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View Full Version : Union College Hockey 2009-2010: Playoff series win? Check. Albany? This is the year.



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DMA
03-03-2010, 06:38 AM
Dan Greene's blog has an interesting analysis of Union's All-ECAC selections and Wally's dissing.

http://unionhockeyblog.blogspot.com/

electpuck
03-03-2010, 08:25 AM
ECAC awards are available the day of the Tournament Banquet, Thursday of Championship weekend.

Ralph Baer
03-03-2010, 08:39 AM
Dan Greene's blog has an interesting analysis of Union's All-ECAC selections and Wally's dissing.

http://unionhockeyblog.blogspot.com/

I am not saying that MVT didn't deserve the first team award and the blogger's other statements, but any analysis that includes non-ECAC game stats is faulty.

ADK11
03-03-2010, 08:53 AM
OK Ken, tell us what you REALLY think..
http://www.dailygazette.com/weblogs/schott/2010/mar/02/valery-trabucco-screwed-by-ecac-hockey-coaches/

ADK11
03-03-2010, 09:06 AM
I am not saying that MVT didn't deserve the first team award and the blogger's other statements, but any analysis that includes non-ECAC game stats is faulty.Actually Dan does mention that in-league stats should be the basis for selection (though it does take him a little time before he gets to that).. and I also think that the non-league stats should at least considered as part of a player's body of work, though agree it should not be relied on heavily.

I'm still not real upset about the MVT/Backman thing and maybe it will give MVT an extra incentive to prove everyone wrong.. and actually there is some precedent with this, as I recall that the year Trevor Koenig was named an All-American he was only selected to 2nd Team in ECAC.. must be part of that Boston/East Coast conspiracy thingy.

FlagDUDE08
03-03-2010, 09:23 AM
OK Ken, tell us what you REALLY think..
http://www.dailygazette.com/weblogs/schott/2010/mar/02/valery-trabucco-screwed-by-ecac-hockey-coaches/

:eek: :eek: :eek:

If it were me, I'd be happy that one of the players I support even got ON the list of 24. We're talking over the 93rd percentile (if you include scratches), that's an accomplishment in itself.

As for the second Yale player being on first team, perhaps he was very strong on special teams? Maybe non-scoring situations brought him that respect? Obviously I'm neutral on the argument, but just trying to provide possible perspective.

UnionHockeyManiac
03-03-2010, 01:01 PM
Hey Union Fans-

Purchase your playoff tickets now! Even though we are not guaranteed to play RPI in the second round, their fans have already started purchasing tickets at Messa just because there is a potential (although likely) matchup. Stop the invasion! Buy your tickets now if you haven't done so already! :)

Kepler
03-03-2010, 02:55 PM
OK Ken, tell us what you REALLY think..
http://www.dailygazette.com/weblogs/schott/2010/mar/02/valery-trabucco-screwed-by-ecac-hockey-coaches/

Podunk journalist sucks up to the locals by screaming about not selecting the home favorite? Get the Pulitzer. :p

V-T's great. Anybody who thinks Backman doesn't deserve to be on the first team is a moron, straight up.

NYhockeyguy
03-03-2010, 03:07 PM
Well, I wouldn't rule out the possibility that I'm just being a jerk, but a 6-team regional 16 years ago that included BU, UNH, and Wisconsin? Forgive me if I'm a little skeptical of the predictive power of that particular data point.

I think there are two recent data points that are rather more telling: 2520 (http://www.uscho.com/box/?date=20091209&vis=uc&home=rpi&gender=m) and 2740. (http://www.uscho.com/box/?date=20091128&vis=uc&home=rpi&gender=m) So I guess RPI travels well everywhere except to Houston Fieldhouse? And those are for games that one of the involved schools considers a big rivalry and were scheduled months in advance. On a week's notice, there's just no chance that the ECACs get 10k - not even if it were RPI, Union, Cornell, and Clarkson.

Unions rink holds about 2500 , the attendence of 2520 was also on a wednesday night RPI fans have not seen a .500+ season since about 2003, 2004 = low attendance. if Big Red Freakout brings out the casual fans of 5000+ i think the ECAC championships would be plenty suffecient.

Wholin1
03-03-2010, 03:37 PM
Best wishes to our fellow fan SlyFoxMan who has recently been hospitalized.

UnionHockeyManiac
03-03-2010, 03:51 PM
Unions rink holds about 2500 , the attendence of 2520 was also on a wednesday night RPI fans have not seen a .500+ season since about 2003, 2004 = low attendance. if Big Red Freakout brings out the casual fans of 5000+ i think the ECAC championships would be plenty suffecient.

Our rink actually hold 2,225...It just magically expands whenever we play RPI. :)

UnionHockeyManiac
03-03-2010, 03:52 PM
Best wishes to our fellow fan SlyFoxMan who has recently been hospitalized.

That's terrible, hope he's ok. What happened and how do you know him?

Wholin1
03-03-2010, 04:03 PM
That's terrible, hope he's ok. What happened and how do you know him?
I guess I should have added that he is my son. He will hopefully be feeling better soon and be off the IR in time for the playoffs. ;)

Red Cloud
03-03-2010, 04:37 PM
Hey Union Fans-

Purchase your playoff tickets now! Even though we are not guaranteed to play RPI in the second round, their fans have already started purchasing tickets at Messa just because there is a potential (although likely) matchup. Stop the invasion! Buy your tickets now if you haven't done so already! :)

Got mine! :p

DMA
03-03-2010, 05:15 PM
Podunk journalist sucks up to the locals by screaming about not selecting the home favorite? Get the Pulitzer. :p

V-T's great. Anybody who thinks Backman doesn't deserve to be on the first team is a moron, straight up.


Actually, Ken Schott and Dan Greene (on his blog) have a pretty good argument in favor of MVT. Looking only at ECAC numbers, Backman has 16 goals and 9 assists, compared to 19 goals and 13 assists for MVT. Keep in mind that MVT put up these superior numbers on a Union team that has scored 1/2 goal per game LESS than Yale. When that is taken into account, the differential is impressive for MVT.

In addition, keeping in mind that Union allowed .72 goals less per game than Yale and that Yale is a .9 + in ECAC games, while Union is a 1.13 +, MVT is a +13 while Backman is a +8. Finally, when you look at Yale's lineup, Backman has not been asked to be his team's savior on a nightly basis the way MVT has been. Broc Little has that role for Yale, or at the very least it is shared. No one on Union other than MVT has double digit goals in ECAC games.

Backman has had a great year, but there is a pretty strong argument to be made that MVT should be on the first team and Backman on the second.

aweise
03-04-2010, 07:12 AM
Hey Union Fans-

Purchase your playoff tickets now! Even though we are not guaranteed to play RPI in the second round, their fans have already started purchasing tickets at Messa just because there is a potential (although likely) matchup. Stop the invasion! Buy your tickets now if you haven't done so already! :)

I guess they're pretty confident Clarkson won't upset SLU and they'll beat Brown. Does anyone think they'll attend if RPI wins and they end up at Colgate? :p

As for the MVT-Backman debate, while I'm clearly biased and the numbers that DMA, Ken Schott, and Dan Greene have discussed are solid cases to put MVT on the first team, I think we also need to look at what impact both players have had on their games.

Off the top of my head, I can think of three games where Mario was the difference - @RPI, where he scored two consecutive goals in the 3rd to tie the game that Union eventually won, home vs SLU, where he scored the tying goal in the 3rd period in a game Union won 4-2, and @Quinnipiac, tying a game in the 2nd that Union won in OT. To me, these are clutch goals that affected the outcome of the game and are really MVP-worthy, not just first team worthy.

Kepler
03-04-2010, 08:34 AM
Stats are a wonderful tool, but simply watching Backman and seeing how other teams are forced to respond to him dictates that he is a very strong candidate for first team. V-T is a very, very good player, but (1) lots of very, very good players make second team in seasons when forwards are deep, and much more importantly (2) Backman isn't in any way the "obvious" guy to kick off the first team, as Schott's crowd-pleaser article tries to assert. The moronism isn't arguing for a different guy -- anybody can always make a plausible hair-splitting argument -- but in saying Backman clearly didn't belong -- that's merely a dumb throwaway comment to stir the rabble and generate buzz. Which, turns out, it did.

If any first team electee is suspect, to be frank it's Nash. This isn't a year for dominant D-men in the ECAC, but even so if a fan made the case he didn't belong it wouldn't be absurd.

Kepler
03-04-2010, 08:38 AM
It's one more than there has been before. :)

"You must spread Reputation" etc, etc... :D

Ralph Baer
03-04-2010, 08:56 AM
"You must spread Reputation" etc, etc... :D

You don't give out much Rep, do you? Your last Rep to me was on 11/29/09. Anyway, it's the thought that counts.

LynahFan
03-04-2010, 09:24 AM
Unions rink holds about 2500 , the attendence of 2520 was also on a wednesday night RPI fans have not seen a .500+ season since about 2003, 2004 = low attendance. if Big Red Freakout brings out the casual fans of 5000+ i think the ECAC championships would be plenty suffecient.
But that's not how it actually works. The BRF is essentially RPI's homecoming, scheduled months in advance, so everybody plans for it.

How many RPI fans will show up at the ECACs regardless of who is playing - the types who have already bought their tickets? Based on my observations in past years when RPI wasn't there, I'm guessing 500 at the very most (and that's pretty generous). That means that the remaining 4500 are at the very best waiting to make a last minute decision about whether to go depending on if RPI makes it, and a lot of them probably were out-of-town alums who already made their one trip back to Albany for the year and won't make it even if RPI is there. If you get 75% yield out of that, I'd say you're doing really well. That puts RPI's attendance around 500 + .75*4500 = 3875.

Last year there was 4857 attendance for Saturday. Figure 1000 of those go no matter what, maybe 2000 that Cornell drew (tops), 1000 for Yale and 800 for SLU (wasn't there, just outlining my thought process - please correct me if I'm wrong) with only a few dozen for Princeton. Replace SLU and Princeton with RPI (their 500 always-goers are already included, so their "draw" is 3375) and Union (call it 2000 even though they're on spring break), and my estimated total attendance peaks out at ~9375. But I think I've been awfully generous with RPI's and Union's last-minute-notice draws. In this breakdown, I'm only assessing perennial-power and certain 2009 NCAA participant Cornell's draw at 2000, and I just can't see a still-up-and-coming RPI beating that by more than 50% just because they're local. For a Cornell-Yale-RPI-Union final weekend, I'd guess 8000 attendance for Saturday, and that's only if two of (RPI, Union, and Cornell) win on Friday night to drive some good walkup sales.