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Leather helmet
10-07-2015, 09:54 AM
I know this isn't a new topic, but it's interesting to think about how the addition of women's programs at the two Big Ten schools in Michigan would change the whole landscape. Under the current setup, we will never see much cross-regional play, because the current conference setups (particularly in the WCHA) leave so few opportunities for non-conference play.

In exactly the same way that the creation of a Big Ten conference shook up the men's game, a Big Ten conference would do the same for women. There would be opportunities for the better eastern programs to join up with the UMDs and UNDs to improve the level of play, and it would free up more non-conference opportunities for everyone. You would see more players from the east coming west to play college hockey.

I have heard all the reasons why UM and MSU won't start programs, but a guy can dream, right?

Sieve1
10-07-2015, 10:04 AM
I know this isn't a new topic, but it's interesting to think about how the addition of women's programs at the two Big Ten schools in Michigan would change the whole landscape. Under the current setup, we will never see much cross-regional play, because the current conference setups (particularly in the WCHA) leave so few opportunities for non-conference play.

In exactly the same way that the creation of a Big Ten conference shook up the men's game, a Big Ten conference would do the same for women. There would be opportunities for the better eastern programs to join up with the UMDs and UNDs to improve the level of play, and it would free up more non-conference opportunities for everyone. You would see more players from the east coming west to play college hockey.

I have heard all the reasons why UM and MSU won't start programs, but a guy can dream, right?
Those 2 and Notre Dame...big, beautiful rink & money to burn. If even one of those 3 schools bit the bullet it would be seismic.

TonyTheTiger20
10-07-2015, 10:06 AM
In exactly the same way that the creation of a Big Ten conference shook up the men's game, a Big Ten conference would do the same for women.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO kill it with fire

bc6696
10-07-2015, 10:24 AM
Don't hold your breath...

There have been rumors for years (on and off) that Michigan or Michigan State were going to start a program. The former U of M AD was quoted a couple of years ago that he has been approached and offered a donation totaling as much as $1,000,000 to start such a program - but that would only cover one year. A much larger endowment would be required in the eyes of the AD and regents, ala Pegula.

A more laughable explanation that neither school has a women's program is that Red Berenson (UM Men's Coach) will not let it happen. As if Michigan State would take its cues from Michigan!?

This article is a little dated, but details the same $$ issue https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=4&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CDAQFjADahUKEwj3u8Xa0rDIAhUFzYAKHWeYAzw&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.michigandaily.com%2Fsports%2 Fwomens-hockey-persists-club-sport&usg=AFQjCNEbiGNRQe9DjL7bUDpnEbrkeo-zug&sig2=QLdTwDzA6pUdJXAUszOPlg

Leather helmet
10-07-2015, 10:31 AM
Don't hold your breath...

There have been rumors for years (on and off) that Michigan or Michigan State were going to start a program. The former U of M AD was quoted a couple of years ago that he has been approached and offered a donation totaling as much as $1,000,000 to start such a program - but that would only cover one year. A much larger endowment would be required in the eyes of the AD and regents, ala Pegula.

A more laughable explanation that neither school has a women's program is that Red Berenson (UM Men's Coach) will not let it happen. As if Michigan State would take its cues from Michigan!?

This article is a little dated, but details the same $$ issue https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=4&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CDAQFjADahUKEwj3u8Xa0rDIAhUFzYAKHWeYAzw&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.michigandaily.com%2Fsports%2 Fwomens-hockey-persists-club-sport&usg=AFQjCNEbiGNRQe9DjL7bUDpnEbrkeo-zug&sig2=QLdTwDzA6pUdJXAUszOPlg It just seems a shame that a state with as much hockey tradition as Michigan points to Finlandia as their flagship college program.

shelfit
10-07-2015, 10:36 AM
It just seems a shame that a state with as much hockey tradition as Michigan points to Finlandia as their flagship college program.

Very funny. I think you mean either tattered flagship or sinking flagship - take your pick. There's nobody at the helm steering that ship. The AD will probably step back in or the men's assistant coach. Bad move either way but let's face it anyone could step in right now to run that program. They should just let the assistant coaches run the women's team this year.

brookyone
10-07-2015, 10:39 AM
As long as we're dreaming...I'd rather see an eight team CHA leaving the current women's WCHA intact.

Hammer
10-07-2015, 10:53 AM
It just seems a shame that a state with as much hockey tradition as Michigan points to Finlandia as their flagship college program.

Ummm...Adrian says hello.

Leather helmet
10-07-2015, 10:57 AM
Ummm...Adrian says hello.

Yeah, I knew my comment wasn't literally true, but I couldn't resist.

shelfit
10-07-2015, 11:12 AM
Ummm...Adrian says hello.

Didn't know Adrian students could spell "hello." ;) Not the strongest academic choice of schools from what I've been told by many people that are in the know.

Hammer
10-07-2015, 11:27 AM
"Many people in the know"

Gotta love that one.

Having been around our girls the past few years, I'd say our girls can hold their own in the classroom.

brookyone
10-07-2015, 11:27 AM
Didn't know Adrian students could spell "hello." ;) Not the strongest academic choice of schools from what I've been told by many people that are in the know.
:rolleyes:

Thanks so much for your input on College Hockey in Michigan

Hammer
10-07-2015, 11:34 AM
Back on topic, for a moment.

Michigan and MSU have ACHA D-1 teams. Pure speculation here, but I would think that one would not make the jump without the other, for scheduling purposes, if nothing else. My WAG is that we see movement in the next five years.

shelfit
10-07-2015, 12:03 PM
"Many people in the know"

Gotta love that one.

Having been around our girls the past few years, I'd say our girls can hold their own in the classroom.


Not too hard to hold your own in an Adrian classroom. Don't worry there are other schools at that academic level too. It's not just Adrian.

Sieve1
10-07-2015, 12:04 PM
Back on topic, for a moment.

Michigan and MSU have ACHA D-1 teams. Pure speculation here, but I would think that one would not make the jump without the other, for scheduling purposes, if nothing else. My WAG is that we see movement in the next five years.
I have no connection at either Mi school but I do have a son who plays lacrosse, so I pay attention to expansion in that sport. MSU AD has been asked repeatedly about restarting the MSU men's D1 lacrosse team, especially since the Big 10 men's lacrosse league has really taken off. My guess would be if MSU is going to add a sport it would probably be men's lacrosse, follwed by women's lacrosse (title IX). Just a guess.
As far as UM is concerned, we toured the new athletic facilites there this summer and saw the grand plans for their new state of the art lacrosse facility. No expense spared, truly. That (and jump starting the football program) seems to be the priority in Ann Arbor, at least that's how the head lacrosse coach presented it. I think women's hockey is pretty far down on the list there, unfortunatley.

shelfit
10-07-2015, 12:58 PM
:rolleyes:

Thanks so much for your input on College Hockey in Michigan

Any time. :)

Leather helmet
10-07-2015, 01:28 PM
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO kill it with fire

I have been following college hockey since the Woog era...and I mean Doug Woog as a Gopher player, not as a coach, so I have some perspective. The Big Ten shakeup in the men's game is ultimately good for college hockey. The Big Ten is currently a weak conference, but that is cyclical - most Big Ten members have been at the top before and will be again. Because of the number of non-conference games created by the shakeup, we now regularly see schools like BC, BU, and Notre Dame that we rarely saw in the past. (Just don't schedule Holy Cross!)

TTT, I was thinking of you when I posted this originally - wouldn't you rather see more of the Whioux and UMD place of Syracuse and Merrimack?

Eeyore
10-07-2015, 02:35 PM
In exactly the same way that the creation of a Big Ten conference shook up the men's game, a Big Ten conference would do the same for women. There would be opportunities for the better eastern programs to join up with the UMDs and UNDs to improve the level of play, and it would free up more non-conference opportunities for everyone. You would see more players from the east coming west to play college hockey.

There's no guarantee that Michigan and Michigan State adding women's hockey would lead to it becoming a Big 10 conference sport. It would produce a significant increase in travel costs, and the driving force behind the creation of a Big 10 men's conference wouldn't be there, as I doubt that the Big 10 network is clamoring for more women's hockey as programming.

The biggest fallout of this is that there's essentially zero chance of Michigan and Michigan State adding programs until such time as the sport is large enough that BTN does want to show a lot more of it. The whole argument that it's Red Berenson's attitude that is preventing Michigan from adding women's hockey is misguided. I have no doubt that he's not in favor of it, but his support is probably not necessary for the school to add women's hockey, and it definitely isn't sufficient. The roadblock to its addition is the athletic department's decision to focus on other sports.

For much the same reason that a Big 10 conference is unlikely, the formation of one wouldn't lead to more east/west non-conference matchups, especially on the part of the teams left behind in the WCHA. Losing Minnesota, Ohio State, and Wisconsin to the Big 10 would do nothing to alleviate the travelling expenses associated with such games. I think a more likely result is some current WCHA teams either folding or becoming the shells of programs as the interest generated by being in a conference with the Gophers vanishes.

If Michigan and Michigan State were to add women's hockey in the immediate future, I think a better solution than Big 10 conference play would be for them to join the CHA, probably followed by a swap of Ohio State and Lindenwood in order to produce a bit more geographical balance. As I said, though, the chances of this are close enough to zero that we're just engaging in wishful thinking.

joecct
10-07-2015, 03:14 PM
There's no guarantee that Michigan and Michigan State adding women's hockey would lead to it becoming a Big 10 conference sport. It would produce a significant increase in travel costs, and the driving force behind the creation of a Big 10 men's conference wouldn't be there, as I doubt that the Big 10 network is clamoring for more women's hockey as programming.

The biggest fallout of this is that there's essentially zero chance of Michigan and Michigan State adding programs until such time as the sport is large enough that BTN does want to show a lot more of it. The whole argument that it's Red Berenson's attitude that is preventing Michigan from adding women's hockey is misguided. I have no doubt that he's not in favor of it, but his support is probably not necessary for the school to add women's hockey, and it definitely isn't sufficient. The roadblock to its addition is the athletic department's decision to focus on other sports.

For much the same reason that a Big 10 conference is unlikely, the formation of one wouldn't lead to more east/west non-conference matchups, especially on the part of the teams left behind in the WCHA. Losing Minnesota, Ohio State, and Wisconsin to the Big 10 would do nothing to alleviate the travelling expenses associated with such games. I think a more likely result is some current WCHA teams either folding or becoming the shells of programs as the interest generated by being in a conference with the Gophers vanishes.

If Michigan and Michigan State were to add women's hockey in the immediate future, I think a better solution than Big 10 conference play would be for them to join the CHA, probably followed by a swap of Ohio State and Lindenwood in order to produce a bit more geographical balance. As I said, though, the chances of this are close enough to zero that we're just engaging in wishful thinking.

Think of who would get the AQ in a B1G less WCHA. It would offer hope to UMD and BSU.

ARM
10-07-2015, 03:17 PM
Think of who would get the AQ in a B1G less WCHA. It would offer hope to UMD and BSU.With only five teams, it wouldn't get an AQ unless some team was added.

Anyway, I hope it doesn't happen any time soon. I like being able to realistically drive to every arena in the league except Ohio State.