0 Days Since Last Shooting: Keep The Calendar At Zero

[Slap Shot]

Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: Keep The Calendar At Zero

Brent what exact proposals from the "other side" are you arguing won't matter? We can outlaw certain guns and while they won't disappear overnight they will eventually be reduced to a much smaller margin. And since most guns in the hands of criminals are stolen eventually there will be less supply for criminals.

When I present my opinion, I state it's my opinion. Not that difficult to understand.

How about something to validate the opinion instead of coming off uninformed?

[The Rube]

Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: Keep The Calendar At Zero

The full semi-auto ban will never happen, you're correct. The genie is out of the bottle on that one. The country is too big, has too many wide-open spaces, and too many semi-autos already sold. The reaction to the ATF showing up on some otherwise law-abiding hick's doorstep to collect his semi-automatic weapons, just like the NRA bleated at him for years that (((They))) would, is going to be very, very ugly. The NRA would jizz themselves hastening to canonize the "great patriots who stood their ground", or whatever. This would very likely trigger a guerrilla version of Civil War 2.

The problem is, the NRA and their paid-for lackeys in Congress won't give even a single inch on any of the less severe proposals that a vast majority of Americans agree with, such as what has already been discussed here ad nauseam.

This, Slap. This. The BANZ THE GUNZ (or anything similar) is not sustainable or even enforceable.

So, let's ban any mods, go full-on background on all sales, and (this last one is tricky, due to privacy laws) do a double-verified mental health check for any gun owner.

Edit: forgot to add, if convicted of any violent crime, gun rights are taken away.

[Slap Shot]

Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: Keep The Calendar At Zero

This, Slap. This. The BANZ THE GUNZ (or anything similar) is not sustainable or even enforceable. .

No, not that sorry. They did it elsewhere and while the gun count wasn't the same in Australia for instance that's not the point. And it's an obfuscation to claim the intent of a ban is meant to instantly remove all banned guns from households. Offer buybacks and those that don't want to relinquish them wouldn't have to (at a maximum of 10 years for instance) , but if they fall into the hands of someone else you're effed. None of what you quoted negates what I said and eventually the count significantly dwindles.

[leswp1]

Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: Keep The Calendar At Zero

No, not that sorry. They did it elsewhere and while the gun count wasn't the same in Australia for instance that's not the point. And it's an obfuscation to claim the intent of a ban is meant to instantly remove all banned guns from households. Offer buybacks and those that don't want to relinquish them wouldn't have to (at a maximum of 10 years for instance) , but if they fall into the hands of someone else you're effed. None of what you quoted negates what I said and eventually the count significantly dwindles.

This is a great idea.
Uninformed- do they do a thing where the ballistics of the gun are filed somewhere? Is this a reasonable thing?

[The Rube]

Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: Keep The Calendar At Zero

No, not that sorry. They did it elsewhere and while the gun count wasn't the same in Australia for instance that's not the point. And it's an obfuscation to claim the intent of a ban is meant to instantly remove all banned guns from households. Offer buybacks and those that don't want to relinquish them wouldn't have to (at a maximum of 10 years for instance) , but if they fall into the hands of someone else you're effed. None of what you quoted negates what I said and eventually the count significantly dwindles.

AUS is an island. That helps their cause (water and such as a natural border). Going back to Square 1, is the US's attitude towards guns. That's the biggest key in this whole thing. And buybacks? Ok, Johnny Redneck will sell back 10 of his 15 guns. That's still 5 guns out there (extreme example, but doesn't make it a lie). The idea of going back to revolvers and single shot shotguns/rifles is dead. Will never happen, because as Fade said, we are in too deep at this point.

And if you really want to push, and imprison the gun lawbreakers? Last I heard, prisons are pretty over-crowded right now. Imagine imprisoning the responsible gun owners that violate a newly-passed gun ban.

Also: what les said: if someone's gun that is not stolen (proven) and used in a crime, gun owner is also responsible for abetting.

[jerphisch]

Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: Keep The Calendar At Zero

And if you really want to push, and imprison the gun lawbreakers? Last I heard, prisons are pretty over-crowded right now. Imagine imprisoning the responsible gun owners that violate a newly-passed gun ban.

This is an interesting position given your take on illegal immigration. What is it that makes these "responsible" gun owners different? I thought illegal was illegal?

[The Rube]

Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: Keep The Calendar At Zero

This is an interesting position given your take on illegal immigration. What is it that makes these "responsible" gun owners different? I thought illegal was illegal?

So, let's say the banning of all the guns happens tomorrow. John Doe, who has obeyed every single gun law in his life, happens to have a gun after the ban. Boom, done. Arrested. Jailed. Despite the 2nd Amendment, all that jazz. It was in a safe and he forgot about it, I dunno. It was an antique gun that is un-usable and in the attic. Still illegal.

There would be situations like this. My dad was cleaning out his dad's house after his death, and found a safe in the attic with 3 antique guns in there. Completely useless, even the firearms expert said to either display only, or destroy them. NEVER attempt to fire them.

[trixR4kids]

Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: Keep The Calendar At Zero

this is an interesting position given your take on illegal immigration. What is it that makes these "responsible" gun owners different? I thought illegal was illegal?

Lmao

[Slap Shot]

Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: Keep The Calendar At Zero

AUS is an island. That helps their cause (water and such as a natural border). Going back to Square 1, is the US's attitude towards guns. That's the biggest key in this whole thing. And buybacks? Ok, Johnny Redneck will sell back 10 of his 15 guns. That's still 5 guns out there (extreme example, but doesn't make it a lie). The idea of going back to revolvers and single shot shotguns/rifles is dead. Will never happen, because as Fade said, we are in too deep at this point.

And if you really want to push, and imprison the gun lawbreakers? Last I heard, prisons are pretty over-crowded right now. Imagine imprisoning the responsible gun owners that violate a newly-passed gun ban.

Nothing in your first paragraph negates my hypothetical proposal nor the intent which is reducing the population of a specific list of banned guns. Even if some dude only turns in 10 of 15 that's still at 67% reduction.

If you won't turn your gun in within 10 years of the ban (again per my hypothetical) then you deserve the result if caught. However this doesn't require (not would I implement) law enforcement going door to door Fahrenheit 451 style to have measurable impact.

Also my, "you're effed" comment was more in relation to if a gun you own is stolen and used in a crime and less about if you neglect to turn yours in. Although that too would result in a penalty increasing in severity the longer you keep it.

[The Rube]

Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: Keep The Calendar At Zero

Nothing in your first paragraph negates my hypothetical proposal nor the intent of reducing the population of the banned guns (even if some dude only turns in 10 of 15 that's still at 67% reduction) and if you won't turn your gun in within 10 years of the ban (again per my hypothetical) then you deserve the result if caught. This doesn't require law enforcement going door to door Fahrenheit 451 style.

Also my, "you're effed" comment was more in relation to if a gun you own is stolen and used in a crime and not if you neglect to turn yours in.

If the gun is proven stolen, the owner should not be held responsible. There are many details in that, including was the gun stored properly (on your hip/in a safe, depending on the laws where you live), etc. Not resting on a cupboard or under the bed, etc.

I think with the suggestions I've made, allowing for some tweaks of course, that natural reduction of gun ownership would happen; don't need to outright ban.

[jerphisch]

Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: Keep The Calendar At Zero

So, let's say the banning of all the guns happens tomorrow. John Doe, who has obeyed every single gun law in his life, happens to have a gun after the ban. Boom, done. Arrested. Jailed. Despite the 2nd Amendment, all that jazz. It was in a safe and he forgot about it, I dunno. It was an antique gun that is un-usable and in the attic. Still illegal.

There would be situations like this. My dad was cleaning out his dad's house after his death, and found a safe in the attic with 3 antique guns in there. Completely useless, even the firearms expert said to either display only, or destroy them. NEVER attempt to fire them.

So you're telling me that the people you just finished saying were responsible, suddenly don't remember they even owned a gun?

[The Rube]

Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: Keep The Calendar At Zero

So you're telling me that the people you just finished saying were responsible, suddenly don't remember they even owned a gun?

My grandpa (in the case I mentioned) shoved all that crap up in the attic, and he got old and forgot about it. Again, stored in a secured safe. It's nitpicking, but it is a real situation that does happen.

[Slap Shot]

Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: Keep The Calendar At Zero

If the gun is proven stolen, the owner should not be held responsible. There are many details in that, including was the gun stored properly (on your hip/in a safe, depending on the laws where you live), etc. Not resting on a cupboard or under the bed, etc.

I think with the suggestions I've made, allowing for some tweaks of course, that natural reduction of gun ownership would happen; don't need to outright ban.

1. Cry me a river. If a gun was stolen from an owner after the ban and 10 year window for turning it in then eff them
2. No one is asking for an outright ban (selective only) and nothing you've suggested that I can see will result in any reductions

[The Rube]

Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: Keep The Calendar At Zero

1. Cry me a river. If a gun was stolen from an owner after the ban and 10 year window for turning it in then eff them
2. No one is asking for an outright ban (selective only) and nothing you've suggested that I can see will result in any reductions

You're saying that having ALL sales having background checks, having double-verified mental health checks won't result in reductions?? Really?

[jerphisch]

Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: Keep The Calendar At Zero

My grandpa (in the case I mentioned) shoved all that crap up in the attic, and he got old and forgot about it. Again, stored in a secured safe. It's nitpicking, but it is a real situation that does happen.

Somehow I see common sense in whatever law exists allowing for some situations like this without immediately jailing people. But let's say your grandpa has grandkids who go into the attic, still a super responsible gun owner?