UNH Wildcats TD Garden and Beyond 2015

[chickod]

Re: UNH Wildcats TD Garden and Beyond 2015

My love of hoops, especially the pros, has gone way down. Hardly even watch anymore.

Agreed. And interesting...a good friend of mine bought season tix in '79 (Bird's first year) and said he would give them up "as soon as Bird retired." He did and hasn't looked back.

[Darius]

Re: UNH Wildcats TD Garden and Beyond 2015

I had C's tickets from Bird's second year (1980-81) until the last year of the Garden (1993) in the stadium seats sorta behind the net. In that time they went fron $8.50 (can you imagine paying $8.50 to see Larry Bird, etc.!) to $29. I held on to see what my view would cost at the new Garden (it was $60) and what $29 would get me (last row in the balcony center court). Gave them up more because the Celts were going nowhere and no one, not even my wife, wanted to go anymore. It took another 15 years before they won, and in the process the game was devalued by too much one-on-one isolationmoves on the court and too much entertainment, other than the actual game, off it. I don't regret my decision one bit since it actually dovetailed with the resurgence of the Wildcats. My love of hoops, especially the pros, has gone way down. Hardly even watch anymore.

Similar time frame for me. The $73 was for a "comparable" seat in the new building. Not. The $8.00 seats had a half season with playoff option which was sweet. Combined with a few Hartford home games, the time commitment was significantly less. The half season option vanished after a year or 2. Agreed on the state of the game, I watch virtually no hoop on TV and literally none in person. I tried some of the tournament this weekend, the final 30 seconds of a game takes 5 minutes to play. Back to back timeouts should be eliminated. As for the entertainment factor they waited until Red died before adding cheerleaders. The white sneakers, thanks to Pierce I believe, still annoy me.

Get off my lawn and listen to some real music!

[chickod]

Re: UNH Wildcats TD Garden and Beyond 2015

In the case of UNH Hockey, I'm not sure I agree with the need to chase casual "pink hats", chickod.

My reference in regard to the Pink Hats was more generic. It's just a transformation that I have noticed whenever I have gone to almost any sporting event in the last ten years or so. Regarding UNH, my sister is more attuned since her boyfriend went there (and my uncle graduated from UNH), so I go by what she tells me. All I know is that Hockey East needs a strong UNH program. I remember the days when they used to pack the Garden as well. I do believe that every program goes in cycles. At BU, a strong consensus (I don't have statistical data so I won't make any "unsubstantiated claims") feels that Jack should have quit when he was on top, in 2009. When he didn't, a precipitous decline followed. I believe that DQ will "right the ship" (how much of this year is the result of that or of Eichel remains to be seen) eventually, but we know that it's pretty obvious that a consistent factor has to be continuing support (read: funding) by the athletic department as well as the success of the program remaining a priority. Without those components, it's curtains. At BU that's a given, because we don't even have football any more. Hockey is "top dog" (no pun intended). I don't know, what with the renovation of Cowell and all if there has been a sudden seismic shift at UNH or just a passing re-invigoration of the football program as a result of this. But I do think it's almost impossible to maintain consistent excellence without some ups and downs. It's the nature of sports that you can't always "hit" on your recruiting (or drafting, in the case of the pros) and, while success breeds success, the opposite is also somewhat true. It takes time to reverse a few years of decline. My experience, though, is that when you start to win, the fans return. Just human nature, I guess. Everyone likes a winner. Agganis has been pretty dead since 2011 and this year there (obviously) has been much more excitement. That's not a coincidence.

[chickod]

Re: UNH Wildcats TD Garden and Beyond 2015

Back to back timeouts should be eliminated.

AND...in the last two minutes the team that is fouled should have the choice of either shooting free throws or taking the ball out of bounds. That would eliminate the "parade to the line" in the waning minutes of every game, which is ridiculous. I agree, not much fun to watch anymore...

[Greg A]

Re: UNH Wildcats TD Garden and Beyond 2015

Chuck, interesting narrative. But a correction first. Snively wasn't continually banging out the in its last years. The capacity of Snively was somewhere around 3800 and, yes, the students would come (just like they do now), but the general fan base had dropped off some after the dismal years of the late 80's. Looking back we think it was a progression to greatness in the 90's, but it wasn't. UNH did not advance to the Garden in '91 or '93 and just snuck in in '94 after the longest game in Snively history. People were coming, the place wasn't empty, but it was not banged out every night, especially not like it was in the 70's.

The '94-'95 year, in Manchester, was a turning point I agree. But it could have been way, way more effective. How many people from the Manchester/Concord axis all of a sudden became UNH Hockey fans. I actually know three families that did because of a friend of theirs, a UNH grad who already had season tickets, dragged then to the games in Manchester, they got the bug and bought seasons for themselves. But how many were like this? Back in this era was when I started the newsletter, writing, producing and mailing it out every other week. It always struck me how few of these mailings went to people outside the Seacoast. Now these were FOH members, not season ticket holders, but I think the takeaway is that in the heart of NH the interest was tepid.

Opening the Whit was the big deal. A modern facility with seatbacks and more than two urinals for men. What a concept! Plus the product was getting way better as we know. You take the novelty of the new arena, an exciting brand of hockey and you would expect the numbers to grow. However, if you look back at attendance figures for that first year, the arena was hardly ever sold out. And mostly that was because UNH was not winning. As we saw later on, winning begets interest, interest begets fannies in the seats. UNH continued to rise - '97 (14 game winning streak), '98 (first FF appearance in 16 years), '99 (FF finals, Krog wins the Hobey), '00 (number one in the nation).

UNH rode the crest of this wave for another few years. But the fans got jaded because the FF appearances did not come again, there were the early exits from the playoffs, the ticket prices went up, the new AD was arrogant and out of touch, so people just voted with their wallets and their feet. Ticket renewals decreased, the waiting list went away, the talent on the ice was not as great and, before you know it, the bloom was off the rose. The Verizon opening was an example of the decline. Marty's whole rationale for UNH playing there never sat well with me, mainly because the school had blown the opportunity to reach out to the mid-state market. Sure, the Monarchs were an attractive option for many (especially those with kids) but UNH never really went after the alumni in that area and, as a result of that and declining interest in the Seacoast, the attendance each year was less and less. I'd have to say the nadir was the year that the Maine contingent had better seats that most season ticket holders. Just awful.

Now we have retrenched but what we see in the Whit looks tired and worn. The place needs to be spruced up, there is a definite need for a new scoreboard (the stickman cheers are a joke), and there is definitely a need to bring those besides the hard core back into the arena. After all, it wasn't the hard core that was bangingout the joint 15 years ago. A lot of those, yes, but it was the so called pink hats who put it over the top. Sellouts don't occur without them. Just look at the Sox over the last 10-15 years, look at the Bruins now vs. 10 years ago. But the bottom line is that none of this will happen unless the team starts to win, win regularly, and makes noise in the NCAA's.

Once caveat. Interest in college hockey is down all over the region. Lowell is rejuvenated, mostly because they have had success (and they sell beer). But you look at BC, BU. They rarely sell out unless they are playing each other. So we may not be able to duplicate what was there 15-20 years ago but we should sure as he!! try.

[Darius]

Re: UNH Wildcats TD Garden and Beyond 2015

Pink Hat baseball test: What is the infield fly rule? Don't know? Pink hat.

[Chuck Murray]

Re: UNH Wildcats TD Garden and Beyond 2015

Once caveat. Interest in college hockey is down all over the region. Lowell is rejuvenated, mostly because they have had success (and they sell beer). But you look at BC, BU. They rarely sell out unless they are playing each other. So we may not be able to duplicate what was there 15-20 years ago but we should sure as he!! try.

I see the drop in interest in college hockey as an indictment of Joe Bertagna's efforts (or lack thereof) as HE commissioner. If nothing else, New England is a hockey hotbed, and with the addition of UVM several years ago, all six New England states are well represented in the league. There are SO many rivalries and potential rivalries dotted all over the region between these schools (and states/regions) and pretty much every road game for most schools (barring UMaine, which still travels pretty well, and excepting the NICC error soon to be rectified ) is one the hardcore fans can travel to without undue stress. Plus, hockey is the only sport most of the prominent New England college programs play against each other in the same D-1 league. All the key elements are there for HE to be bigger than it is.

But it isn't. I guess complacency isn't just limited to the corner offices in Durham NH.

P.S. - is there anything other than University policy that prevents sale of beer at The Whitt?

[ClOuD 9]

P.S. - is there anything other than University policy that prevents sale of beer at The Whitt?

State law. If there are minors participating there must be a solid wall between the playing area and the area where alcohol is served - this is why they can serve in the sky box lounge but you can't bring your drink in to the box itself, and also why beer is not served for regular season games in Manchester.

I'd love to see UNH lobby to have this law killed or at the very least receive an exception, but it hasn't happened yet so my hopes are not high.

[scoreboard]

State law. If there are minors participating there must be a solid wall between the playing area and the area where alcohol is served - this is why they can serve in the sky box lounge but you can't bring your drink in to the box itself, and also why beer is not served for regular season games in Manchester.

State law.... All the more reason to recruit only 21 year old freshman. Maybe they could win some hardware and we would all be happy in the process...

[JB]

Re: UNH Wildcats TD Garden and Beyond 2015

I am dumbfounded by the State that controls booze sales and needs money hasn't corrected this one their own. Seems like a hidden gold mine for the University.

As to attendance it is a combination of the product underachieving (choking) when it had the talent, then not having the right talent acquisition process causing the quality to go down and then fan abuse. Pink hats are a requirement but the AD's office abused many good fans chasing corporate and casual fan money. I know people who couldn't renew season tickets because their seats were taken for corporate blocks, many didn't renew in other parts of the Whitt out of anger. Add the games about mandatory donations to the Wildcat Athletic Fund to get season tickets or the ability to jump up the wait list with larger donations and it made many fans just go away, some I know have not and may not ever come back. The AD also systematically killed the atmosphere to make it more family friendly, which made it less fun for real hockey fans

All of this together the arrogance and short sighted "management" of the customers (fans) has caused the decline to be sharp and deep. It will also make it slower to rebound.

Note the arrogance started early and before BS35. I received it when I was a student, my time as a student spanned the end of Snively and the opening of the Whitt (been a fan since I was knee high to a grasshopper). They decided my senior year that if the students didn't pick up the tickets before Wed noon they would go on sale to general public. This was reasonable. However, at the end of that year it was decided that as of Wednesday they were no longer "free" to the students (note it is the mandatory athletic fee makes the tickets "free" and helped build the building) but instead all must be purchased. I had a fit in the field house when they tried to double dip with me, I was 5 minutes late, somebody heard me and I got my ticket but it was an obvious beginning to the money grab. I do remember asking how they would feel if I brought this double dip to the attention of the Fosters as it would make a good story...

[Scarlet]

I HATE that goal horn...where did that start anyway? Chicago Stadium? I remember in the 70s the Slapshot movie had a goal "buzzer." I remember thinking, this is made up for Hollywood...I had never heard any "buzzer." It was a red light and a whistle, period. But they have to embellish everything. So then the "horn" evolved from that. Yuck! The constant non-stop "noise" at these arenas is so annoying It's like there is zero attention span so they have to "entertain" you every second. At Hockey East last weekend the girl in front of me never even looked at the ice ONCE...she was on her phone on Facebook all night. (and that's probably the reason I made the comment about the "dead" atmosphere...how can anyone get excited when nobody is actually watching the game?) That's the end of my rant...

EDIT: I hope Scarlet doesn't see this because I'm sure I'll get chastised again for "complaining." Opinions are not welcome...

Considering I'm the one who started the "I HATE THE GOAL HORN AT AGGANIS" movement, I'm not sure why you say that. Others on the BU thread loved it. I gave up my crusade to get rid of it when it seemed like it was in every arena this year and lead me to believe it was some sort of thing that was decided upon by the NCAA, or Hockey East. Then the team kept winning so I had to suck it up and let it stay.

[chickod]

Re: UNH Wildcats TD Garden and Beyond 2015

I'm not sure why you say that.

Because it means I'm "upset" about something else...that's all I do is complain

[wildcatdc]

Note the arrogance started early and before BS35. I received it when I was a student, my time as a student spanned the end of Snively and the opening of the Whitt (been a fan since I was knee high to a grasshopper). They decided my senior year that if the students didn't pick up the tickets before Wed noon they would go on sale to general public. This was reasonable. However, at the end of that year it was decided that as of Wednesday they were no longer "free" to the students (note it is the mandatory athletic fee makes the tickets "free" and helped build the building) but instead all must be purchased. I had a fit in the field house when they tried to double dip with me, I was 5 minutes late, somebody heard me and I got my ticket but it was an obvious beginning to the money grab. I do remember asking how they would feel if I brought this double dip to the attention of the Fosters as it would make a good story...

JB.... The Wednesday noon rule actually started, at least partially, as a result of me getting arrested outside Snively the night of a PC game in 1991. There were about 100 fans waiting to get in with our athletic passes, when the door folks came out to tell us that they athletic department had sold out the game to the general public. I and 3 fraternity brothers ended up being the last men standing, arguing the principle of the athletic pass, and were eventually given the choice to disperse or be arrested. For whatever reason, I decided this was my last chance on a college campus to be part of civil disobedience (what a rebel - ha!), and chose to be arrested.

In any event, I was booked on a misdemeanor, which ultimately was pled down to a violation and I got off with a $25 fine.

The point is, it made the front page of the New Hampshire the next morning, and while the university actually had the right to do what they did at the time of my arrest, they ultimately changed the rule to give the students a mid-week deadline.

Tried to hide the arrest from my folks, but the daughter of the AD at Bishop Guertin (where I went to school), was a fellow UNH'er and passed it along to her mom, who then mailed it to my mom, who then mailed it to me.

I found the article a few weeks back when I was packing to move to a new home in DC. In one of my trips back to the States (and after my better half and I get moved), I will post a pic of the article. Now can someone explain to me how to do that?

Speaking of BG, at least I got one hockey championship out of this season. Go 'Cards!!!

[HockeyRef]

Re: UNH Wildcats TD Garden and Beyond 2015

Considering I'm the one who started the "I HATE THE GOAL HORN AT AGGANIS" movement, I'm not sure why you say that. Others on the BU thread loved it. I gave up my crusade to get rid of it when it seemed like it was in every arena this year and lead me to believe it was some sort of thing that was decided upon by the NCAA, or Hockey East. Then the team kept winning so I had to suck it up and let it stay.

Scarlet, my q about why it wasn't used at the TD wasn't answered...course who really knows unless one is a HE official of some kind. Any idea? I didn't miss it...and personally I don't mind it...(JUST DON'T play the MC/Blackhawks goal song... )

[HockeyRef]

Re: UNH Wildcats TD Garden and Beyond 2015

JB.... The Wednesday noon rule actually started, at least partially, as a result of me getting arrested outside Snively the night of a PC game in 1991. There were about 100 fans waiting to get in with our athletic passes, when the door folks came out to tell us that they athletic department had sold out the same to the general public. I and 3 fraternity brothers ended up being the last men standing, arguing the principle of the athletic pass, and were eventually given the choice to disperse or be arrested. For whatever reason, I decided this was my last chance on a college campus to be part of civil disobedience (what a rebel - ha!), and chose to be arrested.

In any event, I was booked on a misdemeanor, which ultimately was pled down to a violation and I got off with a $25 fine.

The point is, it made the front page of the New Hampshire the next morning, and while the university actually had the right to do what they did at the time of my arrest, they ultimately changed the rule to give the students a mid-week deadline.

Tried to hide the arrest from my folks, but the daughter of the AD at Bishop Guertin (where I went to school), was a fellow UNH'er and passed it along to her mom, who then mailed it to me.

I found the article a few weeks back when I was packing to move to a new home in DC. In one of my trips back to the States (and after my better half and I get moved), I will post a pic of the article. Now can someone explain to me how to do that?

Speaking of BG, at least I got one hockey championship out of this season. Go 'Cards!!!

What a rebel...love it! I'd go to jail myself for a Wildcat game haha...