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chapmaja
03-28-2010, 11:26 PM
In the first OT of the Michigan Miami game Michigan appeared to score the GW goal, but the officials waved it off saying the whistle had blown prior to the puck entering the net.

That appeared to be the correct call according to the radio announcers who said the whistle had blown.

My question, and the question raised by Michigan's radio announcers is why was the whistle blown.

Miami was called for a high sticking penalty after the whistle.

What is the rule on a delayed penalty call? Is the whistle blown when the puck is touched by the offending team or is when the offending team controls the puck? The puck apparently was touched, but not controlled by Miami before Michigan knocked it in the net.

The radio announcers had not gotten an explanation on the call by the time they left the air after the game.

I'm not saying Michigan lost because of the officials, but that call could have been huge.

Michigan had chances to win the game and Miami made big stops and got some luck and sometimes the team that wins isn't the best team on the ide that day, but the luckiest.


For the record I could not watch because I don't get ESPNU or Comcast who had the local coverage in the AA area.

bose301s
03-28-2010, 11:28 PM
Nope, as long as it kept U of M from winning it was a good call.

Driftryder
03-28-2010, 11:28 PM
In the first OT of the Michigan Miami game Michigan appeared to score the GW goal, but the officials waved it off saying the whistle had blown prior to the puck entering the net.

That appeared to be the correct call according to the radio announcers who said the whistle had blown.

My question, and the question raised by Michigan's radio announcers is why was the whistle blown.

Miami was called for a high sticking penalty after the whistle.

What is the rule on a delayed penalty call? Is the whistle blown when the puck is touched by the offending team or is when the offending team controls the puck? The puck apparently was touched, but not controlled by Miami before Michigan knocked it in the net.

The radio announcers had not gotten an explanation on the call by the time they left the air after the game.

I'm not saying Michigan lost because of the officials, but that call could have been huge.

Michigan had chances to win the game and Miami made big stops and got some luck and sometimes the team that wins isn't the best team on the ide that day, but the luckiest.


For the record I could not watch because I don't get ESPNU or Comcast who had the local coverage in the AA area.

Eastern Bias

WeAreNDHockey
03-28-2010, 11:29 PM
Whistle blows for all sorts of reasons. He was calling a penalty prior to the puck going in. He could have blown the play dead because he thought the puck was controlled by Miami, covered by the goalie, or because he lost sight of it. All are valid reasons by rule. My guess is he either lost sight, or thought Knapp had it covered.

STATEdude3
03-28-2010, 11:31 PM
I felt that both teams got screwed by quick whistles, but the one in OT that negated the Michigan goal was REALLY BAD.

SiouxFanatic
03-28-2010, 11:34 PM
A goal or two by UND were disallowed by WCHA refs because of their "intent to blow the whistle." It didn't matter if the puck was in before or after the ref blew the whistle. If he had the intent to blow the whistle it isn't a goal.

Here's the example of the disallowed Sioux goal:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLGp7pUbPSM

You'll see that the puck was clearly in the net before the ref actually blew the whistle. It was still disallowed cause of his intent to blow it.

So I agree with the no goal call by the refs.

UMBand
03-28-2010, 11:39 PM
A goal or two by UND were disallowed by WCHA refs because of their "intent to blow the whistle." It didn't matter if the puck was in before or after the ref blew the whistle. If he had the intent to blow the whistle it isn't a goal.

Here's the example of the disallowed Sioux goal:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLGp7pUbPSM

You'll see that the puck was clearly in the net before the ref actually blew the whistle. It was still disallowed cause of his intent to blow it.

So I agree with the no goal call by the refs.
That isn't applicable here. This wasn't an "intent to blow the whistle" call.

It was more of a "ref out of position/can't see the puck freely sliding in the crease" call.

I'd also argue Hunwick had the puck frozen on Miami's second goal, but that's another argument entirely.

The Rube
03-28-2010, 11:42 PM
Both calls were close, either way. While I'm really glad the game didn't end on a call like that, I wouldn't fault the refs no matter what they called at that instant. It was a snap-judgment on both, and since there wasn't CONCLUSIVE evidence to overturn the call on the ice, there was no reversal.

It's a fast game, and I rip the refs as much as the next guy when they deserve it, but tonight, I didn't see too many things to complain about.

Gurtholfin
03-28-2010, 11:42 PM
The whistle had blown. Doesn't matter why at that point. Happens a few times EVERY game and you just have to move on.

Michigan had every opportunity to win that game including two power plays at the end of the 3rd and into OT. Gotta get it done or as we all know, a fluky goal can happen.

Don't forget that the refs decided not to call/or missed a high stick to the helmet on a Michigan player late in the third while Miami was dominating. Give Miami that PP at that time and maybe the game doesn't even go to OT.

chapmaja
03-28-2010, 11:47 PM
So basically these officials pretty much weren't very good and influenced the way the game was played. That was the impression I got from the announcers on the Michigan broadcast.

It did seem like a lot of quick whistles in the game, more than any other game I've seen this year.

I don't officiate hockey, but do officate several other sports.

The #1 rule in officiating is to be in proper position. The #2 rule is to call only what you see (not what you think you see).

Either this official lost sight of the puck (at which point the whistle is a good call) or he screwed the call by not calling what he actually saw and called what he thought he saw. I got the impression all game long these officials sucked at rule #1, being in position to make the proper call.

It's no excuse, Michigan could have won this game and maybe should have won the game. They got 57 shots on goal and only scored twice.

Good Luck to Miami in the FF.

The Rube
03-28-2010, 11:50 PM
The ESPNU announcers were pretty good, IMO (and entertaining without taking away from the game, which was an added bonus). As far as I could tell, they wondered about the initial calls, but understood them as the rules dictate.

Gurtholfin
03-28-2010, 11:52 PM
S

The #1 rule in officiating is to be in proper position. The #2 rule is to call only what you see (not what you think you see).

Either this official lost sight of the puck (at which point the whistle is a good call) or he screwed the call by not calling what he actually saw and called what he thought he saw. I got the impression all game long these officials sucked at rule #1, being in position to make the proper call.


He was on the goal line, right where he should be but the puck was on the opposite side of the goalie. The goal line officials are supposed to blow the whistle when they lose sight of the puck, which he did.

Michigan deserved to win the game because they matched or outplayed Miami for more of that game, but not because of that whistle.

chapmaja
03-28-2010, 11:57 PM
Nope, as long as it kept U of M from winning it was a good call.

I just have to ask. Which school are those records of you list in the signature? Is that MTU? Whoever it is they are pretty bad similar wining precentage to my HS's football team minus the one winning season. (We went 0-9 more this decade than had multiple win seasons (2-7 or better) this decade.

The Rube
03-28-2010, 11:58 PM
He was on the goal line, right where he should be but the puck was on the opposite side of the goalie. The goal line officials are supposed to blow the whistle when they lose sight of the puck, which he did.

Michigan deserved to win the game because they matched or outplayed Miami for more of that game, but not because of that whistle.

Being outshot 20-6 (most of them good shots) and rarely being in MI's zone in the first OT would seem to agree with your assessment.

However, the cliched "OT Rule" kicked in: The more dominant team will lose on a breakaway/weird/non-traditional goal.

I even sorta called it, by saying that if Miami was going to win, it wouldn't be because they set up in the zone. They were too tired, they were losing their feet, etc.

MI was completely outplaying them in the OTs.

ExileOnDaytonStreet
03-29-2010, 12:03 AM
Whistle blows for all sorts of reasons. He was calling a penalty prior to the puck going in. He could have blown the play dead because he thought the puck was controlled by Miami, covered by the goalie, or because he lost sight of it. All are valid reasons by rule. My guess is he either lost sight, or thought Knapp had it covered.


The whistle had blown. Doesn't matter why at that point. Happens a few times EVERY game and you just have to move on.

Michigan had every opportunity to win that game including two power plays at the end of the 3rd and into OT. Gotta get it done or as we all know, a fluky goal can happen.


The ESPNU announcers were pretty good, IMO (and entertaining without taking away from the game, which was an added bonus). As far as I could tell, they wondered about the initial calls, but understood them as the rules dictate.

What these guys said.

Whether they lost sight of it, or felt that Knapp covered it, they had enough reason to blow it dead. Even if it wasn't the right call, it was fair relative to the officiating in the rest of the game. There were missed calls both ways. It happens all the time, and you have to play through it.

To say it another way: You never lose in overtime by one call. You had 60 minutes to win the game, and you went to overtime. Anyone want to claim that Michigan didn't have any chancees to win in regulation? Is that one "missed" call the only reason they didn't win?

chapmaja
03-29-2010, 12:04 AM
The whistle had blown. Doesn't matter why at that point. Happens a few times EVERY game and you just have to move on.

Michigan had every opportunity to win that game including two power plays at the end of the 3rd and into OT. Gotta get it done or as we all know, a fluky goal can happen.

Don't forget that the refs decided not to call/or missed a high stick to the helmet on a Michigan player late in the third while Miami was dominating. Give Miami that PP at that time and maybe the game doesn't even go to OT.

I was not aware of the missed HS call in the 3rd period. I am not doubting that Michigan had chances to win it. I think that was a game the better team on the ice didn't win tonight.

Michigan proved why they were predicted to be a title contended at the start of the season the last month. Too bad it took until they were litterally against the wall to make a run like this.

Terrierbyassociation
03-29-2010, 12:04 AM
At least you didn't get screwed by the intent to blow the whistle horse-pucky.

The Rube
03-29-2010, 12:06 AM
What these guys said.

Whether they lost sight of it, or felt that Knapp covered it, they had enough reason to blow it dead. Even if it wasn't the right call, it was fair relative to the officiating in the rest of the game. There were missed calls both ways. It happens all the time, and you have to play through it.

To say it another way: You never lose in overtime by one call. You had 60 minutes to win the game, and you went to overtime. Anyone want to claim that Michigan didn't have any chancees to win in regulation? Is that one "missed" call the only reason they didn't win?

Not to mention the multiple pipes and such. ;)

Brainiac
03-29-2010, 12:08 AM
Ugh. I'll be bitter about this one for awhile. I'm entirely disappointed with this outcome. I actually thought the officiating was poor all the way around. No facet of the game was left out. That all being said, the officials didn't give this game to Miami. Connor Knapp gave this game to Miami. This was one of the best games I've ever watched and I'll be rooting for Miami in Detroit next week.

With all due respect to the other remaining teams, I got the impression those were the two best teams in the tournament. Miami is a fantastic team and is fun to watch. Good luck in the FF.

speekeasy8
03-29-2010, 12:08 AM
Yes, they screwed up by blowing the whistle when the puck was still loose.

No, they didn't screw up by disallowing the goal. Heck, even if the whistle was a split-second after the goal instead of before, it still wouldn't have counted, since the official at that point was intending to blow the whistle.

It happens. Move on.