and what you consider a positive relationship might be very different things.

                                If the players thought he could help them, would they call him and ask for it?
                                If the answer is yes, does it really matter if they aren't all warm and fuzzy and buddy/buddy with a coach that is old enough to be their grandfather?

                                I don't get the impression that the players that have stuck around feel negatively about Jack Parker.
                                Even Brett Bennett said positive things as he was shown the door.

                                Sure, Glass and the Saponari's may not like him. That would be expected.
                                I wonder what Corey Trivino would say? My guess is that Parker was fair and honest with him.

                                You can make a lot of friends in a coaching career. But coaches aren't there to be the players' friends.

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