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Thread: TV: Did you make Barry's List?

  1. #81

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    Re: TV: Did you make Barry's List?

    Quote Originally Posted by Deutsche Gopher Fan View Post
    Sheela in the Netflix doc Wild Wild Country
    Ah. OK. That's the one about the Rajneeshes, right? I knew people in OR who had to contend with them. Really nasty piece of work.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kepler View Post
    Ah. OK. That's the one about the Rajneeshes, right? I knew people in OR who had to contend with them. Really nasty piece of work.
    Yes. I didnít know about them until this came out and holy crap

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    Re: TV: Did you make Barry's List?

    Quote Originally Posted by Deutsche Gopher Fan View Post
    Yes. I didnít know about them until this came out and holy crap
    Same here, and after watching a few episodes (I'm stuck after 3, since my wife wants to catch up now), I can't believe I'd never heard of them. It is crazy how a cult like that works, and this documentary gets some very good inside information on how it worked. Very revealing. The thing that struck me is, the former members that are interviewed are still in denial. They still don't think they were in a cult, and don't realize how wrong they were. I think some of them still think the guy was a god. Sheela, not so much, she knew what was going on and used it all to improve her own life. She was manipulating both sides, to better herself. I haven't gotten to the end yet, and I'm hoping to find out it all collapsed in on her.
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    Re: TV: Did you make Barry's List?

    Quote Originally Posted by Deutsche Gopher Fan View Post
    Yes. I didnít know about them until this came out and holy crap
    Yeah. It doesn't have to be sensationalized at all. They were hard core and serious as a heart attack.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigblue_dl View Post
    Same here, and after watching a few episodes (I'm stuck after 3, since my wife wants to catch up now), I can't believe I'd never heard of them. It is crazy how a cult like that works, and this documentary gets some very good inside information on how it worked. Very revealing. The thing that struck me is, the former members that are interviewed are still in denial. They still don't think they were in a cult, and don't realize how wrong they were. I think some of them still think the guy was a god. Sheela, not so much, she knew what was going on and used it all to improve her own life. She was manipulating both sides, to better herself. I haven't gotten to the end yet, and I'm hoping to find out it all collapsed in on her.
    My only complaint , and I donít think this is giving anything away, is that the last episodes follow a similar format to the first ones- so sheís allowed to tell her side and thereís no narrator to challenge her on the asinine things she did

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    Re: TV: Did you make Barry's List?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kepler View Post
    Yeah. It doesn't have to be sensationalized at all. They were hard core and serious as a heart attack.
    I finished that show Saturday. I was left with the conclusion that every single person in that show was either corrupt, evil, incredibly stupid, bigoted, or some combination of all four. I couldn't find a single person with one redeeming quality who made an appearance in that show, other than maybe one of the homeless guys who got suckered into taking the bus ride and drinking the kool-aid.
    That community is already in the process of dissolution where each man begins to eye his neighbor as a possible enemy, where non-conformity with the accepted creed, political as well as religious, is a mark of disaffection; where denunciation, without specification or backing, takes the place of evidence; where orthodoxy chokes freedom of dissent; where faith in the eventual supremacy of reason has become so timid that we dare not enter our convictions in the open lists, to win or lose.

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    Re: TV: Did you make Barry's List?

    Quote Originally Posted by SJHovey View Post
    I was left with the conclusion that every single person in that show was either corrupt, evil, incredibly stupid, bigoted, or some combination of all four.
    In short, people.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kepler View Post
    "The man who doesn't read good books has no advantage over the man who can't read them."
    My wife and I are season ticket holders to the touring Broadway show series in town. Neither of us had any interest in watching that made for tv crap.

    Then again, neither of us like JCSS in its proper form, either.

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    Minding the gap MinnesotaNorthStar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigblue_dl View Post
    Me too. She is one of the most manipulative people I've ever seen profiled on TV. Just a terrible human, taking advantage of anyone and everyone.
    Finished it last night....she only gets worse.

    Quote Originally Posted by Deutsche Gopher Fan View Post
    Yes. I didnít know about them until this came out and holy crap
    Me either. I was also age 0-4 while this was happening.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MinnesotaNorthStar View Post
    Finished it last night....she only gets worse.



    Me either. I was also age 0-4 while this was happening.
    Yeah I was born in 79 so Iím giving myself a pass

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    Re: TV: Did you make Barry's List?

    Quote Originally Posted by unofan View Post
    My wife and I are season ticket holders to the touring Broadway show series in town. Neither of us had any interest in watching that made for tv crap.

    Then again, neither of us like JCSS in its proper form, either.
    I'm tellin ya, man, it was great. And I am not a big fan of JCS.
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    Re: TV: Did you make Barry's List?

    *sigh* gonna end up watching that documentary. Thanks, f*ers.
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    Re: TV: Did you make Barry's List?

    I am halfway through episode 3 and I wont lie...I side with the "cult" more than I do with the rednecks in Oregon. I know that is going to change but if the people of Antelope (and others) had just been a bit more hospitable (you know like not bombing the hotel in Portland) none of this happens. Add in the money of "Mr. Nike" and his friendship with the AG and...yeah.

    And if this cult believed in Jesus none of this happens. Hell most of the people that were arguing "Establishment Clause" would have zero issue if any of this was founded in the name of The Church.

    Of course if the cult had just backed off and treated Antelope with a bit of respect who knows...both sides of this fight are equally stupid.

    edit: And here...she...GOES!
    Last edited by Handyman; 04-03-2018 at 01:27 AM.
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    Re: TV: Did you make Barry's List?

    Quote Originally Posted by Handyman View Post
    I am halfway through episode 3 and I wont lie...I side with the "cult" more than I do with the rednecks in Oregon. I know that is going to change but if the people of Antelope (and others) had just been a bit more hospitable (you know like not bombing the hotel in Portland) none of this happens. Add in the money of "Mr. Nike" and his friendship with the AG and...yeah.

    And if this cult believed in Jesus none of this happens. Hell most of the people that were arguing "Establishment Clause" would have zero issue if any of this was founded in the name of The Church.

    Of course if the cult had just backed off and treated Antelope with a bit of respect who knows...both sides of this fight are equally stupid.

    edit: And here...she...GOES!
    I think you and I went through the same set of reactions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dxmnkd316 View Post
    I think you and I went through the same set of reactions.
    Yeah pretty much. The towns people sucked.
    Doesnít excuse what was to come though

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    Re: TV: Did you make Barry's List?

    I have sympathy for the townspeople of Antelope. They weren't really given the opportunity to ignore the cult, the cult showed up and forced themselves on the town, and the people. They didn't stay to themselves on their compound, they actively antagonized the locals, and made their lives worse.
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    Re: TV: Did you make Barry's List?

    Quote Originally Posted by bigblue_dl View Post
    I have sympathy for the townspeople of Antelope. They weren't really given the opportunity to ignore the cult, the cult showed up and forced themselves on the town, and the people. They didn't stay to themselves on their compound, they actively antagonized the locals, and made their lives worse.
    I feel for them but the townspeople wanted them out from day 1. They never even gave them a chance they thought they were a bunch of hippy dippy outsiders who were in league with Satan. (and I know firsthand that being an outsider in the Pacific Northwest makes you suspicious) This is where if the cult had been smart they would have tried to win them over but instead chose to go the legal route.

    It is pathetic though how bad Oregon itself is acting over this though. Suspending registration to vote because you dont want them to use the law you put in place to gain power? Letting people with uber money and connections use their influence to smear the group to the point it glorified violence against them. (how many people seemed to say they would shoot the people if they could...and then the bombing) The AG taking up the fight to disband their city because...well there is no real legal reason why and "Establishment Clause" is shaky at best when places like Salt Lake City and other religious cities exist. (but he is friends with Mr. Nike) They didnt like that the cult was smart enough to do things the right way so they said "screw it" and just stacked the deck.

    Now none of that excuses what is to come. (or even what is happening now) Harassing people is not the way to change their minds. Becoming militant is not the way to go. Using the law was brilliant (say what you will Sheela was beating them at their own game) but all of the good you did gets overshadowed. No one remembers the way you reclaimed the land, fixed the ecology and really created something kind of amazing out of nothing...they remember that you went nutso because you didnt get your way.
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    Re: TV: Did you make Barry's List?

    I think the first (not sure if there are more coming) Irene Adler episode in BBC's Sherlock is the single greatest episode of television ever aired.
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    Re: TV: Did you make Barry's List?

    Quote Originally Posted by bigblue_dl View Post
    I have sympathy for the townspeople of Antelope. They weren't really given the opportunity to ignore the cult, the cult showed up and forced themselves on the town, and the people. They didn't stay to themselves on their compound, they actively antagonized the locals, and made their lives worse.
    There was plenty of blame to go around.

    Let's be candid, they looked like a group of freaks. Certainly to rural townspeople of Oregon, but pretty much anywhere else as well.

    I really wonder what would have happened if they had been allowed to set up and incorporate their own city and basically keep it as an independent municipality to be run by themselves. They didn't really start moving on Antelope until they felt they had no choice if they wanted to have a City.

    Personally, I think there would have been no problems with Antelope had they been permitted to do that, but ultimately there would still have been conflict with the County and the State. The County and State would have the need to enforce planning and zoning issues and so on, and I'm not sure this group would have ever felt comfortable letting an agency they don't control tell them what to do.

    At the end of the day, the people of Oregon got what they wanted -- to run the cult out of the state. To accomplish this they actually had to ignore or look past some pretty serious criminal conduct. Who else gets to conspire to kill a U.S. attorney, attempt to murder someone, conspire to poison the water supply of a town, actually poison public restaurant salad bars, engage in immigration fraud, drug bus loads of homeless people when they no longer serve your purpose, and a host of other crimes, and get to walk after about 3 years in jail? Only someone you really want out of the country because they are weird.

    On the other hand, the US government certainly didn't do itself proud. Spent who knows how many hundreds of thousands of dollars chasing Osha's Lear jets across the country to prevent his escape, then return him to Oregon on a flight from hell that took eight days and involved stops in a dozen U.S. cities, all just to torture him. Then, when they get him back to Oregon he offers to plead guilty if they'll let him leave the country, and they say OK?!?!

    I loved it when a reporter asks why go to all the trouble and expense to prevent him from leaving in the Lear jets if the whole goal was to deport him. The U.S. official basically says "we don't work that way." W T F?

    It was a very aggravating documentary series to watch.
    That community is already in the process of dissolution where each man begins to eye his neighbor as a possible enemy, where non-conformity with the accepted creed, political as well as religious, is a mark of disaffection; where denunciation, without specification or backing, takes the place of evidence; where orthodoxy chokes freedom of dissent; where faith in the eventual supremacy of reason has become so timid that we dare not enter our convictions in the open lists, to win or lose.

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    Re: TV: Did you make Barry's List?

    I will say this about Wild Wild Country. The makers of the film did a pretty average job given what is some interesting material with which to work. They just never asked the follow up questions.

    The financial side to the cult is fascinating, and completely unresolved by the movie. Where did the money come from, and in what amounts? Obviously huge sums were spent on things like planes and cars, but there were also hints that the finances of the place were collapsing.

    You have someone like Sheela, who spent her entire life since childhood following this guy around, then spent a few years in prison, and suddenly she has the coin to move to Switzerland and buy two nursing homes, according to wiki?
    That community is already in the process of dissolution where each man begins to eye his neighbor as a possible enemy, where non-conformity with the accepted creed, political as well as religious, is a mark of disaffection; where denunciation, without specification or backing, takes the place of evidence; where orthodoxy chokes freedom of dissent; where faith in the eventual supremacy of reason has become so timid that we dare not enter our convictions in the open lists, to win or lose.

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