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DLG
03-19-2018, 12:49 PM
I haven't read thru the thread so excuse me if I'm repeating. Help me out here: Why put Clarkson in the East Regional vs. Providence? These are two eastern schools. It seems to me it might make sense to switch Clarkson into the West Regional vs. Minnesota State to mix up things geographically. If this is truly a "national championship" tournament, why should eastern meet eastern and western meet western? Likewise with the Northeast Regional: why have three eastern teams with Michigan being the only mid-west team? Doen't make sense to me. Maybe switch BU into the West vs. St. Cloud State? Every year it seems that the "committee" makes the same weird bracket. When will they approach this as a truly National Championship tournament?

Trying to increase attendance at the regionals so probably a good idea
Some want regionals at home of higher seed and would hurt smaller schools

John J. MacInnes
03-19-2018, 01:07 PM
Anyone surprised to see all 3 HE teams in the same regional, they don't want to see a repeat of the Anaheim Frozen 4 with 3 Hockey East and Mich State in it so this makes that impossible

Yeah I'm really surprised, because there is no region with 3 HE teams. Which one do you think that is?

Split-N
03-19-2018, 01:31 PM
Anyone surprised to see all 3 HE teams in the same regional...

I see only two HEA teams (NU/bu) in the same regional (Worcester). Providence is in Bridgeport. Cornell is not a HEA member/

chickod
03-19-2018, 01:37 PM
I see only two HEA teams (NU/bu) in the same regional (Worcester). Providence is in Bridgeport. Cornell is not a HEA member/

Cornell is ECAC

ticapnews
03-19-2018, 01:52 PM
Cornell is ECAC

It's a pre-1984 mentality. :D

chickod
03-19-2018, 01:52 PM
Trying to increase attendance at the regionals so probably a good idea
Some want regionals at home of higher seed and would hurt smaller schools

How is that any fairer? If you want "fair," let Air Force (#16) play St. Cloud State (#1). Why are you asking for BU to be sent West? Their matchup is Cornell (#3) vs BU (#13), which is a lot closer than 1 vs 13. You should read the article about how the selections are done. They maintain bracket integrity as best they can, but attendance is a big consideration if it doesn't adversely affect the balance. If you haven't noticed, attendance at some of these arenas is disastrous without any local teams. Also, if a school isn't located near any regional (i.e. Clarkson, in Potsdam, NY, which really is about the same distance from ALL of the regionals in the East - Allentown, Worcester and Bridgeport - so their fans are going to have to travel anyway), you have more flexibility with moving them. But moving BU to South Dakota is insuring that practically NO BU fans will make the trip (if you assume that many want to save their money for essentially the EXACT SAME TRIP to St. Paul two weeks later), while at the same time gouging the attendance in Worcester. And why do you want to "mix things up" geographically? Do you want to attend games with nobody in the stands? Would you like it if you attended a game with about 100 fans from your school there? I suspect if they put Michigan in the West they would have to move one of the Minnesota schools, which would, again, hurt attendance.

Also, obviously the geographical population density is greater in the East and there are more schools within a certain proximity. Schools in the West are much more spread out. If the choice is to make the fans of schools that have to travel a good distance anyway travel vs making the fans of schools that are close to a regional travel, I'm not going to penalize the fans of schools that can drive to the games easily. Or would you rather have EVERYONE have to travel so nobody goes to the games?????

Split-N
03-19-2018, 01:53 PM
[QUOTE=ColSkate65;6631376]...why should eastern meet eastern and western meet western?/QUOTE]

There is a certain "Back to the Future" feel to this year's brackets because, once upon a time, the hockey national championship was always an East vs West affair. And I really have no problem with the brackets being set up the way they are because D1 hockey to this day remains bifurcated along east-west lines.

And I've always thought that sending eastern teams out west and western teams back east is fundamentally unfair to large portions of the respective fan bases, who simply don't have the luxury of taking several days off for travel and don't have the financial resources needed to pony up for airfare, hotels, food, tickets, etc. Granted, some teams still have travel issues but IMO, this year's brackets are far more accessible to more fan bases than has been the case for awhile.

The system is never going to be perfect but I'm OK with the way things turned out.

hockeykrazy
03-19-2018, 01:53 PM
The West Regional not only messed up bracket integrity, it essentially created a home stand for the #2 seed.

Normally it would be #1(1) vs 4(16) and #2(8) vs #3(9). Now it's #1(1) vs #4(16) and #2(6) vs #3(12) with #2(6) being the closest fan base.

Mankato is 157 miles, St. Cloud 222 miles, Duluth 390 miles and AF is 693 miles via auto to Sioux Falls. Air Force has 7 Minnesota players on the roster (Chanhassen, St. Cloud, Minnetonka, Moorhead, Shoreview, Hastings and Bemidji (Serratore(coach's nephew) and Coach Serratore is originally from Bemidji).

Tickets should be reasonable with UND fans offloading and 3 teams close by to grab them up. It should be a great atmosphere.

chickod
03-19-2018, 01:55 PM
It's a pre-1984 mentality. :D

Although ironically (or not), BU and Cornell have been playing almost every other year in the "Red Hot Hockey" series in Madison Square Garden. They played again this past November (a 4-3 Cornell win), so this game is an interesting "rematch."

chickod
03-19-2018, 01:57 PM
Normally it would be #1 vs 4 and #3 vs #3.

Huh? 1-4 2-3 (was that a typo?)

John J. MacInnes
03-19-2018, 01:58 PM
I found it interesting that only two ECAC schools (Clarkson and Princeton) will have no one on the roster with NCAA tournament experience. Every other team has also been in the field at least once since 2015.

chickod
03-19-2018, 01:59 PM
...why should eastern meet eastern and western meet western?/QUOTE]

There is a certain "Back to the Future" feel to this year's brackets because, once upon a time, the hockey national championship was always an East vs West affair. And I really have no problem with the brackets being set up the way they are because D1 hockey to this day remains bifurcated along east-west lines.

And I've always thought that sending eastern teams out west and western teams back east is fundamentally unfair to large portions of the respective fan bases, who simply don't have the luxury of taking several days off for travel and don't have the financial resources needed to pony up for airfare, hotels, food, tickets, etc. Granted, some teams still have travel issues but IMO, this year's brackets are far more accessible to more fan bases than has been the case for awhile.

The system is never going to be perfect but I'm OK with the way things turned out.

Agreed. I sometimes think people compare this to basketball, which has gazillions more dollars poured into the pot by TV networks, etc. and MUCH larger fan bases. And even many of those arenas are not exactly "full" in the first two rounds - especially since they have gone to that ridiculous "pod" system, which was done to achieve just what <b>ColSkate65</b> suggested - make it more "geographically mixed."

And I LOVE the "region" vs "region" aspect late in the tournament. Typically you don't see teams from other regions very often. It makes for more interesting matchups, because you have to adjust on the fly. You haven't seen the opponent or played against them. It's not really very interesting when two teams from the same league end up in the championship game and they have already played each other four times. If it were up to me, I would go BACK to the days when you determined two winners in the East and two in the West and let them meet in the Frozen Four. It would also be a boon to attendance. I wonder how many Michigan fans are going to bother to come to Worcester? I KNOW there won't be many Notre Dame fans in Bridgeport (maybe subway alumni), because when they were in Hockey East last year they brought about six fans to the TD Garden in Boston for the Hockey East tournament (that's not a slam against them - rather an argument for keeping it "close to home" until the Frozen Four). Just my opinion...but don't keep complaining about attendance while out of the other side of your mouth advocate for "mixing it up." (not YOU, split-N - but anyone who takes this side of the argument). :)

joecct
03-19-2018, 02:00 PM
I found it interesting that only two ECAC schools (Clarkson and Princeton) will have no one on the roster with NCAA tournament experience. Every other team has also been in the field at least once since 2015.

Well it HAS been a while for both schools and 10 and done is not allowed in the NCAA.

hockeykrazy
03-19-2018, 02:09 PM
Huh? 1-4 2-3 (was that a typo?)
I clarified/edited - talking seeds vs rankings. Yes it was a typo.

Dirty Bottles
03-19-2018, 02:47 PM
The West Regional not only messed up bracket integrity, it essentially created a home stand for the #2 seed.

Normally it would be #1(1) vs 4(16) and #2(8) vs #3(9). Now it's #1(1) vs #4(16) and #2(6) vs #3(12) with #2(6) being the closest fan base.

Mankato is 157 miles, St. Cloud 222 miles, Duluth 390 miles and AF is 693 miles via auto to Sioux Falls. Air Force has 7 Minnesota players on the roster (Chanhassen, St. Cloud, Minnetonka, Moorhead, Shoreview, Hastings and Bemidji (Serratore(coach's nephew) and Coach Serratore is originally from Bemidji).

Tickets should be reasonable with UND fans offloading and 3 teams close by to grab them up. It should be a great atmosphere.

In terms of the bolded, do you think Purple Cow fans will pack Sanford? No doubt they'll show up in much higher numbers then if they were shipped east, but I would suspect a pretty even mix of SCSU, UMD and Mankato fans. It should be a fun atmosphere, but don't expect it to be a "home stand" for MSU-M.

purpleinnebraska
03-19-2018, 04:35 PM
In terms of the bolded, do you think Purple Cow fans will pack Sanford? No doubt they'll show up in much higher numbers then if they were shipped east, but I would suspect a pretty even mix of SCSU, UMD and Mankato fans. It should be a fun atmosphere, but don't expect it to be a "home stand" for MSU-M.

Agreed. I'm glad it's in Sioux Falls, since I already had tickets, and there will certainly be a lot more Mav fans than there would be in Worcester or Allentown, but I can't think we'll hold any significant number edge over SCSU or UMD.

On a separate note, SCSU does have a legit complaint about sacrificing bracket integrity for the sake of reducing other teams' travel expenses. Although I don't know that there's a significant difference in teams 6 through 12 in the Pairwise, you can argue that as the #1 overall seed, you shouldn't have to face anyone higher than the #8 overall seed in the second round.