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  • Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: But the Second Amendment!

    Originally posted by 5mn_Major View Post
    Convicted of manipulating and lying to Congress? Yeah, perfect.
    Um, was Ollie convicted of a felony? I believe "yes", but it was later vacated. Either way, at one point he was a convicted felon.

    That's an epic choice-fail by the NRA.
    The preceding post may contain trigger words and is not safe-space approved. <-- Virtue signaling.

    North Dakota Hockey:

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    • Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: But the Second Amendment!

      Originally posted by bronconick View Post
      Oliver North will be the new head of the NRA.

      The jokes write themselves
      That was my first thought.
      Never really developed a taste for tequila. Kind of hard to understand how you make a drink out of something that sharp, inhospitable. Now, bourbon is easy to understand.
      Tastes like a warm summer day. -Raylan Givens

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      • Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: But the Second Amendment!

        CO Red Flag law passes the house with only 2 yes votes from Rs, will fail in R controlled senate. Can we stop pretending that Rs are in favor of any sort of common sense incremental change yet? This is exactly the sort of law that could have saved the lives of 17 children, Rs don't care, they've already been born.
        https://www.denverpost.com/2018/05/0...-passes-house/

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        • Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: But the Second Amendment!

          Originally posted by jerphisch View Post
          CO Red Flag law passes the house with only 2 yes votes from Rs, will fail in R controlled senate. Can we stop pretending that Rs are in favor of any sort of common sense incremental change yet? This is exactly the sort of law that could have saved the lives of 17 children, Rs don't care, they've already been born.
          https://www.denverpost.com/2018/05/0...-passes-house/
          Cuz the veterans. “If you truly care about those in uniform who protect us every day you will not take away the rights that they defend overseas,” said House Minority Leader Patrick Neville, R-Castle Rock.
          Go Gophers!

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          • Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: But the Second Amendment!

            Originally posted by jerphisch View Post
            CO Red Flag law passes the house with only 2 yes votes from Rs, will fail in R controlled senate. Can we stop pretending that Rs are in favor of any sort of common sense incremental change yet? This is exactly the sort of law that could have saved the lives of 17 children, Rs don't care, they've already been born.
            https://www.denverpost.com/2018/05/0...-passes-house/
            I think that entire concept is an excellent idea, but I'm not sure the "red flag law" is even necessary in Colorado or most other states. Pretty much every state already has an emergency conservator or guardian law for exactly these types of situations. You petition the Court by providing basic evidence that the individual is at risk, either personally or financially. There is a court hearing and if the judge is satisfied, the guardian or conservator is appointed. That person then has the right to go in and take control of the property of the subject.

            I think that's the perfect response by families and government agencies for exactly these types of cases.
            That community is already in the process of dissolution where each man begins to eye his neighbor as a possible enemy, where non-conformity with the accepted creed, political as well as religious, is a mark of disaffection; where denunciation, without specification or backing, takes the place of evidence; where orthodoxy chokes freedom of dissent; where faith in the eventual supremacy of reason has become so timid that we dare not enter our convictions in the open lists, to win or lose.

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            • Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: But the Second Amendment!

              Originally posted by SJHovey View Post
              I think that entire concept is an excellent idea, but I'm not sure the "red flag law" is even necessary in Colorado or most other states. Pretty much every state already has an emergency conservator or guardian law for exactly these types of situations. You petition the Court by providing basic evidence that the individual is at risk, either personally or financially. There is a court hearing and if the judge is satisfied, the guardian or conservator is appointed. That person then has the right to go in and take control of the property of the subject.

              I think that's the perfect response by families and government agencies for exactly these types of cases.
              Yeah, well that's all window dressing. And for the GOP, even window dressings are offensive.

              80% of guns used by felons come from friends, family, the street or illegal sources. Pretty sure you won't be happy with any solution that has a real impact on the numbers.

              https://bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/fuo.pdf
              Go Gophers!

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              • Originally posted by French Rage View Post
                Does the American Dad! clip need a new verse?
                https://youtu.be/lFV1uT-ihDo

                For the uninitiated.
                Go Green! Go White! Go State!

                1966, 1986, 2007

                Go Tigers, Go Packers, Go Red Wings, Go Pistons

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                • Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: But the Second Amendment!

                  Originally posted by SJHovey View Post
                  I think that entire concept is an excellent idea, but I'm not sure the "red flag law" is even necessary in Colorado or most other states. Pretty much every state already has an emergency conservator or guardian law for exactly these types of situations. You petition the Court by providing basic evidence that the individual is at risk, either personally or financially. There is a court hearing and if the judge is satisfied, the guardian or conservator is appointed. That person then has the right to go in and take control of the property of the subject.

                  I think that's the perfect response by families and government agencies for exactly these types of cases.
                  So it's an excellent idea, but just in case it's overlappy with other laws let's not do it. Makes sense...
                  At least Drew will just come out and say he doesn't think being nuts and a threat yourself/others is reason to take someone's gun away.

                  Comment


                  • Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: But the Second Amendment!

                    Originally posted by jerphisch View Post
                    So it's an excellent idea, but just in case it's overlappy with other laws let's not do it. Makes sense...
                    At least Drew will just come out and say he doesn't think being nuts and a threat yourself/others is reason to take someone's gun away.
                    I'm not opposed to a law like that proposed in Colorado. What I'm saying is that I don't think it's failure to pass should cause us to just throw up our hands and cry "woe is me", or sit in a corner and pout. We have good, existing laws, that if people would just use them we could probably prevent at least some of of these events.

                    What do you think the "red flag law" is modeled after? You think somebody just thought the whole process up? It's modeled after emergency conservator/guardian laws, and even more closely modeled after order for protection laws used in domestic violence cases.

                    The order for protection laws won't work for gun cases unless you can identify a specific target, but if you've got someone who appears to family members to be unstable, who is collecting a bunch of guns, who is making violent or troubling statements on social media, or exhibiting the other "red flags" that everyone sees so clearly after the fact, get into court and get a guardian appointed. If the threat is real, a judge will take action. If it isn't, well then what action do you expect to be taken?
                    That community is already in the process of dissolution where each man begins to eye his neighbor as a possible enemy, where non-conformity with the accepted creed, political as well as religious, is a mark of disaffection; where denunciation, without specification or backing, takes the place of evidence; where orthodoxy chokes freedom of dissent; where faith in the eventual supremacy of reason has become so timid that we dare not enter our convictions in the open lists, to win or lose.

                    Comment


                    • Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: But the Second Amendment!

                      Originally posted by SJHovey View Post
                      I'm not opposed to a law like that proposed in Colorado. What I'm saying is that I don't think it's failure to pass should cause us to just throw up our hands and cry "woe is me", or sit in a corner and pout. We have good, existing laws, that if people would just use them we could probably prevent at least some of of these events.

                      What do you think the "red flag law" is modeled after? You think somebody just thought the whole process up? It's modeled after emergency conservator/guardian laws, and even more closely modeled after order for protection laws used in domestic violence cases.

                      The order for protection laws won't work for gun cases unless you can identify a specific target, but if you've got someone who appears to family members to be unstable, who is collecting a bunch of guns, who is making violent or troubling statements on social media, or exhibiting the other "red flags" that everyone sees so clearly after the fact, get into court and get a guardian appointed. If the threat is real, a judge will take action. If it isn't, well then what action do you expect to be taken?
                      The difference is the red flag law would allow taking the guns BEFORE getting into court, which could literally be the difference between life and death. And I'm not throwing up my hands saying woe is me, I'm saying Rs that pretend care about life are lying sacks of poop, here's exhibit AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAB.

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                      • Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: But the Second Amendment!

                        Originally posted by jerphisch View Post
                        The difference is the red flag law would allow taking the guns BEFORE getting into court,
                        I don't think that's what the bill said, although you can read it yourself. I think that you have to go in on an emergency petition and get a judge to sign off on it. Then there is a second court hearing to determine whether the guns should be taken away long term.

                        https://leg.colorado.gov/bills/hb18-1436
                        That community is already in the process of dissolution where each man begins to eye his neighbor as a possible enemy, where non-conformity with the accepted creed, political as well as religious, is a mark of disaffection; where denunciation, without specification or backing, takes the place of evidence; where orthodoxy chokes freedom of dissent; where faith in the eventual supremacy of reason has become so timid that we dare not enter our convictions in the open lists, to win or lose.

                        Comment


                        • Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: But the Second Amendment!

                          Originally posted by SJHovey View Post
                          I don't think that's what the bill said, although you can read it yourself. I think that you have to go in on an emergency petition and get a judge to sign off on it. Then there is a second court hearing to determine whether the guns should be taken away long term.

                          https://leg.colorado.gov/bills/hb18-1436
                          Yeah I worded it poorly, but there would clearly be a lower burden of proof for the emergency petition that would speed the initial process.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by jerphisch View Post
                            So it's an excellent idea, but just in case it's overlappy with other laws let's not do it. Makes sense...
                            At least Drew will just come out and say he doesn't think being nuts and a threat yourself/others is reason to take someone's gun away.
                            Wrong. I’ve posted plenty of times if a court determines someone is a threat to themselves or others they should lose their right to have guns. I do think the guns should be auctioned off or something like that and they should get the proceeds(as long as they haven’t been used in a crime.)
                            Originally posted by BobbyBrady
                            Crosby probably wouldn't even be on BC's top two lines next year

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                            • Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: But the Second Amendment!

                              Originally posted by Drew S. View Post
                              Wrong. I’ve posted plenty of times if a court determines someone is a threat to themselves or others they should lose their right to have guns. I do think the guns should be auctioned off or something like that and they should get the proceeds(as long as they haven’t been used in a crime.)
                              You've also posted plenty of times in favor of people deemed incapable of handling their finances being able to keep their guns, so, not wrong.

                              Comment


                              • Re: 0 Days Since Last Shooting: But the Second Amendment!

                                Originally posted by Drew S. View Post
                                Wrong. I’ve posted plenty of times if a court determines someone is a threat to themselves or others they should lose their right to have guns. I do think the guns should be auctioned off or something like that and they should get the proceeds(as long as they haven’t been used in a crime.)
                                any confiscated guns should be held for a period of time to allow for appeals and then destroyed. we have enough guns.

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