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The Top 25 College Hockey Teams of the NCAA Era

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  • #91
    Re: The Top 25 College Hockey Teams of the NCAA Era

    Originally posted by FreshFish View Post
    Now I am even more confused....using your numbers, are you saying that in 'the old days' 17% to 20% of the teams back then had a 'legit' chance' to make the tournament?

    Now, 27.5% of the teams have a 'legit chance'? (or maybe more....how many of the 58 teams have a 'legit chance'? if it is fewer than 58, then the percentage of teams that have a legit chance goes up, no?)

    If more teams now have a 'legit chance' than before, doesn't that mean that teams today have a greater opportunity to earn points under your formula by playing tournament teams during the season than teams from 'the old days'?

    Obviously, in an 8-team tournament you never would see one conference placing five teams into it!
    Back in the day, two "west" teams (which were always a part of the WIHL/WCHA) and two "east" teams (which varied, but starting in '62 almost always were part of the ECAC) made the tournament. 6-7 teams were in the WCHA, and while there were significantly more teams in the ECAC, most years only 15-17 had any chance whatsoever to make the tournament. If you were independent you didn't have a chance. That's 21-24 teams for the most part, and I think you could argue that it was even fewer than that. That is where I was getting my numbers. You can't look at every team that was D-1 to get a legit number of teams that could make the tournament. Not even every team in the ECAC had a legit chance. Colby won the ECAC in '62 and did not get an invite. Harvard won the ECAC Regular Season AND Tournament title in 1963 but did not get an invite. Clearly there was a bias as to who should be selected to the NCAA Tournament. It is difficult to say how many teams had a "legit" chance to make the tournament back then, but it was definitely far smaller than the total number of teams that played D-1.

    Today, every team has a legit chance to make the tournament based on the Pairwise system. Added to that, each conference gets an auto-bid into the tournament. If Harvard wins the ECAC regular season title and tournament title, they will make the tournament. It's hard to argue that every team (with perhaps UAH as an exception) doesn't have a legit chance to make the tournament. Even UAH can make the tournament despite not being in a conference. It is far more difficult for them, but if they win the right games, they can make the tournament.

    As to your point about today's teams having the opportunity to earn more points, I have never suggested otherwise. That is why I had to tweak my formula to account for such an advantage. I believe I mentioned that in my very first post.

    At the end of the day, there are parts of the formula which reward older teams, and parts that reward recent teams. I felt that the formula overall skewed towards favoring recent teams, that is why I tweaked the formula to put the older teams on more level ground.
    North Dakota
    National Champions: 1959, 1963, 1980, 1982, 1987, 1997, 2000, 2016

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    • #92
      Re: The Top 25 College Hockey Teams of the NCAA Era

      #19 Has been released. Here is the link...

      http://www.collegehockeyweekly.com/Greatest-Teams.html
      North Dakota
      National Champions: 1959, 1963, 1980, 1982, 1987, 1997, 2000, 2016

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      • #93
        Re: The Top 25 College Hockey Teams of the NCAA Era

        Anyone ranking the 1970-1971 Boston University team that low does not have a clue about college hockey, I regret to say.

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        • #94
          Re: The Top 25 College Hockey Teams of the NCAA Era

          Originally posted by Fighting Sioux 23 View Post
          While an impressive team, they finished just outside the top 25, at #30. Had they won their conference tournament they would have been in the top 20. When the entire list is published, I'll post the top 50 or so here with point values.
          This, along with the ranking of 1970-1971 BU, makes it very clear FS23 is utterly clueless. Shame to waste so much time on something so worthless.

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          • #95
            Re: The Top 25 College Hockey Teams of the NCAA Era

            Originally posted by Shirtless Guy View Post
            I just mean that those 3 seasons were simply crazy with Michigan Tech & Minnesota winning the regular season title, each having a share of the league title (there wasn't a conference tournament), and the regular season runner up winning it all. From my perspective its frustrating that Herb Brooks cost MTU the chance at 2 more titles but it was an amazing run. I still love watching highlights from the 1975 title game:
            The coolest thing about this (besides it's a Tech win for the title) is hearing the pep band play.
            MTU Hockey fan since I was carried to a game in 1986 - for those counting... that's a lot of depressing hockey. Still love it.

            Surrounded by Badger Red in Wisconsin. Such an ugly color, but the beer and cheese are delicious...

            2014-15 WCHA (*Regular season portion) Pick-em Champion (**Forgeting a Week Methodology)

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            • #96
              Re: The Top 25 College Hockey Teams of the NCAA Era

              Originally posted by AlDeFlorio View Post
              This, along with the ranking of 1970-1971 BU, makes it very clear FS23 is utterly clueless. Shame to waste so much time on something so worthless.
              FWIW, it is my formula that you think is clueless. I did not rank the teams and build a formula around my preconceived notions. Instead, I built a formula and then plugged in all the numbers, and let the rankings fall where they may. If you would like, you can build your own formula, send it to me and I will plug in all the numbers (so long as it is reasonable).

              I think most people here, and in real life, would not call me utterly clueless. If it makes you feel better to do so because teams you think should have been higher rated, I understand. It really isn't necessary though.
              North Dakota
              National Champions: 1959, 1963, 1980, 1982, 1987, 1997, 2000, 2016

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              • #97
                Re: The Top 25 College Hockey Teams of the NCAA Era

                Originally posted by Fighting Sioux 23 View Post
                FWIW, it is my formula that you think is clueless. I did not rank the teams and build a formula around my preconceived notions. Instead, I built a formula and then plugged in all the numbers, and let the rankings fall where they may.
                It seemed to me that the second poster was being sarcastic in response to the first, at least I hope so.....

                I do appreciate the subtleties that go into this....I have built my own spreadsheet as alluded to before...I hope you take it as a compliment that someone really is paying attention when I mention that for # 20 I get 79.07% which rounds to 79.1%.....just as I was wondering before how you implemented a divisor (not that you did it, which I did understand from your first post, but how you went about doing it).

                I am still curious as to whether your adjustment for teams between eras was based on something like (1-available tournament slots /teams who might make tournament) and you responded by citing "teams that had a 'legitimate chance of making the tournament in your answer, which helped clarify things somewhat....so now my question would evolve to "did you use something like (1 - available tournament slots / teams who had a 'legitimate chance' of making the tournament) as a divisor as your method of equalizing?", or something like that but not quite, or something not like that at all....
                "Hope is a good thing; maybe the best of things."

                "Beer is a sign that God loves us and wants us to be happy." -- Benjamin Franklin

                "Being Irish, he had an abiding sense of tragedy, which sustained him through temporary periods of joy." -- W. B. Yeats

                "People generally are most impatient with those flaws in others about which they are most ashamed of in themselves." - folk wisdom

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                • #98
                  Re: The Top 25 College Hockey Teams of the NCAA Era

                  Originally posted by FreshFish View Post
                  It seemed to me that the second poster was being sarcastic in response to the first, at least I hope so.....

                  I do appreciate the subtleties that go into this....I have built my own spreadsheet as alluded to before...I hope you take it as a compliment that someone really is paying attention when I mention that for # 20 I get 79.07% which rounds to 79.1%.....just as I was wondering before how you implemented a divisor (not that you did it, which I did understand from your first post, but how you went about doing it).

                  I am still curious as to whether your adjustment for teams between eras was based on something like (1-available tournament slots /teams who might make tournament) and you responded by citing "teams that had a 'legitimate chance of making the tournament in your answer, which helped clarify things somewhat....so now my question would evolve to "did you use something like (1 - available tournament slots / teams who had a 'legitimate chance' of making the tournament) as a divisor as your method of equalizing?", or something like that but not quite, or something not like that at all....
                  It really wasn't like either of those options, as it wasn't completely based off of tournament teams. However, it would be more akin to the second option that you had. Plus, it was a multiplier, and not a divisor...I like points
                  North Dakota
                  National Champions: 1959, 1963, 1980, 1982, 1987, 1997, 2000, 2016

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                  • #99
                    Re: The Top 25 College Hockey Teams of the NCAA Era

                    Originally posted by Fighting Sioux 23 View Post
                    It really wasn't like either of those options, as it wasn't completely based off of tournament teams. However, it would be more akin to the second option that you had. Plus, it was a multiplier, and not a divisor...I like points
                    The discussion between you and FreshFish is making my brain hurt. Not that it takes much.
                    "My greatest achievement."
                    Dirty on getting me suspended from USCHO.

                    I'm not an alcoholic! I'm an independent beer taster for Anheuser Busch.

                    Happy~Smelling like a warm turd sandwich since 11/15/07.

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                    • Re: The Top 25 College Hockey Teams of the NCAA Era

                      Originally posted by AlDeFlorio View Post
                      This, along with the ranking of 1970-1971 BU, makes it very clear FS23 is utterly clueless. Shame to waste so much time on something so worthless.
                      Originally posted by CavalryNate
                      Disrespecting the Gophers is like disowning your mother the first time you get a girlfriend.
                      sigpic

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                      • Re: The Top 25 College Hockey Teams of the NCAA Era

                        Originally posted by AlDeFlorio View Post
                        This, along with the ranking of 1970-1971 BU, makes it very clear FS23 is utterly clueless. Shame to waste so much time on something so worthless.
                        Change your tampon and move along. FS23 is not even remotely clueless.
                        "My greatest achievement."
                        Dirty on getting me suspended from USCHO.

                        I'm not an alcoholic! I'm an independent beer taster for Anheuser Busch.

                        Happy~Smelling like a warm turd sandwich since 11/15/07.

                        Comment


                        • Re: The Top 25 College Hockey Teams of the NCAA Era

                          Originally posted by vizoroo View Post
                          Two teams that didn't win the championship come to my biased mind. DU's 2001 2002 that was sent to Yost to play Michigan in the regionals even though they were a #1 seed. And the "77-'78 team that wasn't allowed to compete in the NCAA's.** According to du78 that team still was ranked #1 at the end of the season.

                          **Don't remember the details, but DU would challenge the NCAA decision that players recruited within the rules. at that time, should later be called ineligible.
                          Is this where Gopher fans get the 25 year old Canadians crap?
                          Last edited by Goon; 10-30-2011, 10:25 AM.
                          Contributing Editor and College Hockey Writer at Inside Hockey
                          Eric's Twitter
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                          • Re: The Top 25 College Hockey Teams of the NCAA Era

                            Originally posted by Goon View Post
                            Is this where Gopher fans get the 5 year old Canadian crap?
                            I think it's where you can't speak without whining about the Gophers?

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                            • Re: The Top 25 College Hockey Teams of the NCAA Era

                              Originally posted by Fighting Sioux 23 View Post
                              FWIW, it is my formula that you think is clueless. I did not rank the teams and build a formula around my preconceived notions. Instead, I built a formula and then plugged in all the numbers, and let the rankings fall where they may. If you would like, you can build your own formula, send it to me and I will plug in all the numbers (so long as it is reasonable).

                              I think most people here, and in real life, would not call me utterly clueless. If it makes you feel better to do so because teams you think should have been higher rated, I understand. It really isn't necessary though.
                              classy post to an obvious d-bag... keep up the good work

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                              • Originally posted by Slap Shot View Post
                                I think it's where you can't speak without whining about the Gophers?
                                Goon's Law: If anything negative is said about the Sioux or positive about the Gophers, anywhere on the Interenet, Goon will find it and in some way be offended.

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