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2nd Term Part 4: Donkeys, Elephants, and Porcupines

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  • Re: 2nd Term Part 4: Donkeys, Elephants, and Porcupines

    Originally posted by unofan View Post
    Respectfully, no. Now is the perfect time to argue about this, because if not now, it will be ignored. See also, gun control, the dept. of homeland security, the patriot act, etc.
    Politicizing the corpses of children seems to be something of a specialty.
    Can't even wait for an accurate body count can you? Gotta follow Rahm's dictum and take advantage of every crisis.
    Last edited by Old Pio; 05-21-2013, 08:35 PM.
    2011 Poser of the Year & Pulitzer Prize winning machine gunner.

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    • Re: 2nd Term Part 4: Donkeys, Elephants, and Porcupines

      You expect "Teets" Battaglia to plead the fifth. But not a high ranking IRS official, whose only concerns, presumably are transparency and applying the laws even handedly.

      http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/l...,1022231.story
      2011 Poser of the Year & Pulitzer Prize winning machine gunner.

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      • Re: 2nd Term Part 4: Donkeys, Elephants, and Porcupines

        Originally posted by Old Pio View Post
        You expect "Teets" Battaglia to plead the fifth. But not a high ranking IRS official, whose only concerns, presumably are transparency and applying the laws even handedly.

        http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/l...,1022231.story
        As far as we know, he's an American citizen. We may disagree with this and would like information, and some of us may imply information, but I'm going to defend his ability to do this, because that is what is protected by the Bill of Rights.

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        • Re: 2nd Term Part 4: Donkeys, Elephants, and Porcupines

          Originally posted by FlagDUDE08 View Post
          As far as we know, he's an American citizen. We may disagree with this and would like information, and some of us may imply information, but I'm going to defend his ability to do this, because that is what is protected by the Bill of Rights.
          It's a she. She is a high ranking official of the IRS. And congress has a constitutional obligation to provide oversight. Tax matters originate in the Ways and Means committee. She should answer the questions or resign. She has no constitutional guarantee of federal employment. She's not a Chicago hood trying to evade responsibility for mob killings. If she ultimately faces criminal charges for her actions, then she can plead the fifth 'till the cows come home. We pay her salary. She works for us. And we have a right to know about the skullduggery in her department. Answering the questions might even make a subsequent criminal prosecution more difficult or even impossible. Give her immunity. I don't care. Answer the questions or get out. If she wants to act like "Momo" Giancanna, let her do it on her own nickel.
          Last edited by Old Pio; 05-21-2013, 08:50 PM.
          2011 Poser of the Year & Pulitzer Prize winning machine gunner.

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          • Re: 2nd Term Part 4: Donkeys, Elephants, and Porcupines

            Originally posted by Old Pio View Post
            It's a she. She is a high ranking official of the IRS. And congress has a constitutional obligation to provide oversight. Tax matters originate in the Ways and Means committee. She should answer the questions or resign. She has no constitutional guarantee of federal employment. She's not a Chicago hood trying to evade responsibility for mob killings. If she ultimately faces criminal charges for her actions, then she can plead the fifth 'till the cows come home. We pay her salary. She works for us. And we have a right to know about the skullduggery in her department. Answering the questions might even make a subsequent criminal prosecution more difficult or even impossible. Give her immunity. I don't care. Answer the questions or get out. If she wants to act like "Momo" Giancanna, let her do it on her own nickel.
            OK, she. Is she an American? Yes, she is. She has every right to not incriminate herself. People do bad things every day, but she still is protected by the Constitution. You don't selectively say people get certain rights and other people don't.

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            • Re: 2nd Term Part 4: Donkeys, Elephants, and Porcupines

              This is one of the few times you'll see me defending this guy, but to think, the discrimination that he, I, and many other people in this world have to face. http://www.anythinglefthanded.co.uk/...-201305.html#1

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              • Originally posted by FlagDUDE08 View Post
                OK, she. Is she an American? Yes, she is. She has every right to not incriminate herself. People do bad things every day, but she still is protected by the Constitution. You don't selectively say people get certain rights and other people don't.
                I'm not happy about it either, but Flag is correct (cue the Twilight Zone music!). If there's a pending criminal investigation by the Justice Department you can't expect someone to face a hostile public interrogation that can be used against you. Goes to show the folly of some of these investigations. Instead of Congress, which is essentually useless, trying to get to the bottom of this, let the professionals do their investigation first. As much as I'd like to see Issa get slapped around yet again by one of his witnesses (I notice he didn't have the b@lls to schedule a public hearing with Pickering over his Benghazi investigation), another dog and pony show is the last thing the country needs.
                Legally drunk???? If its "legal", what's the ------- problem?!? - George Carlin

                Ever notice how everybody who drives slower than you is an idiot, and everybody who drives faster is a maniac? - George Carlin

                "I've never seen so much reason and bullsh*t contained in ONE MAN."

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                • Re: 2nd Term Part 4: Donkeys, Elephants, and Porcupines

                  Originally posted by Rover View Post
                  I'm not happy about it either, but Flag is correct (cue the Twilight Zone music!). If there's a pending criminal investigation by the Justice Department you can't expect someone to face a hostile public interrogation that can be used against you. Goes to show the folly of some of these investigations. Instead of Congress, which is essentually useless, trying to get to the bottom of this, let the professionals do their investigation first. As much as I'd like to see Issa get slapped around yet again by one of his witnesses (I notice he didn't have the b@lls to schedule a public hearing with Pickering over his Benghazi investigation), another dog and pony show is the last thing the country needs.
                  And I tend to agree with you on this one...the right really needs to pick and choose it's battles and actually wait until there is confirmed blood in the water before attacking on any of these issues. I'm sure some of the right will claim that if they don't press the issue on all these little things, the MSM won't pick it up and press the issue to get to the truth but it just doesn't seem worth it to any of these people to actually find hard facts and complete the loop before going public. That makes no sense to me.
                  Michigan Tech Legend, Founder of Mitch's Misfits, Co-Founder of Tech Hockey Guide, and Creator/Host of the Chasing MacNaughton Podcast covering MTU Hockey and the WCHA.

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                  • Re: 2nd Term Part 4: Donkeys, Elephants, and Porcupines

                    Originally posted by Shirtless Guy View Post
                    And I tend to agree with you on this one...the right really needs to pick and choose it's battles and actually wait until there is confirmed blood in the water before attacking on any of these issues. I'm sure some of the right will claim that if they don't press the issue on all these little things, the MSM won't pick it up and press the issue to get to the truth but it just doesn't seem worth it to any of these people to actually find hard facts and complete the loop before going public. That makes no sense to me.
                    Well, what is their day job? I mean, what would they do if they didn't have steroids or BCS or honoring the 3rd place team at the national knitting festival or some witch hunt to attend to? Either they have huge empty slots on the calendar that are filled with this type of BS or they are avoiding their real job to focus on politics, media issues and vote gathering. I know which one I believe it is.

                    It's like the difference between Lindsay Lohan and Glen Close...they are in the same business but one of them thinks you enhance your position by being seen, getting your name out there etc and one thinks you do it by perfecting and practicing your craft.

                    If you were a mediocre actress, or didn't want to spend your time in workshops and training, you might just take the easy path of risque photos, being seen in the right places etc.

                    Most of the idiots in DC have chosen the Lohan path. They believe it is better to grandstand 3 issues that are poorly thought out but resonate with the voters than to solve any one issue. If you only have 4 years, how many issues could you possibly solve...so they are trying to look like they are doing things while all they are doing is making sure they get seen on the tabloids, red carpets and E! enough to get voted onto the People Top 400 list.
                    I believe in life, and I believe in love, but the world in which I live in keeps trying to prove me wrong.

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                    • Re: 2nd Term Part 4: Donkeys, Elephants, and Porcupines

                      I don't think Congress, any Congress that is, should hold hearing on a pending criminal investigation unless they're investigating themselves. I'm sure I'm part of the feeding frenzy sometimes too, but its just too unproductive. If Issa and his committee wants to fish around Benghazi that's fine as there's no criminal investigation of the CIA or State Dept. Doesn't mean I don't think he's an idiot, but that's within their power to do so. If there's a final determination that the AP/etc searches were legally obtained, and then Congress wants to look into the reasonableness of the law, again that's within their rights. But this IRS thing they need to leave alone, as hard as it may be, until the real investigators are done doing their work. Its not like some of these showboaters can't just do the Sunday talk show circuit if they're that desperate for attention.
                      Legally drunk???? If its "legal", what's the ------- problem?!? - George Carlin

                      Ever notice how everybody who drives slower than you is an idiot, and everybody who drives faster is a maniac? - George Carlin

                      "I've never seen so much reason and bullsh*t contained in ONE MAN."

                      Comment


                      • Re: 2nd Term Part 4: Donkeys, Elephants, and Porcupines

                        Originally posted by Rover View Post
                        I don't think Congress, any Congress that is, should hold hearing on a pending criminal investigation unless they're investigating themselves. I'm sure I'm part of the feeding frenzy sometimes too, but its just too unproductive. If Issa and his committee wants to fish around Benghazi that's fine as there's no criminal investigation of the CIA or State Dept. Doesn't mean I don't think he's an idiot, but that's within their power to do so. If there's a final determination that the AP/etc searches were legally obtained, and then Congress wants to look into the reasonableness of the law, again that's within their rights. But this IRS thing they need to leave alone, as hard as it may be, until the real investigators are done doing their work. Its not like some of these showboaters can't just do the Sunday talk show circuit if they're that desperate for attention.
                        Actually, that is the process for impeachment, which is the only way you can criminally investigate a public official according to the Constitution.

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                        • Originally posted by FlagDUDE08 View Post
                          Actually, that is the process for impeachment, which is the only way you can criminally investigate a public official according to the Constitution.
                          I was always under the assumption that Congress can govern themselves. What I mean by that is if you can remember back to the Bob Packwood explusion he wasn't necessarily charged with a criminal matter I don't believe, but he pretty much unanimously was about to get bounced when he decided to resign instead.
                          Legally drunk???? If its "legal", what's the ------- problem?!? - George Carlin

                          Ever notice how everybody who drives slower than you is an idiot, and everybody who drives faster is a maniac? - George Carlin

                          "I've never seen so much reason and bullsh*t contained in ONE MAN."

                          Comment


                          • Re: 2nd Term Part 4: Donkeys, Elephants, and Porcupines

                            Originally posted by Old Pio View Post
                            It's a she. She is a high ranking official of the IRS. And congress has a constitutional obligation to provide oversight. Tax matters originate in the Ways and Means committee. She should answer the questions or resign. She has no constitutional guarantee of federal employment. She's not a Chicago hood trying to evade responsibility for mob killings. If she ultimately faces criminal charges for her actions, then she can plead the fifth 'till the cows come home. We pay her salary. She works for us. And we have a right to know about the skullduggery in her department. Answering the questions might even make a subsequent criminal prosecution more difficult or even impossible. Give her immunity. I don't care. Answer the questions or get out. If she wants to act like "Momo" Giancanna, let her do it on her own nickel.
                            Originally posted by FlagDUDE08 View Post
                            OK, she. Is she an American? Yes, she is. She has every right to not incriminate herself. People do bad things every day, but she still is protected by the Constitution. You don't selectively say people get certain rights and other people don't.
                            Got to agree with FD on this one. I expect anybody with half a brain to plead the fifth when what they say could possibly be used to prosecute them criminally. Given folks are out for a pound of flesh, she has to expect that somebody will be looking to charge her with something, and is smart to listen to her lawyers, who I am sure are screaming at her to keep her mouth shut.

                            Also, public employees have a right not to incriminate themselves. See Garrity v. New Jersey, where the Supremes held that telling a public employee they can either resign or incriminate themself makes anything the employee provides a coerced statement which cannot not be used against them in a criminal proceeding.

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                            • Originally posted by DisplacedCornellian View Post
                              Got to agree with FD on this one. I expect anybody with half a brain to plead the fifth when what they say could possibly be used to prosecute them criminally. Given folks are out for a pound of flesh, she has to expect that somebody will be looking to charge her with something, and is smart to listen to her lawyers, who I am sure are screaming at her to keep her mouth shut.

                              Also, public employees have a right not to incriminate themselves. See Garrity v. New Jersey, where the Supremes held that telling a public employee they can either resign or incriminate themself makes anything the employee provides a coerced statement which cannot not be used against them in a criminal proceeding.
                              OP doesn't understand that if she doesn't take the fifth now, anything she says can be used against her later on. It would therefore be pointless to take the fifth at a later time if she already incriminated herself.

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                              • Re: 2nd Term Part 4: Donkeys, Elephants, and Porcupines

                                Now it's starting to become more 60's like. http://www.wcvb.com/news/local/metro...z/-/index.html

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