PDA

View Full Version : Denver vs. North Dakota Rivalry



Pages : [1] 2 3 4

dubbie31
03-27-2011, 12:43 PM
I posted this in the Denver thread but I want UND fans' opinions on this.

Ok, I have been thinking about this for a while. Is Colorado College still our biggest rival??? We all know the history and the proximity of the 2 schools. However, recent history shows a much more violent and nasty series of events. Denver vs CC is huge...dont get me wrong...but allow me to give my points as to why Denver vs. UND is now one of the nastiest and hard fought is college hockey.

1. Serious injuries - Robbie Bina and Jessie Martin both with serious spinal/neck injuries resulting from hits.
2. Gwozdecky being tossed by Todd Anderson twice against UND - including the famous march.
3. The overall physicality of the match up. These guys aren't trying to hit each other into the boards, they're trying to hit each other THROUGH THE BOARDS.
4. The HUGE games these 2 teams have played. 2005 final 5. 2005 NCAA Final. 2011 WCHA Final...to name a few.

These 2 teams HATE each other. I'm not sure if there is really any respect either. I'm not sure how the coaches feel either. I know they won't say anything publicly...but I have a feeling that Gwoz and Hakstol are not too fond of each other!!!

The rivalry with CC is a special rivalry however, the 2 teams share a mutual respect. We don't like each other, but we respect each other for the most part.

I know UND's rivalry with Minnesota is huge as well, but given Minnesota's mediocrity lately, have the games been bigger against the Goofers? or the Pios???

Siouxfan_inDenver
03-27-2011, 12:54 PM
Is and hopefully always will be Minnesota. Used to be Wisconsin for the #2 slot, but I would say DU has taken that over.

With the Big 6 Conference coming DU might become #1 someday.

jdr1
03-27-2011, 12:54 PM
I posted this in the Denver thread but I want UND fans' opinions on this.

Ok, I have been thinking about this for a while. Is Colorado College still our biggest rival??? We all know the history and the proximity of the 2 schools. However, recent history shows a much more violent and nasty series of events. Denver vs CC is huge...dont get me wrong...but allow me to give my points as to why Denver vs. UND is now one of the nastiest and hard fought is college hockey.

1. Serious injuries - Robbie Bina and Jessie Martin both with serious spinal/neck injuries resulting from hits.
2. Gwozdecky being tossed by Todd Anderson twice against UND - including the famous march.
3. The overall physicality of the match up. These guys aren't trying to hit each other into the boards, they're trying to hit each other THROUGH THE BOARDS.
4. The HUGE games these 2 teams have played. 2005 final 5. 2005 NCAA Final. 2011 WCHA Final...to name a few.

These 2 teams HATE each other. I'm not sure if there is really any respect either. I'm not sure how the coaches feel either. I know they won't say anything publicly...but I have a feeling that Gwoz and Hakstol are not too fond of each other!!!

The rivalry with CC is a special rivalry however, the 2 teams share a mutual respect. We don't like each other, but we respect each other for the most part.

I know UND's rivalry with Minnesota is huge as well, but given Minnesota's mediocrity lately, have the games been bigger against the Goofers? or the Pios???
I would have to say I agree with that! But I think to the fans of UND the golfing gophers is the biggest rival but to the team and coaches it is really swaying toward DU!! And after the sioux win today it will get bigger!!! SIOUX YA YA!!

dubbie31
03-27-2011, 12:57 PM
I would have to say I agree with that! But I think to the fans of UND the golfing gophers is the biggest rival but to the team and coaches it is really swaying toward DU!! And after the sioux win today it will get bigger!!! SIOUX YA YA!!

HAHA!!! I sense you're a bit confident today! I just hope for a good, hard hitting but clean game today. Would prefer to leave out the ugly incidents.

2 of the most storied programs in NCAA history duking it out....hoping for a CLASSIC!!!

dubbie31
03-27-2011, 12:58 PM
Is and hopefully always will be Minnesota. Used to be Wisconsin for the #2 slot, but I would say DU has taken that over.

With the Big 6 Conference coming DU might become #1 someday.

You can see the point I am making thought, right? I want CC to be our #1 rival as well. But, the recent history with the Sioux tells a different story....not to mention the Pioneers took the Sioux land....ooops...too soon??? :p :D

WestCoastSioux
03-27-2011, 01:02 PM
To answer your question, in my opinion the Sioux-Gopher rivalry is still the strongest. DU and UND have had some wild games and there is definitely a rivalry there too, but I don't think it comes close to the hatred of the Gophers by Sioux fans. Plus, it's not just the team that we Sioux fans dislike..it's the Gopher fans that we simply can't stand. I'm sure they feel the same about us.

Landshark
03-27-2011, 01:06 PM
Accurate assessments. For the Sioux fan, MN is still public enemy No. 1, however for the coaches and players DU is probably the bigger rival now given the recent history between the schools. I think is is fair to say Gwoz is more disliked than Lucia by all but it is probably still MN. Should be a great game tonight if the zebras let them play and do not chop up the flow too much. That CC/Mich game was painful to watch with numerous, inconsistent calls. Hope that does not happen tonight. Go Sioux.

jdr1
03-27-2011, 01:10 PM
HAHA!!! I sense you're a bit confident today! I just hope for a good, hard hitting but clean game today. Would prefer to leave out the ugly incidents.

2 of the most storied programs in NCAA history duking it out....hoping for a CLASSIC!!!
Yes I am!!! But it will for sure be a classic game today!!! SIOUX Ya Ya!!!
And yes the ugly stuff can stay away today!!

gopheritall
03-27-2011, 01:22 PM
I have a feeling this may change once UND and UMN are in different conferences. I hope not but I would expect UND/DU and UMN/WI to become the regular season rivals. UND and DU are very similar teams and both are very successful. UND has the edge in the whiniest coach though. ;)

Good luck to DU today!

Landshark
03-27-2011, 01:27 PM
An example of the rivalry.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ilwpXOQIjHc

AFHockeyFan
03-27-2011, 01:31 PM
If the Sioux hate DU, that's just another reason to like the Sioux.
Besides, isn't Sioux-Pioneers a natural rivalry that goes back hundreds of years?

dubbie31
03-27-2011, 01:32 PM
An example of the rivalry.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ilwpXOQIjHc

I remember talking to some of the DU players after that when Gwoz was on the dasher....half of them were scared of him falling...the other half thought it was kinda funny...but loved that he did all of that to stand up for them.

cross cheque
03-27-2011, 02:19 PM
To answer your question, in my opinion the Sioux-Gopher rivalry is still the strongest. DU and UND have had some wild games and there is definitely a rivalry there too, but I don't think it comes close to the hatred of the Gophers by Sioux fans. Plus, it's not just the team that we Sioux fans dislike..it's the Gopher fans that we simply can't stand. I'm sure they feel the same about us.

I agree with most of this. I really like the DU rivalry because they are a great team consistently and the games are always exciting while UM has been lackluster in the last few years. Pio fans don't travel as to the REA as well as UM, for good reason(distance). I think Hak and Gwoz respect each other's abilities and that's about it. I would rather see DU advance to the FF by beating us than UM and I think that's the difference in the rivalries.

tbodin23
03-27-2011, 02:31 PM
1. Serious injuries - Robbie Bina and Jessie Martin both with serious spinal/neck injuries resulting from hits.
2. Gwozdecky being tossed by Todd Anderson twice against UND - including the famous march.
3. The overall physicality of the match up. These guys aren't trying to hit each other into the boards, they're trying to hit each other THROUGH THE BOARDS.
4. The HUGE games these 2 teams have played. 2005 final 5. 2005 NCAA Final. 2011 WCHA Final...to name a few.

These 2 teams HATE each other. I'm not sure if there is really any respect either. I'm not sure how the coaches feel either. I know they won't say anything publicly...but I have a feeling that Gwoz and Hakstol are not too fond of each other!!!

The rivalry with CC is a special rivalry however, the 2 teams share a mutual respect. We don't like each other, but we respect each other for the most part.

I know UND's rivalry with Minnesota is huge as well, but given Minnesota's mediocrity lately, have the games been bigger against the Goofers? or the Pios???

Agree with what most everyone is saying. There is a difference between the fans and the players. The fans still get most fired up when MN comes up to Grand Forks, but I would say the bad blood between the actual teams has fallen to almost zero. DU on the other hand... Different story.

It's funny to me that Dubbie left out, in my mind, the key game that set up the whole sequence. DU 1-0, March 27, 2004. UND was 3-0-1 that year against DU outscoring them 21-6. I was at that game and not to dwell on it, but that game was a flat out miracle for DU. The DU fans by us at that game genuinely could not believe they won. From the recap - Gwozdecky "It was kind of a harmless play.", Fulgham "Bullís shot actually hit my stick and redirected it just enough for it to go in." Fulgham was about 15 feet away from the goal when shot hit his stick (he wasn't trying to redirect it) and went precisely right over Jordan Parise's shoulder. UND absolutely bombarded Berkhoel in that 3rd period, but a multitude of grade A deflections and redirects refused to go in. O.K, whatever, that happens in hockey. Except...

DU then doesn't just pull one upset, they cruise on and win the whole thing. Again, against Maine I would say that DU was very fortunate. Then the next year, the tables are turned and DU actually has the best team. In the NC game UND fans think maybe turnabout is fair play and we'll steal this one. The Sioux play great, control the first period, outshoot Denver 46-28, and lose what was really a razor tight game 4-1, when the better team put the hammer down in the second half of the 3rd period. Oh yea, then there was that other thing that year at the WCHA tourney where Bina got his neck broken on worst hit I've ever seen at a college hockey game. So anyway...

From a UND coach/player perspective (based on a couple conversations), DU George got lucky as hell, then they won it again the only year they really had a superior team. In the 90s and early 2000s how many times did UND/Michigan/BC have a superior team and NOT win it all. Oh, about a cumulative 10 times. George has the best team exactly once and they win it all, and that's right after the 2004 gift from God. But George doesn't think he got lucky, George thinks he's a coaching genius and they deserved both of those titles (again, this is from a UND player/coach perspective). Add in the Bina thing, and you have a situation where the UND crew CAN'T STAND Gwozdecky. Now, throw in George getting tossed from a couple (!) games in GF, 3-4 more years of extremely physical games that have almost crossed the line a couple times, and now the Jesse Martin injury/aftermath and you have a completely mutual stew of hatred between these two teams. Fans of both teams over these years might agree that today's game will have intensity greater than a NC game. I mean, can you really hate Maine, or Miami, or Michigan, or BC. No. There's not enough of this kind of history with any team outside the WCHA.

Now, there's no particular reason for the FANS of UND and DU to hate each other. I think it's a little sad that it's shaded that way recently. No matter what happens today I hope that stuff dials down a little. We're in the same boat in the battle against the big school, Big Ten, "let's take all the TV money" alliance.

dubbie31
03-27-2011, 02:40 PM
Agree with what most everyone is saying. There is a difference between the fans and the players. The fans still get most fired up when MN comes up to Grand Forks, but I would say the bad blood between the actual teams has fallen to almost zero. DU on the other hand... Different story.

It's funny to me that Dubbie left out, in my mind, the key game that set up the whole sequence. DU 1-0, March 27, 2004. UND was 3-0-1 that year against DU outscoring them 21-6. I was at that game and not to dwell on it, but that game was a flat out miracle for DU. The DU fans by us at that game genuinely could not believe they won. From the recap - Gwozdecky "It was kind of a harmless play.", Fulgham "Bull’s shot actually hit my stick and redirected it just enough for it to go in." Fulgham was about 15 feet away from the goal when shot hit his stick (he wasn't trying to redirect it) and went precisely right over Jordan Parise's shoulder. UND absolutely bombarded Berkhoel in that 3rd period, but a multitude of grade A deflections and redirects refused to go in. O.K, whatever, that happens in hockey. Except...

DU then doesn't just pull one upset, they cruise on and win the whole thing. Again, against Maine I would say that DU was very fortunate. Then the next year, the tables are turned and DU actually has the best team. In the NC game UND fans think maybe turnabout is fair play and we'll steal this one. The Sioux play great, control the first period, outshoot Denver 46-28, and lose what was really a razor tight game 4-1, when the better team put the hammer down in the second half of the 3rd period. Oh yea, then there was that other thing that year at the WCHA tourney where Bina got his neck broken on worst hit I've ever seen at a college hockey game. So anyway...

From a UND coach/player perspective (based on a couple conversations), DU George got lucky as hell, then they won it again the only year they really had a superior team. In the 90s and early 2000s how many times did UND/Michigan/BC have a superior team and NOT win it all. Oh, about a cumulative 10 times. George has the best team exactly once and they win it all, and that's right after the 2004 gift from God. But George doesn't think he got lucky, George thinks he's a coaching genius and they deserved both of those titles (again, this is from a UND player/coach perspective). Add in the Bina thing, and you have a situation where the UND crew CAN'T STAND Gwozdecky. Now, throw in George getting tossed from a couple (!) games in GF, 3-4 more years of extremely physical games that have almost crossed the line a couple times, and now the Jesse Martin injury/aftermath and you have a completely mutual stew of hatred between these two teams. Fans of both teams over these years might agree that today's game will have intensity greater than a NC game. I mean, can you really hate Maine, or Miami, or Michigan, or BC. No. There's not enough of this kind of history with any team outside the WCHA.

Now, there's no particular reason for the FANS of UND and DU to hate each other. I think it's a little sad that it's shaded that way recently. No matter what happens today I hope that stuff dials down a little. We're in the same boat in the battle against the big school, Big Ten, "let's take all the TV money" alliance.


That's a GREAT POST. I can't believe I left out that regional. I remember how good that 2004 team was for UND. Parise, Toews...to name a couple. I remember the defensemen on that team being MASSIVE.

That 2004 Denver team just refused to give up. Adam Berkhoel probably put together the greatest 2 months of goaltending I have ever seen in 20 years of being a college hockey fan. It was stunning how he stole those games and how Denver just did not quit.

I see same mindset with this team. It doesn't matter what the score is, this Denver team has a refuse to lose attitude.

Today's game is going to be a very interesting chess match between Gwoz and Hak. I'm excited as a Denver fan and as a Hockey fan!

SanTropez
03-27-2011, 02:52 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iBFGJ6QwD-o&feature=player_detailpage


Video is a bit grainy but this is some classic stuff and IMO is the best rivalry in College Hockey.

sfo19
03-27-2011, 03:04 PM
As a Sioux fan, there is no team I hate more than DU. I know the Gopher rivalry goes way back and all that, but I think I hate DU more and consider that a bigger rivalry because when I attended UND (2006-09) that was the rivalry that was more intense. Between the bench clearing brawl in 08 and Gwozdecky's walk on the ice, to the battles for league titles...The Gophers we kind of owned while I was there, so it was too one-sided to be a rivalry. So that's why I hate DU and think it's a bigger rivalry. I do respect the DU program because they are a team that even when you think they are down and out, you can't consider them that because "it's DU." And with the BTHC coming, I think the UND/DU rivalry will only get nastier.

Fighting Sioux 23
03-27-2011, 03:10 PM
When I was growing up, the only rivalry that REALLY mattered was Minnesota. The Wisconsin-UND rivalry was a bit before my time. However, in the past 5 years or so, really since the Bina incident, North Dakota and Denver's rivalry has taken off. When you add that to the Gophers being pretty mediocre the last few seasons, and Denver and North Dakota consistently battling for supremacy in the conference, I think Denver is our biggest rival. For the casual fan, it will be Minnesota, but for many of us who follow the team closely, Denver has supplanted Minnesota in the top spot.

dubbie31
03-27-2011, 03:15 PM
When I was growing up, the only rivalry that REALLY mattered was Minnesota. The Wisconsin-UND rivalry was a bit before my time. However, in the past 5 years or so, really since the Bina incident, North Dakota and Denver's rivalry has taken off. When you add that to the Gophers being pretty mediocre the last few seasons, and Denver and North Dakota consistently battling for supremacy in the conference, I think Denver is our biggest rival. For the casual fan, it will be Minnesota, but for many of us who follow the team closely, Denver has supplanted Minnesota in the top spot.

Your opinion is the one I was waiting for!!! You just have that wealth of college hockey knowledge that I like. There is Denver vs. Colorado College, UND vs. the Golfing Goofers......but then you have Denver vs. North Dakota...these games are simply a different breed.

Farce Poobah
03-27-2011, 03:20 PM
There's a lot more similarities than differences between these programs. The tradition each has built, the recruiting patterns of drawing blue chip recruits from all over, the on-ice NHL style of play, and the long-term success of each (7=7) all make for the hallmarks of a great rivalry.

I've been watching North Dakota and WCHA hockey for 35 years, and the UND-DU games have always exhibited high-speed, high-skill, physical, "for men only", strap-your-pads-on-tight kind of hockey. Think Glenn Anderson flying down the wing. Think Craig Ludwig nailing a check into the boards. Its been this way for a long time.

I'll contrast this with UND vs CC games; that series has had a great history of high-speed, great flow, great playmaking and goaltending. But it lacks the physical aspect. When UND plays CC, there's less hitting, fewer whistles, and long stretches without penalties.

The DU-UND games are also less predictable. Today might be 1-0 or it might be 8-2. It might be free flowing with few penalties or it might be rough and tumble with lots of 4 on 4. It might be the All-Americans with the goals, or it might be the fourth liners that nobody expected. Maybe the coaches will samba the blue line. You just never know. And that's what makes these games great entertainment.