UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

[HockeyRef]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

Dick Umile - The Bad

The first real setback came with a tough loss to Denver in the NCAA tournament sometime in the mid 90s. This loss seemed to affect Umile deeply and would prove to be what I see as a crossroads type change to the program. UNH seemed to switch immediately to a more defensive system. This was my first disappointment with Umile and his program. The fire wagon got traded in for an SUV.

Yes, the program continued to excel and even reached much greater heights over the next few years but I think that was more a playing out of their momentum rather than any new impetus. They still managed to attract talented forwards but I think that was more on reputation than reality.

And this is a problem that haunts the program to this day. There are more talented forwards in the world than there are talented defensemen. This is true just in sheer numbers but it’s especially true at levels below pro hockey simply because d-men develop more slowly than forwards. Going defensive immediately made UNH’s recruiting pool smaller and tougher. If an NCAA team wants to live by defense, they had better have the ability to attract the small layer of cream at the top of the d-man pool. UNH couldn’t do this because they weren’t Michigan or North Dakota or BC, and because their own offensive reputation worked against them.

For this reason, among many others, UNH began a slow, very gradual glide to the middle, where they seemed to tread water for the better part of a decade. Just good enough, with just enough good players – Winnik, JVR, Butler – to keep the fans around but not good enough to really be anything.

Two very interesting posts E.J.. and funny, strange, was just reading some stuff about the Capt. of the Titanic who's name is/was E.J. Smith. Anyhoo, appreciated the basic explanation/viewpoint about the UNH story from your perspective. Somehow I liked your first story better than the second..that's a UNH team I'd love to see play and do see some of that in players like Nazarian/Miller when they play up tempo. Must've been some heady times.

[Chuck Murray]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

Two very interesting posts E.J.. and funny, strange, was just reading some stuff about the Capt. of the Titanic who's name is/was E.J. Smith.

I'm guessing the new poster's name wasn't a coincidence. Go with your instincts, HR.

Anyhoo, appreciated the basic explanation/viewpoint about the UNH story from your perspective. Somehow I liked your first story better than the second ...

... and how did you NOT know there was going to be a Chapter 3? Not a Clint Eastwood fan, eh?

Dick Umile - The Ugly

To finish one thought, it doesn’t help that for whatever reason, defensemen have never really improved – at least much – during their time at UNH. Mick Mounsey being the poster boy for that program shortcoming. He came in as a creative, dynamic freshman and was almost unwatchable by his senior year. That story could be told with a different name over and over again.

Then we have Umile himself. I don’t think introspection or self-assessment is a strength here. Other than the change from an offensive to a defensive approach – which was wrong imo – he does not seem to be very aware of why something does or doesn’t work. He seems to make his mind up about systems, players, tactics, recruiting, admissions processes and that’s it, end of story, we are not going to adjust – for years and decades on end.

What did change, and ties into this lack of introspection, is his intensity. A less important but telling example of that is in-season tournaments. UNH used to go to things like the Badger Showdown, the GLI, and other tournaments. I’ve lost touch a bit with the program lately but it seems like that doesn’t happen as much anymore. Yes, Dick, you’ve been there and done that, but that doesn’t mean the current players have.

And that’s really huge, it’s supposed to be about the players. I see a guy like Jerry York and he just seems thrilled to be around his team. He knows that while it might be his 30th time experiencing something, it’s his players’ first time, and he thrives off that, where Umile seems almost disdainful, like it’s the kids’ fault they’re 40 years younger than he is.

And it really should be about them, and they really do pick up on it when it isn’t. I feel that everything about the UNH program under Umile over the last 10-15 years suffers from the been there done that syndrome, including recruiting, which he seems to have checked out of completely. The no stone unturned, find the diamonds in the rough - Filipowicz, take the chance on the highly skilled but flawed players – Tom Nolan, do whatever it takes mentality – why is UNH the ONLY HE school never to recruit a European, is gone.

To sum it up, thanks Dick for rebuilding the program, and the memories, but it is absolutely unconscionable that you checked out as you clearly have but still continue to cash the paycheck. It’s time to give the seat up to someone who actually wants to do the work required, someone like you, 20 years ago.

Home run. Grand slam home run. I'm not going to come down too hard on the change from offense to defense, as I think it's fair to say that's just been an overall trend in the game at all levels - certainly extending to the NHL. But the lack of energy coming from the top - the complacency, as I've harped on many times in the last few years - is just omnipresent. And frankly, until recently that complacency went beyond the coach to his boss. Now his boss has been awaken from his slumber, and at least framed an end game. I only wonder if he'll now have the intestinal fortitude to act on it early, or if we'll be left in limbo for another two seasons.

[HockeyRef]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

I'm guessing the new poster's name wasn't a coincidence. Go with your instincts, HR.



... and how did you NOT know there was going to be a Chapter 3? Not a Clint Eastwood fan, eh?



Home run. Grand slam home run. I'm not going to come down too hard on the change from offense to defense, as I think it's fair to say that's just been an overall trend in the game at all levels - certainly extending to the NHL. But the lack of energy coming from the top - the complacency, as I've harped on many times in the last few years - is just omnipresent. And frankly, until recently that complacency went beyond the coach to his boss. Now his boss has been awaken from his slumber, and at least framed an end game. I only wonder if he'll now have the intestinal fortitude to act on it early, or if we'll be left in limbo for another two seasons.

Seriously, I couldn't believe my eyes when I saw that name and had just watched a youtube about the ill fated Capt...I thought..naw.... And yes, I am a Clint fan, should've seen it coming. But we were having so much fun in the first story! Seriously tho...interesting posts.

[sonar]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

Thank you E.J. Smith. Very well done on posts 133, 134, 135. I did note that "Good" was shorter than the "Bad" and the "Bad" was shorter than the "Ugly" ....

When I finished "Ugly" .... I thought about that old comment .... "Other than that Mrs. Murphy, how's your cow?" Interesting.

[Chuck Murray]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

When I finished "Ugly" .... I thought about that old comment .... "Other than that Mrs. Murphy, how's your cow?" Interesting.

Or ... "Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how did you like the play?"

Seriously though - EJ's "trilogy" has to be the early leader in the clubhouse for "Post(s) of the Year"

[C-H-C]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

"Meet UNH Commit Anthony Wyse"

[NCAA watcher]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

Nice interview, and he sounds like a good addition to UNH from all aspects. Welcome.

[Greg Ambrose]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

The idea that Coach Umile is willing to pile all of this ice time on a spare part senior like Quast, and keeps Chanter (or Boyd or whomever) up in the stands just blows my mind. Let's even assume Chanter is the "next Quast". You have your worst team in 25+ years coaching at UNH, and it's going absolutely nowhere fast. There are really zero postseason expectations ... so why double down on a senior who's literally in the last week or two of his UNH career, and not have already given a more extended look-see at a kid who could be using that ice time to prepare for playing a more significant role for the next two-plus seasons?

Unless of course there really IS something to the idea that getting to the next round number is important to him.

The old dog is showing no signs of learning any new tricks at this point, I'm afraid ...

"so why double down on a senior . . ?" There's your answer.

[Greg Ambrose]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

Dick Umile - The Bad

The first real setback came with a tough loss to Denver in the NCAA tournament sometime in the mid 90s. This loss seemed to affect Umile deeply and would prove to be what I see as a crossroads type change to the program. UNH seemed to switch immediately to a more defensive system. This was my first disappointment with Umile and his program. The fire wagon got traded in for an SUV.

Yes, the program continued to excel and even reached much greater heights over the next few years but I think that was more a playing out of their momentum rather than any new impetus. They still managed to attract talented forwards but I think that was more on reputation than reality.

And this is a problem that haunts the program to this day. There are more talented forwards in the world than there are talented defensemen. This is true just in sheer numbers but it’s especially true at levels below pro hockey simply because d-men develop more slowly than forwards. Going defensive immediately made UNH’s recruiting pool smaller and tougher. If an NCAA team wants to live by defense, they had better have the ability to attract the small layer of cream at the top of the d-man pool. UNH couldn’t do this because they weren’t Michigan or North Dakota or BC, and because their own offensive reputation worked against them.

For this reason, among many others, UNH began a slow, very gradual glide to the middle, where they seemed to tread water for the better part of a decade. Just good enough, with just enough good players – Winnik, JVR, Butler – to keep the fans around but not good enough to really be anything.

I've never seen a more ridiculous analysis of Umile and UNH. So the beginning of the downfall was when they were blown out by Denver in 1995? Because he went away from having offensive teams. Well, the following year (the first year of the Whit) they had on the roster guys like Boguniecki, Mowers, Nickulas, and Bekar but, despite all that, they won 12 games, 8 in the Hockey East. They stunk because they were thin on the back end and had weak goaltending. The year after that they won 28 games, including 14 in a row and had, I think, five guys with more than 50 points. Despite all of that, they lost to BU in the HE final and CC in the first round of the regionals. It was then Umile turned to a more defensive mindset. That brought the success over the next several years. No, the gradual decline, then precipitous drop, in UNH's fortunes has everything to do with the quality of the players brought in to the program, nothing else.

[Greg Ambrose]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

Dick Umile - The Ugly

To finish one thought, it doesn’t help that for whatever reason, defensemen have never really improved – at least much – during their time at UNH. Mick Mounsey being the poster boy for that program shortcoming. He came in as a creative, dynamic freshman and was almost unwatchable by his senior year. That story could be told with a different name over and over again.

Then we have Umile himself. I don’t think introspection or self-assessment is a strength here. Other than the change from an offensive to a defensive approach – which was wrong imo – he does not seem to be very aware of why something does or doesn’t work. He seems to make his mind up about systems, players, tactics, recruiting, admissions processes and that’s it, end of story, we are not going to adjust – for years and decades on end.

What did change, and ties into this lack of introspection, is his intensity. A less important but telling example of that is in-season tournaments. UNH used to go to things like the Badger Showdown, the GLI, and other tournaments. I’ve lost touch a bit with the program lately but it seems like that doesn’t happen as much anymore. Yes, Dick, you’ve been there and done that, but that doesn’t mean the current players have.

And that’s really huge, it’s supposed to be about the players. I see a guy like Jerry York and he just seems thrilled to be around his team. He knows that while it might be his 30th time experiencing something, it’s his players’ first time, and he thrives off that, where Umile seems almost disdainful, like it’s the kids’ fault they’re 40 years younger than he is.

And it really should be about them, and they really do pick up on it when it isn’t. I feel that everything about the UNH program under Umile over the last 10-15 years suffers from the been there done that syndrome, including recruiting, which he seems to have checked out of completely. The no stone unturned, find the diamonds in the rough - Filipowicz, take the chance on the highly skilled but flawed players – Tom Nolan, do whatever it takes mentality – why is UNH the ONLY HE school never to recruit a European, is gone.

To sum it up, thanks Dick for rebuilding the program, and the memories, but it is absolutely unconscionable that you checked out as you clearly have but still continue to cash the paycheck. It’s time to give the seat up to someone who actually wants to do the work required, someone like you, 20 years ago.

EJ, I take it back. This post is worse. So Umile did nothing to develop defensemen at UNH? Tim Murray, Jayme Filipowicz, Steve O'Brien, Garrett Stafford, Brad Flaishans, ever heard of them? Citing Mick Mounsey is laughable. He wasn't even the best player in his family. Don't believe me, ask his parents. And, I guess you missed my post of a week or so ago. I said then I was bemused by folks like you, none of who probably have no more than a nodding acquaintance with the coach, who seem to have the ability to psychoanalyze the guy. Keep trying pal but, remember, the name of the game is talent. And UNH has had little of it over the past five years.

[E.J. Smith]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

I've never seen a more ridiculous analysis of Umile and UNH.

That's surprising, I figured you read your own posts at least once before hitting submit, I guess not.

Please regale us again with your tales of the insurance industry and how similar it is to coaching a D1 hockey team, those are priceless.

[Greg Ambrose]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

That's surprising, I figured you read your own posts at least once before hitting submit, I guess not.

Please regale us again with your tales of the insurance industry and how similar it is to coaching a D1 hockey team, those are priceless.

Troll alert. Thanks for the time I wasted on you.

[Dan]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

I've never seen a more ridiculous analysis of Umile and UNH. So the beginning of the downfall was when they were blown out by Denver in 1995?.

You'd have a hard time convincing me that the 9-2 loss to Denver - while embarrassing - had anything to do with the downturn in UNH hockey's fortunes. The program won 186 games over the next eight years (through the loss to MN) and made the NCAA tournament 15 of the next 18 seasons.

The turning point for me was Thomas Vanek's game-winning goal in the 2003 final and Borek taking over for McCloskey (and being given far too much of the HC's responsibilities) that same season. The level of recruiting slipped slowly but consistently each season and UNH slipped further and further away from its national championship aspirations. UNH's leaky recruiting stream BURST wide open when Borek and Umile were asleep at the switch as Bourque, White and Reid all failed to matriculate. That was the final blow that has sent the program spiraling to where it is now...

So, I'd agree with Greg - the talent slowly got worse, until it dramatically got worse. Repairing the recruiting pipelines is the only way back towards the top of the standings and the polls...

[Chuck Murray]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

That's surprising, I figured you read your own posts at least once before hitting submit, I guess not.

Please regale us again with your tales of the insurance industry and how similar it is to coaching a D1 hockey team, those are priceless.

Familiar the tone, that this poster writes with. Hmmmm ...

Note to self - no spinning yarns about working in insurance ... check.

[Snively65]

Familiar the tone, that this poster writes with. Hmmmm ...

Note to self - no spinning yarns about working in insurance ... check.

Jacques "Rabbit" Pouriveau?