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Humanoid
03-29-2012, 09:18 PM
I'm curious how everyone KNOWS that RIT wants out of the AHA. RIT has publicly said that they are happy in the AHA. There are fans that would disagree and want out of the AHA as soon as possible. Personally, I think RIT is in the catbird seat. They can stay in the AHA and be a contender for league titles and NCAA bids every year. If an ECAC spot opened up, I think RIT would be high on the list of teams that would be considered, in no small part, due to their success at the AHA level and I think the Tigers would go.

Success of late? It's not like they had 1 or 2 good years like Bentley. RIT has won or tied for 4 AHA championships. They have made 3 straight trips to the AHA tournament championship, winning 1 and parleying that to a Frozen Four appearance. The is not a johnny-come-lately program, but one with sustained success in the AHA.

I'm almost positive I said they'd been to the conference final four every year they've been in the league.

RIt is the flagship team in the AHA. Otherwise they'd move the league title weekend closer to the east.

mookie1995
03-29-2012, 09:22 PM
Greg Ambrose is even dumber than I thought. Never thought it was possible.

You don't remember him typing how qualified Ginny buckingham was to run massport?!? :D

ChiefWahoo
03-29-2012, 09:27 PM
Joe Bertagna made a statement this week that if Merrimack started a women's program they would automatically be admitted to HEA because MC has a men's program in the conference. Wouldn't this also apply to UConn wanting to admit their men's program?

mookie1995
03-29-2012, 09:28 PM
Joe Bertagna made a statement this week that if Merrimack started a women's program they would automatically be admitted to HEA because MC has a men's program in the conference. Wouldn't this also apply to UConn wanting to admit their men's program?

No

scoreboard
03-29-2012, 10:13 PM
Joe Bertagna made a statement this week that if Merrimack started a women's program they would automatically be admitted to HEA because MC has a men's program in the conference. Wouldn't this also apply to UConn wanting to admit their men's program?

I think it certainly helps that the women's program is part of HE. If their presentation is solid they will be admitted. Based on location and name recognition they are the best option for a 12th team.

moose97
03-29-2012, 10:24 PM
Joe Bertagna made a statement this week that if Merrimack started a women's program they would automatically be admitted to HEA because MC has a men's program in the conference. Wouldn't this also apply to UConn wanting to admit their men's program?

You mean like how Bemidji State being in the Women's WCHA helped the men's team? As in it didn't help very much at all? If it did, BSU would have been in on the men's side much sooner than they were. BSU AD Rick Goeb did say that being in on all the Women's meetings (with all the same people that voted on men's issues) helped a little, as in building relationships. However, you have to remember that the schools in a conference still tend to vote based on their own interests, rather than vote by doing other schools favors.

TigerFan86-87
03-29-2012, 10:25 PM
RIT geographically is a ridiculous fit for the ECAC; academically and athletically, I've heard they'd much rather have Holy Cross as a travel partner for Union than RIT. Rochester is in the middle of nowhere, and a two-hour or three-hour trip between travel partners uisnt' far fetched. It's 2 hours between Colgate and Cornell, for example, given the directions and bus treks (helloooooo silos).

Also, there's an element of RIT that, for the most part, some in ECAC don't want to touch. RIT is essentially RPI with a less-rich history at the D1 level. Everyone knows RIT thinks its better than the rest of the AHA and wants out, that it wants the scholarship investment and the new rink and to seamlessly fit into another conference. But geographically, ROchester doesn't fit with anybody, especially the WCHA or the old CCHA.

Of course RIT fans think the world starts and stops with them since, yes, they have been good as of late. But Rochester and the fact that the AHA championship is played at BCA is just a fact that RIT isn't going anywhere.
Boy, I thought you Bentley guys were pretty reasonable about stuff a few weeks ago when RIT played Bentley, but WOW was that a bitter nasty assessment of things (not to mention somewhat misinformed).
By your take on geography, it is clear that you are another provincial New Englander. I'll state it yet again for all of the provincial New England natives...
WESTERN NEW YORK IS NOT IN THE MIDDLE OF NOWHERE!!! It is approximately a 7 hour drive or less to more than half of the teams in D-I hockey. No, we don't have a program every half hour in any direction like in New England, but a couple hours here and there are not a big deal. Try getting out more. I know many of you think Albany is the gateway to the Wild Wild West, but it isn't. You folks would just want to hang yourselves if you had to live in the WCHA territory. Talk about road trips.
Holy Cross as partner with Union??? That's no different than RIT-Cornell. Holy Cross is in Worcester, a good 2 - 2.5 hours from Schenectady. As was posted earlier, RIT and Cornell are less than two hours apart. If RIT took RPI's place they could partner with Cornell and let Colgate partner with Union. If they took Quinnipiac's place, I have no idea how that might work. Then HC would be the preferable geographic choice. Although HC doesn't fit as far as the college's academic profile (not knocking the quality, just the type of school it is).
Why do other teams' fans (at least in AHA) keep saying things like "...RIT fans think the world starts and stops with them..."? I don't believe any of us have said anything that indicates any such snobbery. I, for one, am just reiterating things that I have heard and that I believe based on what I've seen and heard about the direction of the program. To be completely honest, I would have been just as happy if RIT had stayed in D-III. I was shocked when I heard the announcement that they were going into D-I. I wasn't on here talking about them needing to move up, and didn't suspect a thing. As far as AHA vs. ECAC, I don't really care. If they did go to ECAC, I would hope and pray that they upgrade the recruiting and such because as constituted I don't think they would be competitive enough. If they don't change conferences, at least we know they have the structure in place to be consistently near the top of the standings most seasons. I don't believe I've ever posted anything implying that just because RIT has been a relatively successful AHA team that they necessarily are owed a call-up to a Big-4 conference. That doesn't even make any sense. That's not the way it works, and I think most of us RIT fans on here (just IMO, I can't speak for others) understand that.

TigerFan86-87
03-29-2012, 10:31 PM
RIt is the flagship team in the AHA. Otherwise they'd move the league title weekend closer to the east.
Flagship? I'm not too sure I'd agree with that. RIT has been in the league for less than half of its existence. The reason the championships are here in Rochester is because it is the only site where there is an adequately large facility that has any chance of drawing any sort of attendance (and that actually was willing to put in a bid). Of course that rides so much on RIT making the Final Four. You know the league's hearts were skipping beats this year and back in 2009 when RIT was extended the full three games in the Quarterfinals.

scoreboard
03-29-2012, 10:35 PM
You mean like how Bemidji State being in the Women's WCHA helped the men's team? As in it didn't help very much at all? If it did, BSU would have been in on the men's side much sooner than they were. BSU AD Rick Goeb did say that being in on all the Women's meetings (with all the same people that voted on men's issues) helped a little, as in building relationships. However, you have to remember that the schools in a conference still tend to vote based on their own interests, rather than vote by doing other schools favors.

While that may be true, there is a big difference between admitting a school like BSU and UConn. No disrespect meant to BSU. They are not UConn. HE would like 12 members. UConn makes sense. Their admittance would be based on forward thinking. They are not a strong team right now.

joecct
03-29-2012, 10:43 PM
Gang

F the ECAC. Think local, like the following schools -- RIT, SLU, CCT, RPI, Union, Colgate (+ Canisius and Niagara) all in one big happy Empire.

BU2K
03-29-2012, 10:50 PM
pass the popcorn....

:D

Little chocolate cake with that?

css228
03-29-2012, 10:52 PM
Cornell and who else? In the past 10-15 years, no other school in the ECAC has been consistently in contention for NCAA trips to the point that they could be considered a traditional power. I could maybe see Union being considered one a decade from now if they keep this up.

You don't really understand what traditional power means do you? Cornell's current status makes them nationally relevant. Their status as a traditional power in college hockey comes from what they accomplished in the 60s and 70s, and the 8 Frozen 4s they've had. Harvard is hitting tough times in its program, and its attendance is down, but remember that they made the tournament every year from 01-06, have a national title, and numerous Frozen Fours. They could become strong again at any moment assuming they actually get decent support from their university. The problem with the new WCHA is that there is no school like Cornell (mostly on a size and interest perspective). It has a lot of Clarkson's and RPI's, but the few big schools it has just aren't very interested in hockey, (maybe Ferris qualifies along those lines, but Ferris is always going to have a harder time getting high profile games than Cornell). With the lack of name recognition that that league is going to suffer, don't be surprised if they have a hard time scheduling quality opposition out of conference. They're going to have a hard time finding a tournament site (which I think the ECAC will eventually solve by gaining what I see as another large, hockey crazy school which has the potential to grow on the national stage in RIT). I hope I'm wrong, since being from a conference of little guys, I love to see the little guys thrive. I just don't see a long term path for success for the New WCHA.

CornwallAce
03-29-2012, 11:16 PM
I'm curious how everyone KNOWS that RIT wants out of the AHA.

Komey, you mean you didn't see the David Letterman spoof with RIT's AD stating he wants out!!!

komey1
03-29-2012, 11:48 PM
Gang

F the ECAC. Think local, like the following schools -- RIT, SLU, CCT, RPI, Union, Colgate (+ Canisius and Niagara) all in one big happy Empire.

I would love to see that conference. But I don't see a way that those teams are going to want to leave the ECAC.

ExileOnDaytonStreet
03-29-2012, 11:53 PM
I would love to see that conference. But I don't see a way that those teams are going to want to leave the ECAC.

The non-Ivy ECAC teams and the Ivies have, from what I know, maintained a pretty healthy partnership. As cool as it is to imagine an all-New York conference or to see the Ivies finally strike out on their own (with or without Penn and Columbia), I just don't see it happening any time soon.

Snively65
03-30-2012, 12:06 AM
Boy, I thought you Bentley guys were pretty reasonable about stuff a few weeks ago when RIT played Bentley, but WOW was that a bitter nasty assessment of things (not to mention somewhat misinformed).
By your take on geography, it is clear that you are another provincial New Englander. I'll state it yet again for all of the provincial New England natives...
WESTERN NEW YORK IS NOT IN THE MIDDLE OF NOWHERE!!! It is approximately a 7 hour drive or less to more than half of the teams in D-I hockey. No, we don't have a program every half hour in any direction like in New England, but a couple hours here and there are not a big deal. Try getting out more. I know many of you think Albany is the gateway to the Wild Wild West, but it isn't. You folks would just want to hang yourselves if you had to live in the WCHA territory. Talk about road trips.
Holy Cross as partner with Union??? That's no different than RIT-Cornell. Holy Cross is in Worcester, a good 2 - 2.5 hours from Schenectady. As was posted earlier, RIT and Cornell are less than two hours apart. If RIT took RPI's place they could partner with Cornell and let Colgate partner with Union. If they took Quinnipiac's place, I have no idea how that might work. Then HC would be the preferable geographic choice. Although HC doesn't fit as far as the college's academic profile (not knocking the quality, just the type of school it is).

Humanoid does not speak for me on this one. I really like how the AHA was set up this past year. Three of the eastern pod teams played the western pod teams pretty tough this year, even if we came up short in the points total. I never really understood the quaint ECAC travel partner thing, and glad that the AHA does not need to worry about that.

If UConn bolts for HE, perhaps the AHA could pick up Alabama-Huntsville?

Fishman'81
03-30-2012, 01:59 AM
UConn would be able to recruit better than they do now as a HEA school, I think, and their inclusion would round-out the conference to 12 teams. (It makes sense to take them on the basis of geography, too.)

The AHA is pretty-much irrelevant on the national stage; I can understand why UConn and RIT want out. Sure, there's the AQ to be had -and RIT had a nice run a couple of years back- but their representative is usually one/done material.

If RIT were to join the ECAC, their stock would rise a little, but not all that significantly... And they'd have a much steeper climb to attain an invite to the NCAAs, too.

schiegs
03-30-2012, 02:08 AM
Btw, UConn was a founding member of the MAAC/AHA while Bentley joined later. UConn has one league championship to Bentley's none.

Bentley and Mercyhurst joined one year after the league was founded. And the league championships is indeed one vs. zero. I hope these are not your prime examples of how the programs are different.

redhead18
03-30-2012, 08:39 AM
The non-Ivy ECAC teams and the Ivies have, from what I know, maintained a pretty healthy partnership. As cool as it is to imagine an all-New York conference or to see the Ivies finally strike out on their own (with or without Penn and Columbia), I just don't see it happening any time soon.Just my opinion, but I have a feeling we're getting closer and closer to seeing a split within ECAC. I cant imagine the Ivy schools are that satisfied being associated with a hockey league as poorly run as the ECAC is, especially of late. Not to mention the Ivy League did just hire a marketing agency (http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Journal/Issues/2012/03/12/Marketing-and-Sponsorship/Ivy-League.aspx) for the first time in conference history to promote Ivy athletics and to help produce sponsorship opportunities as well as provide other marketing functions, including social media, public relations and licensing. Also who knows, perhaps a seperate Ivy hockey conference would help encourage Penn to get their program going again and help grow the sport. I guess it all comes down to what the Ivy presidents feel is best for them, whether its staying put in the ECAC or going off on their own.

RSTuthill
03-30-2012, 09:00 AM
Bentley and Mercyhurst joined one year after the league was founded. And the league championships is indeed one vs. zero. I hope these are not your prime examples of how the programs are different.
Significant difference in buildings and one gives scholarships while the other does not.