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Spartanforlife4
07-03-2019, 04:05 PM
If you are a AAU member don't you have to be a researching university?

Yes. ND is technically one, though theyíre far more undergraduate focused. I suppose I could have chosen a better phrase than on the cusp, since they probably arenít trying to get membership, but itís more of their academics fall in line with the AAU, though the research isnít at that level.

Main point being ND has the reputation and prior relationship with Big Ten schools made it an easy choice.

beaverhockeyfan
07-03-2019, 04:09 PM
The exception of that would be if the new league extended an offer to Niagara or RMU, opening up a spot for UAH if accepted.

In order for that to happen, they new league would have to have lowered seating capacities in order to get Niagara and RMU to meet. Both arenas are around the 1500 mark, if I recall correctly from my CHA travels.

Plus, I don't see either one of them moving now that AHA is on a path to be a full scholarship league.

John Biasi
07-03-2019, 06:52 PM
Wrong....the CCHA had just had BG finish 3rd in FF in 1978, including beating Wisconsin, BG was ranked #1 for a lot of the 78-79 season, BG had 2 guys make the 80 Olympic team and lost to eventual NCAA Champion Minnesota in the NCAA's. NMU made the NCAA Final against UND a year later in 80(Steve Weeks was a heck of a goalie). The league was doing very well.

The CCHA was not going anywhere and the minute Ron Mason left BG in 79-80 he already had plans on getting the Spartans to the CCHA. He started the CCHA along with Jim Ruehl and MSU was going to the CCHA no matter what Michigan did. It was never in doubt or in risk of folding.

The CCHA was at a high point in 1980 when UM, MSU, MTU, and ND announced they were joining. Bowling Green and Northern Michigan had earned spots in the Final Four. Bowling Green had spent two weeks at No. 1 in 1979. Northern Michigan had spent seven weeks at No. 1 in 1980. Ohio State spent most of the 1979-80 season in the top ten. However, the league wasn't far removed from tougher times earlier the previous decade.

Bowling Green along with Lake Superior State and St. Louis had applied to and were rejected by the WCHA in 1975. To add insult to injury, the next year the WCHA blocked the NCAA from putting Minnesota against St. Louis for the last Final Four spot. The CCHA finally got a spot in 1977 when Bowling Green played Michigan in a play-in game.

During the 1978 offseason, Notre Dame athletic director Ed Krause and Michigan athletic director Don Canham tried to merge the CCHA and WCHA and split into either two eight-team divisions or three six-team divisions (Canham wanted to invite Air Force and Colorado with the later being a club team coached by Michigan alumnus Wilf Martin). Canham came out and said that if a merger didn't happen, citing travel costs, Michigan and Notre Dame were going to leave for the CCHA.

The merger never gained traction. The CCHA was in better shape in 1978 and had some leverage against any merger proposal. One Big Ten coach wanted all the Big Ten schools in one division. The UP schools wanted to go with the Michigan schools. Minnesota wanted to stay with Wisconsin. North Dakota wanted to stay with Minnesota. And so on. No fair agreement could be reached. The leagues continued status quo with just one victim, St. Louis folding the next season.

Canham stayed true to his word and in May 1980 Michigan and Notre Dame announced they were leaving the WCHA for the CCHA. It wasn't until June that Michigan State and, later, Michigan Tech announced they were also joining the CCHA.

Ron Mason was not planning to go to the CCHA. When MSU athletic director Doug Weaver asked Mason's opinion on moving to the CCHA, he told Weaver he did not want to move back to the CCHA. He took the job at Michigan State because he wanted to coach a team in the WCHA, a league where everything was happening. When Michigan and Notre Dame left, Weaver told Mason they could not play in a different league than their biggest rival. Mason said he didn't have much of a choice.

Michigan Tech was the last to move. Tech AD Ted Kearly said at the time he did not want to leave the WCHA, but with long-time rival Michigan moving and 86% of Tech students being from in-state, he felt he needed to stick with the Michigan schools.

bravohankins
07-03-2019, 07:54 PM
The CCHA was at a high point in 1980 when UM, MSU, MTU, and ND announced they were joining. Bowling Green and Northern Michigan had earned spots in the Final Four. Bowling Green had spent two weeks at No. 1 in 1979. Northern Michigan had spent seven weeks at No. 1 in 1980. Ohio State spent most of the 1979-80 season in the top ten. However, the league wasn't far removed from tougher times earlier the previous decade.

Bowling Green along with Lake Superior State and St. Louis had applied to and were rejected by the WCHA in 1975. To add insult to injury, the next year the WCHA blocked the NCAA from putting Minnesota against St. Louis for the last Final Four spot. The CCHA finally got a spot in 1977 when Bowling Green played Michigan in a play-in game.

During the 1978 offseason, Notre Dame athletic director Ed Krause and Michigan athletic director Don Canham tried to merge the CCHA and WCHA and split into either two eight-team divisions or three six-team divisions (Canham wanted to invite Air Force and Colorado with the later being a club team coached by Michigan alumnus Wilf Martin). Canham came out and said that if a merger didn't happen, citing travel costs, Michigan and Notre Dame were going to leave for the CCHA.

The merger never gained traction. The CCHA was in better shape in 1978 and had some leverage against any merger proposal. One Big Ten coach wanted all the Big Ten schools in one division. The UP schools wanted to go with the Michigan schools. Minnesota wanted to stay with Wisconsin. North Dakota wanted to stay with Minnesota. And so on. No fair agreement could be reached. The leagues continued status quo with just one victim, St. Louis folding the next season.

Canham stayed true to his word and in May 1980 Michigan and Notre Dame announced they were leaving the WCHA for the CCHA. It wasn't until June that Michigan State and, later, Michigan Tech announced they were also joining the CCHA.

Ron Mason was not planning to go to the CCHA. When MSU athletic director Doug Weaver asked Mason's opinion on moving to the CCHA, he told Weaver he did not want to move back to the CCHA. He took the job at Michigan State because he wanted to coach a team in the WCHA, a league where everything was happening. When Michigan and Notre Dame left, Weaver told Mason they could not play in a different league than their biggest rival. Mason said he didn't have much of a choice.

Michigan Tech was the last to move. Tech AD Ted Kearly said at the time he did not want to leave the WCHA, but with long-time rival Michigan moving and 86% of Tech students being from in-state, he felt he needed to stick with the Michigan schools.



Thanks for filling in the back story......

I was always told by Jim Ruehl that Mason wanted to be back in the CCHA, but maybe that was just what he told Jim after the chips fell.

It will be interesting to see if they bring the CCHA name back. It cuts both ways......you get lots of history and records with the CCHA, however a new name and a fresh start might be a better option as well. BG has all the rights to the CCHA so it can come back if wanted......we'll see.

WeAreNDHockey
07-03-2019, 08:54 PM
The CCHA was at a high point in 1980 when UM, MSU, MTU, and ND announced they were joining. Bowling Green and Northern Michigan had earned spots in the Final Four. Bowling Green had spent two weeks at No. 1 in 1979. Northern Michigan had spent seven weeks at No. 1 in 1980. Ohio State spent most of the 1979-80 season in the top ten. However, the league wasn't far removed from tougher times earlier the previous decade.

Bowling Green along with Lake Superior State and St. Louis had applied to and were rejected by the WCHA in 1975. To add insult to injury, the next year the WCHA blocked the NCAA from putting Minnesota against St. Louis for the last Final Four spot. The CCHA finally got a spot in 1977 when Bowling Green played Michigan in a play-in game.

During the 1978 offseason, Notre Dame athletic director Ed Krause and Michigan athletic director Don Canham tried to merge the CCHA and WCHA and split into either two eight-team divisions or three six-team divisions (Canham wanted to invite Air Force and Colorado with the later being a club team coached by Michigan alumnus Wilf Martin). Canham came out and said that if a merger didn't happen, citing travel costs, Michigan and Notre Dame were going to leave for the CCHA.

The merger never gained traction. The CCHA was in better shape in 1978 and had some leverage against any merger proposal. One Big Ten coach wanted all the Big Ten schools in one division. The UP schools wanted to go with the Michigan schools. Minnesota wanted to stay with Wisconsin. North Dakota wanted to stay with Minnesota. And so on. No fair agreement could be reached. The leagues continued status quo with just one victim, St. Louis folding the next season.

Canham stayed true to his word and in May 1980 Michigan and Notre Dame announced they were leaving the WCHA for the CCHA. It wasn't until June that Michigan State and, later, Michigan Tech announced they were also joining the CCHA.

Ron Mason was not planning to go to the CCHA. When MSU athletic director Doug Weaver asked Mason's opinion on moving to the CCHA, he told Weaver he did not want to move back to the CCHA. He took the job at Michigan State because he wanted to coach a team in the WCHA, a league where everything was happening. When Michigan and Notre Dame left, Weaver told Mason they could not play in a different league than their biggest rival. Mason said he didn't have much of a choice.

Michigan Tech was the last to move. Tech AD Ted Kearly said at the time he did not want to leave the WCHA, but with long-time rival Michigan moving and 86% of Tech students being from in-state, he felt he needed to stick with the Michigan schools.

Thanks for the history lesson. It corrected a couple of misstatements from earlier posts and this is exactly how and the order in which ND, UM, MSU and finally MTU made their moves. I might add that Don Canham and Ed Krause had a great relationship and Canham was a hell of a guy and a great showman/salesman. I'm surprised he wasn't able to pull off his CCHA/WCHA merger ideas.

DrunkTrainPolka
07-05-2019, 10:59 AM
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D-VTaZdUcAAHr4T.jpg

*******https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D-VTaZdUcAAHr4T.jpg********

ExileOnDaytonStreet
07-05-2019, 11:11 AM
Well thatís not good news.

One gets the feeling that they wonít get the legislature to approve the override.

LtPowers
07-05-2019, 11:13 AM
Guys, for the record:

Atlantic Hockey has 11 teams. Not 12.

Atlantic Hockey teams can offer 18 scholarships.

Seriously, if you're going to wildly speculate, at least get your facts straight first.


Powers &8^]

gfmorris
07-05-2019, 11:15 AM
Yeah, or maybe even "We've carried ALL of them this far but no further." It sucks, but the burden of dealing with the most resource and time intensive conference members fell on the western schools least well equipped to manage it. It probably could have been more elegantly handled, but if the goal was to shine a light on the inequities in college hockey in the west, well, the light is shone.

And, as a fan of an eastern team, this should be on the plates of the ECAC and Hockey East, too. We're blessed to have bus leagues. Putting a rotating burden on those memberships to have to travel to Alabama and Alaska every couple of years wouldn't be overly onerous. Not as a formal conference membership, but Hockey East could (for example) designate who was going to Anchorage, Fairbanks or Huntsville during the (otherwise) heart of the conference schedule and help them out with some friendly scheduling on the next weekend (be it a bye, a one game weekend, or even a home series).

If someone forced EVERYONE to work together, this doesn't have to be a death knell. Arizona State showed last year that with a decent schedule it is still possible to make the NCAAs from outside the conference structure. Home and homes among the four independents gets each team 12 games (6 H/ 6 A). That would leave UAH, UAA, UAF to schedule another 20 or so each. That's 10 2 game series times three schools, for 30 series. Divide that by the six conferences (AHA, HEA, ECAC, WCHA, NCHC, Big 10), and each conference would need to get its membership to play 5 two game sets, TOTAL, each year. And they can be evenly split, home and road. If you are a ten team conference, School A might have to host UAH in year one and go to Fairbanks in year four. And that's it. That's the commitment. That's not a huge ask.

That forcing function won't exist, and it won't matter. You would have to contractually lock those conferences in to support, and that won't happen. When UAH was an independent in 2010-13, teams were very happy to host us (cupcakes are tasty treats for home crowds, but those fanbases rarely knew who the heck we were), but no one ever wanted to come here. We got a couple of pity dates, but it's notable that Merrimack would only play us in Nashville (to far worse crowds than we'd have had in Huntsville).

As for the chances that we get in, as you might think of it, to the Eastern league that's least likely to be able to support us, well ... I don't see that as likely.

GFM

gfmorris
07-05-2019, 11:17 AM
And I'm just too tired to make the case for Atlantic hockey acceptance. Maybe next week.

GFM

LtPowers
07-05-2019, 11:29 AM
And I'm just too tired to make the case for Atlantic hockey acceptance. Maybe next week.

If I may, the case for: Alabama-Huntsville is a D-II institution like Mercyhurst, AIC, and Bentley, and lacks the financial resources of the biggest players in college hockey. AHA needs a twelfth member for scheduling purposes, unless they know something we don't about Navy (or about what Hockey East is planning to do to reach 12 teams). Travel is an issue, no question, but you don't get a lot of complaints about trips out to Air Force. If the schedulers could guarantee no team would have to play at Air Force and at Huntsville in the same regular season, it could be workable. (The wild card would be the postseason, and the possibility of having to fly to Huntsville and Colorado Springs in consecutive weeks.)


Powers &8^]

gfmorris
07-05-2019, 11:37 AM
Hasn't Navy been rumored to AH since the current middies were in diapers? [I could ask my BIL if he's heard anything now that he's teaching there.]

GFM

RaceBoarder
07-05-2019, 11:50 AM
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D-VTaZdUcAAHr4T.jpg

*******https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D-VTaZdUcAAHr4T.jpg********

So if I'm reading this correctly, the 2019-20 season is in jeopardy, no?

gfmorris
07-05-2019, 11:59 AM
So if I'm reading this correctly, the 2019-20 season is in jeopardy, no?

This is so awful.

GFM

DrunkTrainPolka
07-05-2019, 12:15 PM
So if I'm reading this correctly, the 2019-20 season is in jeopardy, no?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Crkd3ASK-1A

yeah, based on the letter and the video... they seem to have bigger fish to fry then hockey...

ExileOnDaytonStreet
07-05-2019, 12:20 PM
Hasn't Navy been rumored to AH since the current middies were in diapers? [I could ask my BIL if he's heard anything now that he's teaching there.]

GFM

Yes, although Trefzger and Connelly claimed that sources said there is renewed interest in recent months. (Per the most recent USCHO podcast)

AZAce
07-05-2019, 12:46 PM
Much has been said about cost and travel, but I firmly believe that a major consideration for the WCHA making this drastic move is the fact that the three schools being eliminated are not competitive. Bottom line is that this lack of being competitive hurts every team in the conference when it comes down to the all important PairWise rankings.

D2D
07-05-2019, 01:14 PM
Much has been said about cost and travel, but I firmly believe that a major consideration for the WCHA making this drastic move is the fact that the three schools being eliminated are not competitive. Bottom line is that this lack of being competitive hurts every team in the conference when it comes down to the all important PairWise rankings.
I'll say. According to this article, the three teams are 7-57-3 in nonconference play over the past three seasons.

http://www.startribune.com/wcha-s-demise-stems-from-geography-struggling-programs/512220692/?ref=nl&om_rid=1570783689&om_mid=348960201

purpleinnebraska
07-05-2019, 01:21 PM
Much has been said about cost and travel, but I firmly believe that a major consideration for the WCHA making this drastic move is the fact that the three schools being eliminated are not competitive. Bottom line is that this lack of being competitive hurts every team in the conference when it comes down to the all important PairWise rankings.

I hope this isn't an issue because: 1) Things are cyclical. It was just a few years ago that Alaska qualified for home ice 2 years in a row (though there was the NCAA penalty one of those years); and 2) Someone has to finish last. I think finances have to be the big driving force here. While those three schools have struggled a bit, the league has still been able to grab at-large bids in '14, '15, '18, and '19, so I don't think it's accurate to say those schools are killing our Pairwise.

Hal9K
07-05-2019, 01:22 PM
Brain fart. I had Anchorage and Huntsville on loop in my brain from the earlier sentence.

Economy in Anchorage and Fairbanks.

The state of AK has $70 billion in the bank...we just count it all the time. Weíre not allowed to spend any of it. IMO bottom line those teams 1 donít want to travel to AK (donít blame them) 2 feel their pairwise rankings suffer from playing us 3.