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WarriorDJ
03-29-2011, 09:22 PM
How Chris Drury could not be in the top 3 is beyond me with all he has accomplished at every level, and he did win a Hobey Baker and a NCAA Championship. Brian Gionta would have to be up there, as well.
IMO Pellerin and Krog need to be in the discussion

dmjossel
03-30-2011, 05:14 AM
I think you are right... I also think that he has NHL potential... unlike MOST every other D1 player.

I have a question though... if I don't post on here will David josseline still "correct" me and tell me that I am wrong?

I wasn't planning on it, since I also think Da Costa has NHL potential.

You did spell my name wrong, though. Does that count as correction?

dmjossel
03-30-2011, 05:22 AM
IMO Pellerin and Krog need to be in the discussion

Montgomery. McEachern. Janney. Emma. Ahola. Roy. Imes. Cullen. Reasoner. Eaves. Weinrich. (Eric, not Alex. Sorry, Alex!)

Surely that's rarefied company, and Da Costa I think is an exceptional player... but I think top 3 all-time might be pushing it a bit, especially if you look past just forwards, and even if you judge just based on college careers. If he really blossoms in the NHL, maybe the perception will change a bit.

JCR98
03-30-2011, 11:20 AM
I think top 3 all-time might be pushing it a bit, especially if you look past just forwards, and even if you judge just based on college careers. If he really blossoms in the NHL, maybe the perception will change a bit.

Perhaps if Stephane had stayed another year (or two) and really come to dominate the league, he would have earned that distinction as well. Or perhaps if he'd had BC or BU level talent around him (no disrespect to his MC teammates).

As is, I think we can safely say he's the best MC player ever and one of the elite HEA alumni, but I don't think top three (or five). Maybe top ten, but I've only been following the league since 1994 so I can't say beyond that.

Certainly a rare talent, regardless. Still wish he would stay another year, even though I know just getting him back this year as a gift.

Hokydad
03-30-2011, 11:54 AM
Perhaps if Stephane had stayed another year (or two) and really come to dominate the league, he would have earned that distinction as well. Or perhaps if he'd had BC or BU level talent around him (no disrespect to his MC teammates).

As is, I think we can safely say he's the best MC player ever and one of the elite HEA alumni, but I don't think top three (or five). Maybe top ten, but I've only been following the league since 1994 so I can't say beyond that.

Certainly a rare talent, regardless. Still wish he would stay another year, even though I know just getting him back this year as a gift.

Jim Vesey was better

KnowItAll
03-30-2011, 11:58 AM
Jim Vesey was better

in comparison to his competition during his NCAA time, or better compared to DaCosta?

I have a feeling that DaCosta will play in more than 15 NHL games... and the leagues is MUCH tougher to get into now than it was in 1988

KnowItAll
03-30-2011, 12:10 PM
Fine means exactly that, fine.
Do you really think he became a bad goalie overnight? Like all goalies, Muse included, they have a bad stretch or run. they pick up, get back to work and move on. JC is fine and will have a very long pro career

FYI, the first goal was a power play goal and was a great shot off a pass to the high slot/cheated in point. saw it on tv replay and he was clearly screened. So what if a goalie was nervous, will only make him better down the road.

What should he do? Retire?

Do you remember Blaine Lacher?

I am not saying that he became a bad goalie over night... but Lacher did, or he was rushed and then fell apart... Goalie is about the only position that mostly mental, and when the goalie loses "it", he loses it.

I am suggesting that Cannata is not ready to go, not by a long shot, he needs a lot of polishing up. Joey is not hoping to be a decent ECHL goalie, Scott Barshard is... I have a feeling you know Scottie.
Cannatta is being groomed for the NHL... Jimmy Howard NEVER left those rebounds out front and it took him YEARS after he was much more polished than Cannatta to get to the NHL... the goalies Jimmy had in front of him in DEtroit were on par with the goalies Joey has in front of him in Vancouver

he might be fine, he is not fine now. and I think that he will benefit from another year of NCAA coaching and playing time.

walrus
03-30-2011, 12:43 PM
IMO Pellerin and Krog need to be in the discussion

I think you better look at Maine a little closer, Jean Yves Roy, David Capuano, Jimmy Montgomery

Hokydad
03-30-2011, 01:52 PM
in comparison to his competition during his NCAA time, or better compared to DaCosta?

I have a feeling that DaCosta will play in more than 15 NHL games... and the leagues is MUCH tougher to get into now than it was in 1988




As a college player JV was better. Probably right in that SD will have a long pro career, much longer than JV. Vesey was off the charts good. A Hobey baker winner and beyond dominant in college. The best player to play at MC

'MackFan
03-30-2011, 03:22 PM
As a college player JV was better. Probably right in that SD will have a long pro career, much longer than JV. Vesey was off the charts good. A Hobey baker winner and beyond dominant in college. The best player to play at MC

Hey Jim welcome to the USCHO board :)

joking aside why do you insist on using initials?

RENCEB
03-30-2011, 05:18 PM
As a college player JV was better. Probably right in that SD will have a long pro career, much longer than JV. Vesey was off the charts good. A Hobey baker winner and beyond dominant in college. The best player to play at MCTough to compare... I bet Stephane would have scored 240 pts in 4 years if he played a lot of games against Salem State, St. A's etc. Not taking anything away from the pride of Christopher Columbus High, Vesey was outstanding, and had some tremendous players around him (Rich Pion actually had a higher ppg average for his career) and Mark Ziliotto and Brad Atol were no slouches.
I have to put Reggie Stringer up there (in terms of MC players). An absolutely tireless player, played ungodly minutes per game (see BU playoff series) and had great balance and vision. He set up Kris Porter for a lot of goals. Reggie is still the all time leading scorer for Merrimack players who played their entire career in Hockey East.

Hokydad
03-30-2011, 08:32 PM
Tough to compare... I bet Stephane would have scored 240 pts in 4 years if he played a lot of games against Salem State, St. A's etc. Not taking anything away from the pride of Christopher Columbus High, Vesey was outstanding, and had some tremendous players around him (Rich Pion actually had a higher ppg average for his career) and Mark Ziliotto and Brad Atol were no slouches.
I have to put Reggie Stringer up there (in terms of MC players). An absolutely tireless player, played ungodly minutes per game (see BU playoff series) and had great balance and vision. He set up Kris Porter for a lot of goals. Reggie is still the all time leading scorer for Merrimack players who played their entire career in Hockey East.

I use initials because I am lazy. Anyone that watched JV play and his fire etc knows he would do just as well today. SD is a great MC player as well. If had to pick, JV all the way to start to build a team around.

dmjossel
03-31-2011, 02:09 AM
I use initials because I am lazy. Anyone that watched JV play and his fire etc knows he would do just as well today. SD is a great MC player as well. If had to pick, JV all the way to start to build a team around.

I revere Vesey's play about as much as anybody on this board. Despite how good this season was, I still think it falls short of what the '88 team did in a number of important ways. That team won a league championship. Sure, it was Division II, but that was the division they were in. They won it. They also won a round in the NCAAs, and this year's team didn't manage that. So there are still steps left to take.

However, the knock on Vesey that likely ended up placing him at Merrimack, and not at another Division 1 school at the time, and was really quite visible in his short stint with the Bruins, was his skating speed. The game and his linemates were going on ahead without him, and being behind the play meant that his vision, his hands, his shot, and even his strength in the corners, rarely became factors. He was a much more complete player at the AHL/IHL level, in great part due to the slower speed. I'd argue that the NHL, the AHL, and Hockey East are all faster-moving, faster-skating leagues now than they were back then. I think Vesey certainly could make this year's team, and be an imposing force-- but more so than back then, the way his line would play would have to be built around slowing the game down.

I think, in the end, a team is better off building around a fast-skating, puckhandling playmaker like Da Costa than they are around a hard-nosed power forward with good hands like Vesey, especially at today's faster pace. The ironic thing is that I always thought Vesey's game was more suited to the pros than Da Costa's, but right now I think Da Costa has a better shot at NHL longevity than Vesey got. Vesey had the size and the hands, but not the speed. Da Costa has the hands, the vision, and the speed-- perhaps not the size, but there are other players of smaller stature who have stuck in the NHL because they have the same skillset as Da Costa does.

It's really hard to compare across such long periods of time. I suppose if I had to pick between 4 years of Vesey or 2 years of Da Costa... it's close. 4 years of Vesey vs 4 years of Da Costa, in today's Hockey East? I think I have to go with Da Costa. With a player like that at center, you don't necessarily need a Vesey on the wings. An Ingraham will do.

Hokydad
03-31-2011, 07:06 AM
I revere Vesey's play about as much as anybody on this board. Despite how good this season was, I still think it falls short of what the '88 team did in a number of important ways. That team won a league championship. Sure, it was Division II, but that was the division they were in. They won it. They also won a round in the NCAAs, and this year's team didn't manage that. So there are still steps left to take.

However, the knock on Vesey that likely ended up placing him at Merrimack, and not at another Division 1 school at the time, and was really quite visible in his short stint with the Bruins, was his skating speed. The game and his linemates were going on ahead without him, and being behind the play meant that his vision, his hands, his shot, and even his strength in the corners, rarely became factors. He was a much more complete player at the AHL/IHL level, in great part due to the slower speed. I'd argue that the NHL, the AHL, and Hockey East are all faster-moving, faster-skating leagues now than they were back then. I think Vesey certainly could make this year's team, and be an imposing force-- but more so than back then, the way his line would play would have to be built around slowing the game down.

I think, in the end, a team is better off building around a fast-skating, puckhandling playmaker like Da Costa than they are around a hard-nosed power forward with good hands like Vesey, especially at today's faster pace. The ironic thing is that I always thought Vesey's game was more suited to the pros than Da Costa's, but right now I think Da Costa has a better shot at NHL longevity than Vesey got. Vesey had the size and the hands, but not the speed. Da Costa has the hands, the vision, and the speed-- perhaps not the size, but there are other players of smaller stature who have stuck in the NHL because they have the same skillset as Da Costa does.

It's really hard to compare across such long periods of time. I suppose if I had to pick between 4 years of Vesey or 2 years of Da Costa... it's close. 4 years of Vesey vs 4 years of Da Costa, in today's Hockey East? I think I have to go with Da Costa. With a player like that at center, you don't necessarily need a Vesey on the wings. An Ingraham will do.

Vesey wasnt a 21 year old freshman either......

RENCEB
03-31-2011, 11:46 AM
Despite how good this season was, I still think it falls short of what the '88 team did in a number of important ways. That team won a league championship. Sure, it was Division II, but that was the division they were in. They won it. They also won a round in the NCAAs, and this year's team didn't manage that. So there are still steps left to take.. So does the '88 team take a backseat to the '77-'78 team which won a National Championship? They lost in the ECAC's up at Bowdoin, but since the NESCAC schools (at that time) couldn't compete for a National Championship, MC got to go and croaked Lake Forest (IL) in the final. IMHO, the '76-'77 ECAC DII championship over the Ned Harkness led Union Dutchmen with Steve Baker in net may have been the best!

Yuppie Scum
03-31-2011, 01:18 PM
So does the '88 team take a backseat to the '77-'78 team which won a National Championship? They lost in the ECAC's up at Bowdoin, but since the NESCAC schools (at that time) couldn't compete for a National Championship, MC got to go and croaked Lake Forest (IL) in the final. IMHO, the '76-'77 ECAC DII championship over the Ned Harkness led Union Dutchmen with Steve Baker in net may have been the best!

Ottowa it is for SDC, will prob have to get ahold of his shirt.

HungryHungryHuskies
03-31-2011, 01:20 PM
http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/blog/puck_daddy/post/Ottawa-Senators-win-the-Stephane-Da-Costa-derby?urn=nhl-wp1514


Edit: whoops, little late on the trigger.

Kirk 18
03-31-2011, 02:23 PM
A great season for Merrimack, maybe the best ever? Any predictions on how the team might do next season? I see a lot of discussion about players, but is the core of the team still left and want about the question in net?

I was disheartned by their OT loss to Notre **** and that crappy OT goal that ended the season. After leading 3-1 what happened?

Thiessen'sBetter
03-31-2011, 04:55 PM
Eager to see what Toomey does. Watched him a lot growing up in Billerica. Was never on the same team as he was always 2 years behind me, but saw him play quite a bit. Fast and crafty are the two words that come to mind. Honestly never expected him to end up at a Hockey East school, but he's obviously worked hard and continued to improve enough to impress Dennehy.

Did you ever play with/against Dennis Macauley?

mainetwentytwelve
03-31-2011, 07:44 PM
didn't see this here yet...

uscho reporting that Da Costa officially signed a 2 year deal with Ottawa. Best of luck to him

http://www.uscho.com/2011/03/31/da-costa-flees-merrimack-for-ottawa-deal/