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View Full Version : WCHA First Round: MN @ UND



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Turk 77
03-15-2010, 06:04 AM
Congrats to the Sioux. They are peaking at the right time. I suspect they will make some noise in the post season. As far as the head hunting goes it was bush league but that kind of stuff happens on both sides bottem line if the Gophers wanted to make a statement they would have scored on the 5 minute power play but goals have eluded this team all year. The right team won this time. Good luck in the post season

ScoobyDoo
03-15-2010, 07:57 AM
I just hope Wehrs and Leddy are ok. On to next year.

Roben
03-15-2010, 08:09 AM
I'm already tired of hearing about the cheap shot and poor officiating. Guess what Gopher fans...calls can go our way too! Also, it's the playoffs, so its a bit harder to get calls in your favor, things have to be fairly obvious. Now, for the cheap shot...I hope Wehrs is okay and will return. The Gophers should have been able to score at least one goal on the 5 minute power play...too bad I didn't see the kill with the "technical difficulties" on FCS. The game last night just fueled the rivalry even more.

Go Fighting Sioux!

PCM
03-15-2010, 08:12 AM
Could you please conduct a symposium for the ignoramii in your fanbase who continue to insist it wasn't that bad and would be a travesty if he's suspended for the hit? :p
Sadly, we both know that there are people in every fan base who will rationalize, excuse and justify any action by a player on their team.

SJHovey
03-15-2010, 08:45 AM
I agree with PCM. I think Matt will, and should, sit for at least the Thursday game. I think he knows he made a mistake. It's too bad, because I think all he was trying to do was fire up his team and the crowd with a big hit during a period in which the Gophers were controlling a fair amount of the play. Matt also hasn't been a headhunter type of player during his career at UND, so I think any intent to injure would be out of character for him.

Nevertheless, the hit was illegal and dangerous and has to be discouraged through appropriate punishment by the league. Doing so sends a message not only to the offending player, but the rest of the players in the league.

As for the series itself, I'm not going to go through any more of this thread other than the last page or two I looked at this morning (I'm sure it's a bit of a trainwreck), but here are my comments. I apologize if they are duplicative.

First, I thought it was actually a pretty well officiated series, although things seemed to be getting away from the officials as it went on. I think they reported on the radio that both teams had to approve the use of the same officiating crew for the 3rd game, so the coaches must have felt that Hunt and Shep were doing a satisfactory job, or at least better than whoever might replace them.

One of the things that seems to occur with some frequency is that calls one team finds questionable are then capitalized on by the opposing team. That happened in Minnesota's favor Saturday and North Dakota's Sunday, and always seems to exacerbate the grievance with the call.

I didn't think the officiating affected any of the three games, or the outcome of the series. I'll admit to a bias, but I think UND was the better team in the series, and playing at home, resulted in the win. Minnesota, inexplicably, wasn't ready to play Friday. Saturday they did a good job, and the Sioux did a poor job, of capitalizing on special teams situations. Sunday it was reversed, and imho that was the difference in both games.

I feel sorry for Frattin and the scrutiny he will rightly be under for his hit on Wehrs, because I thought this 3 game series was as good a series as I can recall him playing. I loved the play of Gregoire, along with VV, and having Matt step up his game really gives the Sioux two top lines going into the playoffs.

I hope Wehrs is ok. Now it's on to St. Paul. Beat the Dogs!

The Rube
03-15-2010, 08:52 AM
Could you please conduct a symposium for the ignoramii in your fanbase who continue to insist it wasn't that bad and would be a travesty if he's suspended for the hit? :p

Don't venture over to SiouxSports. My Parise people are *ing stupid. :eek:

brianvf
03-15-2010, 08:57 AM
Don't venture over to SiouxSports. My Parise people are *ing stupid. :eek:

I think the same could be said of some of the posts on GPL right now. :eek:

:)

Dirty
03-15-2010, 09:23 AM
Sadly, we both know that there are people in every fan base who will rationalize, excuse and justify any action by a player on their team.

Matt Mother *ing Frattin is innocent. The lawnmower who made him do it!

PCM
03-15-2010, 10:08 AM
I think Matt will, and should, sit for at least the Thursday game. I think he knows he made a mistake.
Considering the magnitude of Sunday's game and its outcome, Frattin was rather subdued during his postgame comments. I think he knew it was a bad hit, one he shouldn't have delivered. In two and a half seasons at UND, I've seen him play physically, but I haven't seen him do anything remotely similar to the hit on Wehrs.

That's why I have a problem with people who claim to know a player's intent when something like this happens. There are times when it's possible to judge intent, such as a retalitaory hit or when a player makes a statement about being out to get someone or a player has a record of cheap play. But absent that type of evidence, I'm willing to give players the benefit of the doubt.

It's a fast, physical, intense and sometimes emotional game in which players are required to make dozens of split-second decisions. Whether it's making a pass or making a check, they're not always going to make the correct decision.

That's no reason to excuse or overlook illegal hits, especially when they result in injuries. If it takes suspensions to encourage coaches to emphasize the need for safety, then that's what should happen. But the WCHA needs to be consistent in calling penalties and handing out supplementary discipline. And when it isn't, the NCAA needs to hold the league accountable.

bik4u62
03-15-2010, 10:21 AM
Frattin made a bad decision, and should be punished. 1 game.
Agree

If it happens again, 3 games,
Agree

...just like Marvin.
Stop. The league might put these hits in the same category, but don't you. Fratty's hit was from the front - at least Wehrs had a chance. Marvin is strictly a sucker puncher. Dude and the rest of the SCSU clan who want jail time for Frattin need to remember that they defended Marvilous for 2 months after his full-speed leaping elbow CFB to Genoway's skull. The WCHA continues to cause their own problems. If the refs had just tossed Matt for the rest of the game, as they should have, this would all be over.

The penalty on Kangas was 100% correct. But I supported Alex. I hope every goalie has the nards to protect their crease like that.

Unless you bleed purple & gold - Mazzocco is an intolerable homey.

PCM
03-15-2010, 11:58 AM
looks like Frattin glided in from about 10 feet away. he was on his skates up until contact and the last photo makes it look like hew as leading with his shoulder.
I saw it live from a good angle. Frattin left his feet, and I immediately knew it would be a five minute major for charging. Watch the video. He leaves his feet. There's a photo in the Grand Forks Herald showing both of Frattin's skates in the air. Images just before the point he leaves his feet prove nothing because it's simply taking the hit out of context. I'm amazed that anyone can even attempt to argue this.

cF[Authentic]
03-15-2010, 12:25 PM
I saw it live from a good angle. Frattin left his feet, and I immediately knew it would be a five minute major for charging. Watch the video. He leaves his feet. There's a photo in the Grand Forks Herald showing both of Frattin's skates in the air. Images just before the point he leaves his feet prove nothing because it's simply taking the hit out of context. I'm amazed that anyone can even attempt to argue this.

I would love to see the video, because the only replays I saw was the one immediately after the hit on the live feed. at the time, i thought it was charging and he left his feet and led with his elbows. however, since the only replay i've seen is the slowed down pictures, so that made me rethink the severity of the hit.

I love that saying that the pictures show he is still on his feet is somehow attempting to argue that it wasn't a dirty hit. I posted the pictures and posted the facts I saw based on the pictures. He is still on his skates in the last picture. That's not trying to argue for or against something, that's a fact based on the last picture.

bik4u62
03-15-2010, 01:04 PM
;4698400']I love that saying that the pictures show he is still on his feet is somehow attempting to argue that it wasn't a dirty hit.
I think the discussion about whether his feet are on the ice is to determine whether he went for Wehr's head or not.

If so, a suspension is near certain because the league is trying to take a stand against that. If not, then it's charging - 5 min. major - and a judgement on he "dirty" factor makes a suspension far less certain.

Steve_MN
03-15-2010, 01:04 PM
I mentioned before with Derrick Shepard and Marco Hunt officiating the Gophers didn't have a prayer. On top of that you get the dirtiest team i n the WCHA and you see the result.

Nothing will be said to Derrick Shepard, hbis Daddy is the head of officials for the WCHA.

Now now..... Derrick was suspended by Daddy before.... of course, that was 13 years ago as a linesman, and Greg suspended the whole crew for like 2 weeks.


;4698400']I would love to see the video, because the only replays I saw was the one immediately after the hit on the live feed. at the time, i thought it was charging and he left his feet and led with his elbows. however, since the only replay i've seen is the slowed down pictures, so that made me rethink the severity of the hit.

I love that saying that the pictures show he is still on his feet is somehow attempting to argue that it wasn't a dirty hit. I posted the pictures and posted the facts I saw based on the pictures. He is still on his skates in the last picture. That's not trying to argue for or against something, that's a fact based on the last picture.

That angle is really bad to figure this out. The angle that FSN had from the other side of the rink was much clearer. He led with his elbows/forearms directly to the face, while jumping. Textbook intent to injure/charging. I would expect at least a 1 game suspension, maybe 2 (the 2 would be the equivalent of the DQ that Hunt/Sheppard should have given last night, plus a 1 day suspension). I don't think 3 games is warranted, though. This was a first infraction, so typically only 1 game.

cF[Authentic]
03-15-2010, 01:08 PM
Now now..... Derrick was suspended by Daddy before.... of course, that was 13 years ago as a linesman, and Greg suspended the whole crew for like 2 weeks.



That angle is really bad to figure this out. The angle that FSN had from the other side of the rink was much clearer. He led with his elbows/forearms directly to the face, while jumping. Textbook intent to injure/charging. I would expect at least a 1 game suspension, maybe 2 (the 2 would be the equivalent of the DQ that Hunt/Sheppard should have given last night, plus a 1 day suspension). I don't think 3 games is warranted, though. This was a first infraction, so typically only 1 game.

I just want to see the other angles. Please post a link to a video or pictures of the other angle, so we can see what happened. Right now, the only thing I (and anyone who didn't see the game) is going off is the pictures we've already seen.

Steve_MN
03-15-2010, 01:12 PM
;4698508']I just want to see the other angles. Please post a link to a video or pictures of the other angle, so we can see what happened. Right now, the only thing I (and anyone who didn't see the game) is going off is the pictures we've already seen.

I'd love to.... I don't know that any clips from FSN made it to YouTube just yet, though. :(

ScoobyDoo
03-15-2010, 01:13 PM
;4698508']I just want to see the other angles. Please post a link to a video or pictures of the other angle, so we can see what happened. Right now, the only thing I (and anyone who didn't see the game) is going off is the pictures we've already seen.

You just want to justify the unjustifiable.

cF[Authentic]
03-15-2010, 01:19 PM
You just want to justify the unjustifiable.

I found this link in another thread: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AQ_hmLt7Pew

I don't know if it's the FSN feed, but it doesn't matter. From that angle (the first time I've seen it not-live) it definitely looks like he leaves his feet and his hands hit Wehrs in the face. Wehrs does duck down a little, but Frattin was clearly trying to run over him. Should get a game at the least, but I wouldn't be surprised with two.

Now see how I justified that his hit was ok? Wait, no I didn't. :rolleyes:

PCM
03-15-2010, 01:50 PM
;4698400']He is still on his skates in the last picture. That's not trying to argue for or against something, that's a fact based on the last picture.
Was someone arguing that Frattin was never on his skates? :confused: How does a picture of him on both skates just before he launched himself into Wehrs prove anything other than the fact that he was on his skates before he was off them?

flyund
03-15-2010, 02:16 PM
How was this not a penalty
http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4009/4435438099_da63d4616f_o.jpg