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Thread: SCOTUS 10: Pack the Court!

  1. #201
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    Re: SCOTUS 10: Pack the Court!

    Quote Originally Posted by Kepler View Post
    Gerrymandering is one of those issues where every voter should mobilize against both parties. When representatives can choose their voters the entire American democracy falls to ruin.

    Removing partisan politics from drawing districts is a bare minimum requirement for a working democracy.
    As laudable as your goals may be, I'd prefer Dems (and Goopers as well) to focus on what's achievable in the here and now. To that end, the state lawsuit that forced less partisan lines in PA is a good template for what could work elsewhere. There's also the laws enacted by citizens initiatives in Florida and Arizona that either curbed gerrymandering or put it in the hands of an independent commission. I'd be happy to see that applied in places like WI, MI, NC and OH as well as IL, MD, MA or any other Dem gerrymander.
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  2. #202
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    Re: SCOTUS 10: Pack the Court!

    Quote Originally Posted by Kepler View Post
    Like nominating someone more electorally appetizing than transmissible spongiform encephalopathy.
    Hey, your misogyny helped make this happen so every time corporate American wins at the SCOTUS make sure to give yourself a pat on the back (or a flogging, whichever you prefer).
    Legally drunk???? If its "legal", what's the ------- problem?!? - George Carlin

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  3. #203

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    Re: SCOTUS 10: Pack the Court!

    Quote Originally Posted by Rover View Post
    As laudable as your goals may be, I'd prefer Dems (and Goopers as well) to focus on what's achievable in the here and now. To that end, the state lawsuit that forced less partisan lines in PA is a good template for what could work elsewhere. There's also the laws enacted by citizens initiatives in Florida and Arizona that either curbed gerrymandering or put it in the hands of an independent commission. I'd be happy to see that applied in places like WI, MI, NC and OH as well as IL, MD, MA or any other Dem gerrymander.
    I've never understood the reaction to aspiration that says "that's not achievable." So what? So, just forget about it?

    We should use the end of partisan districts and the end of political bribery as stars to navigate by while we build towards those goals with policies. The important thing to remember with both these issues is they aren't the usual left vs right, they are voters vs the political establishment. These are reforms we are going to have to force on both unwilling parties. It's their rent-seeking that we have to overturn. The GOP and Democratic Establishment will squeal like stuck pigs against eliminating either of these criminal enterprises. We will have to fight together.

    And that's very good practice -- voters of both parties joining forces to fight the political class, because it's not that big a leap afterwards to the 99% fighting the 1%.

    Left vs right politics is, in large part, just black vs white writ large: a way to divide the sheep so the wolves can feed.
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  4. #204

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    Quote Originally Posted by ScoobyDoo View Post
    5-4. What did you expect? They're not hiding it anymore.
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  5. #205
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    Quote Originally Posted by joecct View Post
    It is. But it has been part of the US political process since the founding of the republic without court interference.

    The solution is also political - make sure that the legislature can't do that via the ballot box.

    One of the questions I plan to ask the MD legislative candidates this fall is their position on the gerrymander. If they think it's no big deal, they will not get my vote.
    So essentially your solution to R's being disenfranchised is for R's to use their votes to effect change. Do you not see the logical flaw there?

  6. #206
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    Re: SCOTUS 10: Pack the Court!

    Quote Originally Posted by Kepler View Post
    I've never understood the reaction to aspiration that says "that's not achievable." So what? So, just forget about it?

    We should use the end of partisan districts and the end of political bribery as stars to navigate by while we build towards those goals with policies. The important thing to remember with both these issues is they aren't the usual left vs right, they are voters vs the political establishment. These are reforms we are going to have to force on both unwilling parties. It's their rent-seeking that we have to overturn. The GOP and Democratic Establishment will squeal like stuck pigs against eliminating either of these criminal enterprises. We will have to fight together.

    And that's very good practice -- voters of both parties joining forces to fight the political class, because it's not that big a leap afterwards to the 99% fighting the 1%.

    Left vs right politics is, in large part, just black vs white writ large: a way to divide the sheep so the wolves can feed.
    Kep its not that your heart isn't in the right place. Its just that once again you're giving righty voters way more credit than they've actually earned. Yes everyone should strive for fair districts regardless of ideology but that ignores the fact that approx. half the voters are in a cult. I know you dream of a utopian society where common sense objectives unite everyone, but I'd ask you to consider what happens when common sense doesn't appeal to the entire right end of the spectrum?

    National anti-gerrymandering legislation is not achievable because the SCOTUS stands in the way. Much like overturning Citizens United. So, confining this view to our lifetimes, a state by state assault on the problem is what's needed and achievable. Its already happened in places like FL and AZ. Really we're talking a handful of states that need to be addressed. In no particular order NC, MD, OH, IL, WI, and MI. Most other states are either too small to matter, already have laws in place, or are partisan enough that even a change in redistricting law wouldn't really affect their representation (think Mass or Tennessee).
    Legally drunk???? If its "legal", what's the ------- problem?!? - George Carlin

    Ever notice how everybody who drives slower than you is an idiot, and everybody who drives faster is a maniac? - George Carlin

    "I've never seen so much reason and bullsh*t contained in ONE MAN."

  7. #207
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    Re: SCOTUS 10: Pack the Court!

    Quote Originally Posted by joecct View Post
    Maryland was heavily gerrymandered for the Democrats.

    *partisan claptrap*
    Gerrymandering should end everywhere. That's why I'm planning to vote for this in the fall:

    http://www.mlive.com/news/index.ssf/..._independ.html

    I'm sure it will be bloody, but at least the voters will decide.
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  8. #208
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    Quote Originally Posted by FadeToBlack&Gold View Post
    Gerrymandering should end everywhere. That's why I'm planning to vote for this in the fall:

    http://www.mlive.com/news/index.ssf/..._independ.html

    I'm sure it will be bloody, but at least the voters will decide.
    Rulers, protractors, and pens.

    QED

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