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pgb-ohio
06-29-2019, 12:52 PM
Is this a factor in other sports? Do basketball coaches from the lower 48 complain about how fatigued players are after a trip to Alaska?I'll preface this by saying nothing below excuses the tactics of the 7 conspirators. But yes, it's a factor. In the CCHA days, our people used to complain about the trip to UAF. There are several things to keep in mind:

1. Time Zones. Traveling to the time zone next door is no big deal. But a four hour time difference? Jet lag can be a real issue.

2. Wintertime Daylight Hours. Winter days are short enough in the Lower 48. Cabin fever can be kind of depressing. Remember that feeling, now try out the winter daylight hours in Fairbanks.

3. Plane Changes. I once got an education from one of our coaches on this. Based on an actual trip, my take was: "What's the big deal? Change planes in Minneapolis, prepare for a little extra flight time, you're there." Trouble was, my trip to Fairbanks was in the Summer. In the winter, there's far less demand for Fairbanks flights, and therefore far fewer options. I was made aware of some itineraries that were truly arduous. IIRC, the worst one was Columbus-Cincinnati-Salt Lake City-Seattle-Anchorage-Fairbanks. That crazy schedule would grind anyone down. It's not saying that was typical. If memory serves, the extreme case occurred in connection with a playoff series. In other words, travel on short notice. But multiple plane changes were the norm.

As for hoops, they have smaller traveling parties. Maybe that gives them better itinerary options. Or, because they're a big revenue sport, maybe they get charter flights for Alaska trips.

Bill
06-29-2019, 01:00 PM
I'll preface this by saying nothing below excuses the tactics of the 7 conspirators. But yes, it's a factor. In the CCHA days, our people used to complain about the trip to UAF. There are several things to keep in mind:

1. Time Zones. Traveling to the time zone next door is no big deal. But a four hour time difference? Jet lag can be a real issue.

2. Wintertime Daylight Hours. Winter days are short enough in the Lower 48. Cabin fever can be kind of depressing. Remember that feeling, now try out the winter daylight hours in Fairbanks.

3. Plane Changes. I once got an education from one of our coaches on this. Based on an actual trip, my take was: "What's the big deal? Change planes in Minneapolis, prepare for a little extra flight time, you're there." Trouble was, my trip to Fairbanks was in the Summer. In the winter, there's far less demand for Fairbanks flights, and therefore far fewer options. I was made aware of some itineraries that were truly arduous. IIRC, the worst one was Columbus-Cincinnati-Salt Lake City-Seattle-Anchorage-Fairbanks. That crazy schedule would grind anyone down. It's not saying that was typical. If memory serves, the extreme case occurred in connection with a playoff series. In other words, travel on short notice. But multiple plane changes were the norm.

As for hoops, they have smaller traveling parties. Maybe that gives them better itinerary options. Or, because they're a big revenue sport, maybe they get charter flights for Alaska trips.

And for hoops, the Alaska schools play in basically a west coast conference (Great Northwest), so travel is less of a big deal. Unfortunately there is no Div 1 west coast hockey conference.

mmf
06-29-2019, 01:13 PM
...Those 3 teams were killing WCHA teams pairwise...

Over the six year period of the nWCHA UAF fits right in with LSSU, NMU, FSU and BSU (except for their one good year). LSSU has only finished above UAF twice in six years, NMU three times. So now FSU, LSSU, NMU, BSU can kill the new league's pair wise. And don't forget those long, arduous, fatiguing bus trips to LSSU. Lakers better keep glancing back over their shoulders. The secrete seven could become the secrete six.

Maybe college hockey can eventually get down to one conference of two like minded schools of just UMD and Providence. But then again, Providence would probably just be killing the two team conference's pair wise.

This argument rings hollow to me, much like the travel cost argument. I really would like to see an unbiased accounting of a trip north. What a team's actual net cost is. Is it really that much different or higher that an average hockey trip. I think some teams think the Alaska schools should bear (see what I did there) the full cost, which doesn't make any sense.

mmf
06-29-2019, 01:20 PM
I'll preface this by saying nothing below excuses the tactics of the 7 conspirators. But yes, it's a factor. In the CCHA days, our people used to complain about the trip to UAF. There are several things to keep in mind:

1. Time Zones. Traveling to the time zone next door is no big deal. But a four hour time difference? Jet lag can be a real issue.

2. Wintertime Daylight Hours. Winter days are short enough in the Lower 48. Cabin fever can be kind of depressing. Remember that feeling, now try out the winter daylight hours in Fairbanks.

3. Plane Changes. I once got an education from one of our coaches on this. Based on an actual trip, my take was: "What's the big deal? Change planes in Minneapolis, prepare for a little extra flight time, you're there." Trouble was, my trip to Fairbanks was in the Summer. In the winter, there's far less demand for Fairbanks flights, and therefore far fewer options. I was made aware of some itineraries that were truly arduous. IIRC, the worst one was Columbus-Cincinnati-Salt Lake City-Seattle-Anchorage-Fairbanks. That crazy schedule would grind anyone down. It's not saying that was typical. If memory serves, the extreme case occurred in connection with a playoff series. In other words, travel on short notice. But multiple plane changes were the norm.

As for hoops, they have smaller traveling parties. Maybe that gives them better itinerary options. Or, because they're a big revenue sport, maybe they get charter flights for Alaska trips.

Wow.
Alaska Hockey is a Seawolf fan but is out fishing somewhere. So I feel I must represent. His comment would probably be mostly unintelligible, but the jest of it would be...
...a lot of you folks need to turn in your man card. Immediately!

Scrum Bucket
06-29-2019, 01:22 PM
Well based on the Seawolves decision to move to an 800 seat rink, they might as well fold up the tent. As a non season ticket holder who attends 75% of their home games, my family and I are shut out of getting tickets to attend games now. That is a slap in the face to an already (a)pathetic fan base. Seems to me like UAA was inviting this development......so based on that, part of me says screw em.

Squarebanks
06-29-2019, 01:36 PM
Well based on the Seawolves decision to move to an 800 seat rink, they might as well fold up the tent. As a non season ticket holder who attends 75% of their home games, my family and I are shut out of getting tickets to attend games now. That is a slap in the face to an already (a)pathetic fan base. Seems to me like UAA was inviting this development......so based on that, part of me says screw em.

UAA has about 300 season ticket holders. There’s still room.

UAF has about 1,100 in case anybody cares.

ticapnews
06-29-2019, 01:44 PM
How many other sports play back-to-back games in a sport where collision forces are similar to those of car crashes?

I guess that is unique only to Alaska. In every other state we play checkers.


I'll preface this by saying nothing below excuses the tactics of the 7 conspirators. But yes, it's a factor. In the CCHA days, our people used to complain about the trip to UAF. There are several things to keep in mind:

1. Time Zones. Traveling to the time zone next door is no big deal. But a four hour time difference? Jet lag can be a real issue.
There are ways to deal with jet lag and time differences. And the Alaska teams have it much worse.


2. Wintertime Daylight Hours. Winter days are short enough in the Lower 48. Cabin fever can be kind of depressing. Remember that feeling, now try out the winter daylight hours in Fairbanks.
The players spend most of their time in the hotel or the arena anyway. This is really only a factor for fans.


3. Plane Changes. I once got an education from one of our coaches on this. Based on an actual trip, my take was: "What's the big deal? Change planes in Minneapolis, prepare for a little extra flight time, you're there." Trouble was, my trip to Fairbanks was in the Summer. In the winter, there's far less demand for Fairbanks flights, and therefore far fewer options. I was made aware of some itineraries that were truly arduous. IIRC, the worst one was Columbus-Cincinnati-Salt Lake City-Seattle-Anchorage-Fairbanks. That crazy schedule would grind anyone down. It's not saying that was typical. If memory serves, the extreme case occurred in connection with a playoff series. In other words, travel on short notice. But multiple plane changes were the norm.

As for hoops, they have smaller traveling parties. Maybe that gives them better itinerary options. Or, because they're a big revenue sport, maybe they get charter flights for Alaska trips.

This is a legitimate concern and one that lacks an easy solution. My response would be that a lower 48 team has to endure that once a season while teams from Alaska do that several times a year.

Squarebanks
06-29-2019, 01:45 PM
I'll preface this by saying nothing below excuses the tactics of the 7 conspirators. But yes, it's a factor. In the CCHA days, our people used to complain about the trip to UAF. There are several things to keep in mind:

1. Time Zones. Traveling to the time zone next door is no big deal. But a four hour time difference? Jet lag can be a real issue.

2. Wintertime Daylight Hours. Winter days are short enough in the Lower 48. Cabin fever can be kind of depressing. Remember that feeling, now try out the winter daylight hours in Fairbanks.

3. Plane Changes. I once got an education from one of our coaches on this. Based on an actual trip, my take was: "What's the big deal? Change planes in Minneapolis, prepare for a little extra flight time, you're there." Trouble was, my trip to Fairbanks was in the Summer. In the winter, there's far less demand for Fairbanks flights, and therefore far fewer options. I was made aware of some itineraries that were truly arduous. IIRC, the worst one was Columbus-Cincinnati-Salt Lake City-Seattle-Anchorage-Fairbanks. That crazy schedule would grind anyone down. It's not saying that was typical. If memory serves, the extreme case occurred in connection with a playoff series. In other words, travel on short notice. But multiple plane changes were the norm.

As for hoops, they have smaller traveling parties. Maybe that gives them better itinerary options. Or, because they're a big revenue sport, maybe they get charter flights for Alaska trips.

Wintertime daylight hours? Are you ****ing kidding me?

Jimjamesak
06-29-2019, 02:14 PM
Over the six year period of the nWCHA UAF fits right in with LSSU, NMU, FSU and BSU (except for their one good year). LSSU has only finished above UAF twice in six years, NMU three times. So now FSU, LSSU, NMU, BSU can kill the new league's pair wise. And don't forget those long, arduous, fatiguing bus trips to LSSU. Lakers better keep glancing back over their shoulders. The secrete seven could become the secrete six.

Maybe college hockey can eventually get down to one conference of two like minded schools of just UMD and Providence. But then again, Providence would probably just be killing the two team conference's pair wise.

This argument rings hollow to me, much like the travel cost argument. I really would like to see an unbiased accounting of a trip north. What a team's actual net cost is. Is it really that much different or higher that an average hockey trip. I think some teams think the Alaska schools should bear (see what I did there) the full cost, which doesn't make any sense.
All these arguments about the three teams “being a drag on the PWR and costing us NCAA bids” are ridiculous as well.

Wanna know what’s costing your teams NCAA bids? Your s-ty NC records.
The conference went 5-22-2 against the NCHC last season (with one of those wins from UAA BTW), that never looks good in comparison.

Scrum Bucket
06-29-2019, 02:56 PM
UAA has about 300 season ticket holders. There’s still room.

UAF has about 1,100 in case anybody cares.

I hope you're correct. I'd gladly pay for a season ticket to D1 hockey in a small rink

UMD21
06-29-2019, 03:19 PM
If UAH is still progressing and remains committed, I don't see why they wouldn't fit in well with the AHA and NCHC can happily take AF if needed to balance their conference out. At the end of the day, college (and it's sports) are a business and the Alaska schools are more complicated. I would agree that it's unsustainable for two Alaska schools to be in the same conference especially in a conference like the WCHA that just got assblasted a few years ago with realignment leaving only the smaller schools behind.
And if a bus league is what the WCHA/CCHA wants, let them have Miami and WMU back and I'd gladly take back Mankato or Bemidji or whatever need be. With all this going on though, it's a guarantee ASU will be welcome to a conference in the very near future--just remains to be seen which one. I do hope this is just a warning shot for some negotiations to begin and maybe Denver and UND would be more receptive of one weekend trip to Anchorage once per year especially if their travel is balanced out by picking up local schools AF(Denver) and Bemidji(UND). But again, it's a business and they may not at all. I always wanted to make a trip to Anchorage

Should be plenty of room for some negotiations to be had and some interconference co-operation (although did somebody suggest the B1G may take one of the teams? lol... not until they find an oil-bearing gold deposit under one of the Alaska campuses..)

UncleRay
06-29-2019, 03:27 PM
We really shouldn't be surprised at the formation of a bus league. Travel is exhausting. Perhaps that is one of the reasons the Alaska schools are perennial cellar-dwellers.

pgb-ohio
06-29-2019, 03:39 PM
Just for the record, I wouldn't have broken up the CCHA had it been my choice. Nor would I have favored kicking UAF out. Personally I wasn't making the trip to Fairbanks in the Winter, but did feel that the CCHA's deal with UAF was reasonable.

A factual question was asked about what the travel complaints were. I did my best to give a factual response, reporting concerns I've heard expressed over the years. React with insults or go into denial if you want. But the cited complaints are a factor in this story.

Stated up front, but apparently it needs to be repeated: None of the travel concerns justify Friday's action.

SJHovey
06-29-2019, 03:45 PM
Looks like the CCHA will return and I hope it does. Which Atlantic Hockey teams will join? The old CHA members...Robert Morris, Mercyhurst, Niagara????


Maybe this move speeds up the process for other schools thinking about making a jump to NCAA D1??? A lot going on...who knows, but interesting.

Alabama should join. The worst part is the Alaska teams, they may be in real trouble, I hope not.
My prediction is this. WMU and Miami will hook up with the departing WCHA 7, and BSU and Mankato joins the NCHC. Then the new CCHA can pick up ASU or maybe get RMU to move.

Alaska Hockey
06-29-2019, 03:49 PM
I hope you're correct. I'd gladly pay for a season ticket to D1 hockey in a small rink

288 Booster most have multi tickets some with pup pass ..all will be honored for the loyal fans.

If you are a Seawolf Hockey season ticket holder who purchased a Seapups Youth Pass last season, please contact the Terry Ann Homan Box Office at 907-786-1562 by the July 8 deadline for information on purchasing additional Hockey season tickets.

Alaska Hockey
06-29-2019, 03:54 PM
but did feel that the CCHA's deal with UAF was reasonable.

[/I]

list it all so everybody knows what it was..... or talkin out you.....




I bettin on B

Suze
06-29-2019, 04:43 PM
There must be some exception to this. Colorado College is D-3 in other sports.

So is UAA. And the dollar figures I quoted was for airfare ALONE. The hotel costs are extra.

manurespreader
06-29-2019, 04:58 PM
So is UAA. And the dollar figures I quoted was for airfare ALONE. The hotel costs are extra. And I was told UAA has 500 season ticket holders, not 300. Not nitpicking, just clarifying.
So how about this possible scenario. BGSU,Mankato and BSU were fed up and decided to leave. the rest of the 7 teams went along.Did they have much choice?

ticapnews
06-29-2019, 05:05 PM
So how about this possible scenario. BGSU,Mankato and BSU were fed up and decided to leave. the rest of the 7 teams went along.Did they have much choice?

Yes. In your scenario those four schools could have showed some solidarity with Alaska, Anchorage and Huntsville and told BGSU, MSU and BSU to pound sand.

Hockey John
06-29-2019, 05:06 PM
If UAH is still progressing and remains committed, I don't see why they wouldn't fit in well with the AHA and NCHC can happily take AF if needed to balance their conference out. At the end of the day, college (and it's sports) are a business and the Alaska schools are more complicated. I would agree that it's unsustainable for two Alaska schools to be in the same conference especially in a conference like the WCHA that just got assblasted a few years ago with realignment leaving only the smaller schools behind.
And if a bus league is what the WCHA/CCHA wants, let them have Miami and WMU back and I'd gladly take back Mankato or Bemidji or whatever need be. With all this going on though, it's a guarantee ASU will be welcome to a conference in the very near future--just remains to be seen which one. I do hope this is just a warning shot for some negotiations to begin and maybe Denver and UND would be more receptive of one weekend trip to Anchorage once per year especially if their travel is balanced out by picking up local schools AF(Denver) and Bemidji(UND). But again, it's a business and they may not at all. I always wanted to make a trip to Anchorage

Should be plenty of room for some negotiations to be had and some interconference co-operation (although did somebody suggest the B1G may take one of the teams? lol... not until they find an oil-bearing gold deposit under one of the Alaska campuses..)

Where was the interconference cooperation when the Big Ten was formed. There was no working together then. Hopefully there will be this time around, but I doubt it.