UNH Wildcats 2017 Off-season: The Clash Question

[Felger]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2017 Off-season: The Clash Question

Noticed UNH1932 browsing this thread....would be interested in his thoughts on the recent goings on....

And unlike some of my more snarky comments, I mean that sincerely.

[HockeyRef]

Noticed UNH1932 browsing this thread....would be interested in his thoughts on the recent goings on....

And unlike some of my more snarky comments, I mean that sincerely.

Couldn't agree more...maybe he will make an appearance...

[HockeyRef]

The thing is, when people speak about "talent" they are usually referring to "physical" talent. But DESIRE is also part of talent. How many times have we heard "Jeez, that guy has so much ability but he dogs it all the time?" The talent is useless if it isn't utilized (and I'm not going to drag out the Herb Brooks quote). Part of the coach's responsibility is to draw out and motivate that talent.

Let me be clear...I'm not upset that BU lost. When we scored the 2nd goal, the guy two seats over from me (it was a partially empty row - like most of the place last night - disappointing but that's another issue for another time) looked at me incredulously because I was just sitting there emotionless. So I went over and told him, "The reason I'm not getting excited is because they don't give a chit for 55 minutes and now all of a sudden then decide to play." THAT'S why I'm upset. If they had played the first 55 minutes like they played the last 5, I'm sorry but they would have blown BC out of the building. (yes, Woll was great but BU still missed about five open nets when he was down and out and they either fanned, fiddled around or didn't know what to do - one in particular [not to single him out] when Krys was moving in from the left point and just HELD the puck for an eternity, and he had an open shooting lane, before finally passing to the other point - so they got nothing out of it - you can't always make the perfect play)

So if the coach can't get them to do that, what good is all the "talent?" And, on a collateral note, how does this apply to you? If I'm a UNH player and I look behind the bench and see someone who (and remember how old these kids are) seems old, disengaged and emotionless, how would I respond to that?

This is why they don't play the games on paper. You can't just recruit players and roll them out there and expect to win. (no intended "veiled" comment about ANYBODY'S recruiting here) There are many components that go into building a winner. That's why only ONE team wins in the end. It's not easy to do. But when you consistently watch performances like last night (trust me, I can recall ONE game this year where this team played hard for TWO periods - NONE for three), it makes one (pick the word) "angry," "disgusted," "exasperated."

Well I guess the silver lining in all of this is that somehow even with this "dysfunctional " bunch you will live to skate another day. I'm not sure you can instill desire in a player; like Chuck says give him a 4 year guy over the two year miracle kid any day. They have to our team above self and nowadays that's not something that comes naturally. In fact attitudes like you speak of drove me right out of coaching. More money and less headaches in officiating (for the most part anyway)

Sitting where we did last night you can really see how that UML team just plain comes to PLAY. Shot on goal? No problem it's scooped up and back down the other end in seconds. Focused and disciplined. Hope HE officials are ready for a major chip fest; UML gives back twice what they get.

I predict BC will give them a game but UML is like a buzz saw right now. IF BU had jumped on BC in the early goings and had buried some of their "how did you miss that" chances it would be another story. Still even with a BU win they really would have to play well all night to beat UML.

Looking forward to going to the Regionals expect UML to be there guess will find out tomorrow at high noon!

[Dan]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2017 Off-season: The Clash Question

As far as Zoofer's question, Shawn from the newspaper hit on the two biggest issues in my opinion.

Once you get past the numerous ways the hockey program has shot itself in the foot with line up decisions and recruiting missteps (and these self-inflicted wounds are still the biggest issue regarding UNHs tumble) there are two big problems.

Number one, the culture in the athletic department is awful. Set from the top, there is a complete lack of accountability, competitiveness and expectation. Mediocrity is accepted from the coaches of numerous programs and the heads of support departments. When so many coaches continue to turn out average to below average results and keep their jobs for decades it permeates the entire dept. Excuses get made, accepted and become reality. Woe is us, little and underfunded UNH. How can we be expected to compete...

The support staffs mirror this culture and scratch the surface of the bare minimum in marketing and sports information. There seems to be zero initiative to go above and beyond, to get creative and add a little sweat equity to the job. Thus a program that can no longer sell itself as a top ten team completely vanishes from view across the state.

It's time for many, and nearly everyone, in the dept to take a long look in the mirror. Commit to maximizing whatever budgets they have, getting creative, working harder and maybe longer and finding ways to get their jobs done. No more excuses and no more tolerance of just showing up. This is Marty's biggest failure.

Second, the empty Whittemore Center is a disaster. Get butts in seats. Stop focusing on short term profit and build a desirable event based brand that gets people excited. Filling the place will help the team win, recruit and develop a sense of pride and motivation. In the long run, sacrificing revenue to fill the seats will improve revenue down the road. Not to mention concession revenue etc.

The U should be reaching out to lost season ticket holders - not necessarily to sell them - but to find out why they left, how the U can improve and occasionally to give them free tickets. Remind them what they're missing. Apologize for gouging them. Get them in the seats to create some atmosphere.

As long as demand is low - give tickets away. To charity. To youth hockey programs and families. Get people in the seats and they'll come back if they have fun.

Any tickets not sold by Friday morning - get out on campus and give them away to any student you can find. Pack the house. Once demand rises and the team gets better you can start selling more. Until then, they should also lower the price.

To make up for this loss of revenue, they should see more concession sales. They can sell 8 dollar beers for a $7.75 profit. Denver makes around 75-100,000 dollars a weekend in liquor sales. Maybe donors will increase of they feel like the U actual gives a ****. And in the long run it should benefit - a winning team at least - and sell outs might return...

They also need to improve the atmosphere inside the building. More fans and students will do that, but they should also hire student interns and teach them the history and traditions of in game fandom. Bring back the free Go Cats signs that must cost them peanuts to produce. Put instructions on the back. Get your outgoing and relatable student interns out around the arena to lead cheers and create excitement. Like say the beat em, smash em cheer. Or the go cats, beat whoever cheers that no longer exist. Get the whole arena doing the sieve chant again.

One thing is for sure, recruits will love it like they did in the early Whitt Days and flocked to UNH.

But all of this would require an athletic dept with higher goals than true student athletes who don't get in trouble. That should be a given expectation. Can the AD raise the bar and get his team and staff to stop making excuses and feeling sorry for themselves to the point their willing to do what all successful depts do and accept its not a 9-5 job, deal successfully with tight budgets, surpass expectations and give a ****? Who knows...

[chickod]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2017 Off-season: The Clash Question

Well I guess the silver lining in all of this is that somehow even with this "dysfunctional " bunch you will live to skate another day. I'm not sure you can instill desire in a player; like Chuck says give him a 4 year guy over the two year miracle kid any day. They have to our team above self and nowadays that's not something that comes naturally. In fact attitudes like you speak of drove me right out of coaching. More money and less headaches in officiating (for the most part anyway)

Sitting where we did last night you can really see how that UML team just plain comes to PLAY. Shot on goal? No problem it's scooped up and back down the other end in seconds. Focused and disciplined. Hope HE officials are ready for a major chip fest; UML gives back twice what they get.

I predict BC will give them a game but UML is like a buzz saw right now. IF BU had jumped on BC in the early goings and had buried some of their "how did you miss that" chances it would be another story. Still even with a BU win they really would have to play well all night to beat UML.

Looking forward to going to the Regionals expect UML to be there guess will find out tomorrow at high noon!

Agree with everything you said except for the "More money..." part. Not being a teacher or administrator (no offense), I was not as available to do as many games. Fortunately, the commissioner of one of the leagues (the person who assigns the games for those who don't know) was a friend so I got my "standard" two games/week. But I know teachers who would do three games a day...two in the afternoon and one at night. And "most" of the post-season games were assigned to teachers/administrators, because they were part of the "club." Not being bitter...but just the way it is.

Anyway, yes, we will play another day but I don't think we'll get very far. This team lacks maturity (which is another rant of mine - if you choose the "young superstar" route, at least get SOME veteran leadership). BC's third goal was the direct result of BU D-men panicking in their own end. If you look at a team like Denver (OK - so I'm using the #1 team in the country as an example, so let's even say Lowell), they have OLDER leadership to settle the team down when things get tough. So I just don't see this "formula" working long-term. You may get a flash in the pan year like they had with Eichel, but typically it will be more like last night - disappointment.

[chickod]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2017 Off-season: The Clash Question

Second, the empty Whittemore Center is a disaster. Get butts in seats.

Just wanted to point out (not to minimize what anybody here has said - more of just a "factoid" thing) that attendance is a problem EVERYWHERE. This has been discussed frequently on several other threads so I won't bore everyone by elaborating here. And I'm not saying the team's performance isn't a big factor. But turn on ANY game on TV (other than Frozen Four, Final Four, Super Bowl, etc) and you will see TONS of empty seats. Why? Last night cost me $100 for ONE person (ticket, FEES, parking, food). We are now in, what, the THIRD round of playoffs and we haven't even gotten out of the LEAGUE yet. There's still regionals (two more games and travel) and Frozen Four (two more games and travel).

So do these people think we're all rolling in money, or (more likely) they just don't care? If it's the latter, then look out. Because it is going to implode on them. Someone on another thread said last night's semi-finals at the Garden were the LOWEST attendance numbers since 2006 (I didn't check, but having been to many of them, I find it hard to believe the "announced" number of circa 10,000 - and yes, I know they count TOTAL for both games and people come and go - but not a heck of a lot of people "came" after that first game). That SHOULD raise a red flag, but it won't. As long as the advertising revenue rolls in, the powers that be couldn't care less. Pretty soon it will be like the original "Rollerball" movie...where fans stayed home and the spectators consisted of corporate stooges (in fact, the teams represented corporations, not cities or schools).

Just saying that PART of the issue with "filling" an arena today is pretty much beyond a school's ability to rectify (not absolving anyone).

[Dan]

Just wanted to point out (not to minimize what anybody here has said - more of just a "factoid" thing) that attendance is a problem EVERYWHERE. This has been discussed frequently on several other threads so I won't bore everyone by elaborating here. And I'm not saying the team's performance isn't a big factor. But turn on ANY game on TV (other than Frozen Four, Final Four, Super Bowl, etc) and you will see TONS of empty seats. Why? Last night cost me $100 for ONE person (ticket, FEES, parking, food). We are now in, what, the THIRD round of playoffs and we haven't even gotten out of the LEAGUE yet. There's still regionals (two more games and travel) and Frozen Four (two more games and travel).

So do these people think we're all rolling in money, or (more likely) they just don't care? If it's the latter, then look out. Because it is going to implode on them. Someone on another thread said last night's semi-finals at the Garden were the LOWEST attendance numbers since 2006 (I didn't check, but having been to many of them, I find it hard to believe the "announced" number of circa 10,000 - and yes, I know they count TOTAL for both games and people come and go - but not a heck of a lot of people "came" after that first game). That SHOULD raise a red flag, but it won't. As long as the advertising revenue rolls in, the powers that be couldn't care less. Pretty soon it will be like the original "Rollerball" movie...where fans stayed home and the spectators consisted of corporate stooges (in fact, the teams represented corporations, not cities or schools).

Just saying that PART of the issue with "filling" an arena today is pretty much beyond a school's ability to rectify (not absolving anyone).

You're clearly right about athletic attendance in general - but it's completely in the control of the schools and the tournaments to rectify attendance. As I stated, I believe UNH needs to lower prices and start giving more tickets to students and youth hockey teams (this can help recruiting too - DU has the Colorado Thunderbirds as "guests" every weekend. Get the USPHL teams or Prep Schools up here) etc. make filling it a priority. It may not be like days of yore but it can be noticeably better.

I also think it's different in a season long initiative versus a weekend tournament. UNH could sacrifice now for long term gain. At a tourney they crunch their numbers simply to maximize profit and move on. UNH should focus more on what's best for the program understanding that max revenues can/will follow. In the meantime get creative with other streams...

[chickod]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2017 Off-season: The Clash Question

As I stated, I believe UNH needs to lower prices and start giving more tickets to students and youth hockey teams

As I said: As long as the advertising revenue rolls in, the powers that be couldn't care less

They won't...nobody does. Eventually it will all implode on them. It will be like the original Rollerball movie with James Caan ("Jonathan! Jonathan! Jonathan!") The "attendees" will be corporate stooges (even the teams were named after corporations, not cities or schools) and everyone will just watch on TV (or their laptops).

It's like everything else in the human race. They won't DO anything until it's too late...I've said this ad nauseum. 5,000 x $10 = $50,000. 1,000 x $30 = $30,000. You not only obtain higher revenue, but you increase enthusiasm. Greater participation just feeds on itself and leads to even more people. No brainer. But do they do it? NO Seriously. I'm not being argumentative. When is the last time you can remember ANYONE lowering ticket prices? What happened to supply and demand? A product doesn't sell (demand goes down) you LOWER the price (effectively increasing the ticket supply because it opens it up to more people who might not otherwise consider it).

I'm sorry...I'm in a really bad mood (obviously). Sometimes I want to say "If you morons can't figure it out, why don't you let someone who does take over?" I don't know what an AD or a marketing director makes (but I bet it's more than I do), but I'll be glad to take that job and make some changes. I'm ready right now. I will move TOMORROW to the beautiful Seacoast area (and speaking of that, it's garbage that it's not a great "destination"). Would you rather live near Boston, Portsmouth, Portland, Hampton Beach, the White Mountains, North Conway, the Lakes Region OR in Grand Forks? Give me a break...

[HockeyRef]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2017 Off-season: The Clash Question

Just listened into the radio .show that 'Watcher had put up; thought it was good the announcers pushed the issue that fans are looking for the UNH they used to know. Coach pretty much summed up that he's still got a passion for coaching and laid out what he feels are the biggest issues which is team defense; doesn't want/expect a "David Ortiz" farewell tour. Mentioned the parity/competiveness of college hockey. Thought overall it was forthright; maybe a little light weight but at least honest about the disappointing season overall. Interestingly, though, he (coach) feels that next season they will be in the thick of things (what else would you expect him to say) leaning on the Senior class and incoming recruits. I think most here debate their effectiveness with TK and Cleland gone...but he is hopeful. We'll see!

[chickod]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2017 Off-season: The Clash Question

Mentioned the parity/competiveness of college hockey.

Yes. Life IS competitive. And you need someone who can SELL the program. And focus on the POSITIVE. My father-in-law has been in sales for 60 years (you read that right). He can sell milk to a cow. He told that in order to be successful, you need to do two things: 1) Love what you're doing and work hard at it, and 2) have a POSITIVE attitude. The glass is either half-empty or half-full. If you think the first, you won't be very successful. It sounds trite but it is SO TRUE. And that's why he has been in business for sixty years (the last twenty owning his own company). It only "sounds" trite because so many people dismiss the advice. The smart ones listen.

When you put the right people at the top, amazing things can happen. It just takes the guts to make the change.

[HockeyRef]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2017 Off-season: The Clash Question

Dan, got a q for you...if UML and DU squared off somewhere in the upcoming NCAA's....who would win? I am hoping I get to see Denver play out here in Manch but highly doubt it...looking forward to seeing what the pairings are tomorrow...

[Dan]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2017 Off-season: The Clash Question

Well the question was what should/could UNH do - not what they will do. You're probably right. As a by product of the crappy AD culture they'll probably sit on their hands, scrap together whatever revenue they can and then pout to each other about how hard they have it.

See Umile's comments - college hockey was just as competitive early in his tenure as it is now. It's just that different teams are excelling. UNH and ME stink and UML and PC are good. Just another excuse to rationalize his production (or lack there of)...

As for DU and UML? Who knows - what a great game that would be. DU has more high end talent I guess. I wasn't sure they'd live up to their billing as they just didn't score early in the year, but Montgomery commented a couple weeks ago that they're the highest scoring team in the country since the new year. In seven games - id take DU in six or seven. In a one off - up for grabs.

Unfortunately, I'm not sure that even with a second loss tonight DU can fall out of the west top two and land in the East.

[Chuck Murray]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2017 Off-season: The Clash Question

As I said: As long as the advertising revenue rolls in, the powers that be couldn't care less

They won't...nobody does. Eventually it will all implode on them. It will be like the original Rollerball movie with James Caan ("Jonathan! Jonathan! Jonathan!") The "attendees" will be corporate stooges (even the teams were named after corporations, not cities or schools) and everyone will just watch on TV (or their laptops).

It's like everything else in the human race. They won't DO anything until it's too late...

For what it's worth ... I'm a HUGE fan of the original Rollerball movie. WIS Productions took out a long-term option on the concept circa 2000, and it's been in pre-production since. It's never quite fit though.

So, let's see ... the story is set in 2018. ... starring a protagonist who has been around a dangerous and highly competitive sport for years, nearing the end of a legendary career ... hmm ... being pressured to retire against his will, which he's very reluctant to do ... hmmm ... with a significant librarian cameo role ... hmmmm ... and a pompous villain figure straight out of Central Casting, who remains largely in the shadows, but tries to keep the protagonist under his thumb ... hmmmmm ... and ratchets up the pressure step by step to force the protagonist to relent and do as he has been told ... hmmmmmm ... but the emotional protagonist stubbornly refuses to give in, and ultimately in refusing to see the futility of his continuing, puts his entire team/program in the most serious jeopardy imaginable ... hmmmmmmm.

Too bad that instead of the dynamic characters of Jonathan E. and Bartholomew to lead the saga ... we have the far less inspiring personas of Coach Umile and BS35+5. So close, yet so far ... or is it?



As they say in the entertainment business ... if it won't work as pure drama, then there's always satire.

Stay tuned for the offseason.

[Greg Ambrose]

I don't think I need to "apologize" for Kullen. I do have admiration for him, mostly on the facts. Your anecdote is off. He didn't keep his job only after hiring Coady: he hired Coady when he got the job, so Coady was not forced on him as a condition for keeping his job. Assuming you put recruiting on him, not Holt's longtime assistant Dave O'Connor, there are no complaints about 1977-84 period, where UNH made the NCAAs as late as 83. Even 83, with Richmond, Douris and Mike Golden was good, though Douris left after 2, and Golden flunked out. 84 got Steve Leach and Rossetti, big gets, again with Leach leaving after 2 years. But the depth behind them really dropped off, and the recruited defensemen were awful. 85 and 86 were beyond horrible, perhaps the familiar "hard to recruit for an aged head coach."

Once he and Coady took over, being the new era of UNH hockey was very appealing to recruits. That first class of 87 was killer and got the defense righted with Dean, McIntyre and Plavsic (and even better because Amodeo would have been in 87, but couldn't get past admissions). I find it hard to believe the 1987 retirement of O'Connor and the hiring of Wilson to replace him were forced on him). He, Coady and Wilson followed with another outstanding 88 class (Mitrovic joined Amodeo, Morrow).

Not only are the names impressive, but the team went from 8 wins, to 7 during the season Kullen didn't coach, to 12, 17 and 22 wins (the first under Umile). This clearly shows the team was on a tremendous rebuild under Kullen, with his first two recruiting classes getting 22 and 22 win seasons at the end of their 4 years.

Not going to argue with you here since, frankly, no one gives a care about stuff that happened 35 years ago. However Bob Kullen was the number one recruiter from 1980 on. He was acknowledged by everyone to be Charlie's successor. Usimg the excuse that he was recruiting for an old man is, frankly, pathetic. The fact is that, beyond a few good gets, half of whom left early, Kullen ran the program into the ground. Garnering 19 wins in 3 years, 31 over four, in an expanded conference schedule is the only proof needed. You may have a hard time believing he was called on the carpet but I had it on good authority from two guys who were very involved (and, unfortunately, no longer with us) that it was, in fact the case.. Leave it at that.

[Felger]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2017 Off-season: The Clash Question

Someone on another thread said last night's semi-finals at the Garden were the LOWEST attendance numbers since 2006 (I didn't check, but having been to many of them, I find it hard to believe the "announced" number of circa 10,000 - and yes, I know they count TOTAL for both games and people come and go - but not a heck of a lot of people "came" after that first game). That SHOULD raise a red flag, but it won't. As long as the advertising revenue rolls in, the powers that be couldn't care less. Pretty soon it will be like the original "Rollerball" movie...where fans stayed home and the spectators consisted of corporate stooges (in fact, the teams represented corporations, not cities or schools).

This should come as no surprise to anybody, least of which any body in the league office. Last fall Joey B. was on between periods of a Bruins' game, pimping for this year's Frozen Fenway. He actually admitted that in the years the league hosts FF that it sees a decline in attendance at the HE Championships. But that doesn't seem to deter them, as long as there are fannies in the seats in January. I'm proud to admit that I have never attended the Frozen Farce, and just wish more fans would do the same, and end that travesty for good.