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Open Wheel Racing 2018- with less winglets.

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  • #31
    Re: Open Wheel Racing 2018- with less winglets.

    Originally posted by Nick Papagiorgio View Post
    0.20. Down from 0.27 and 0.29 in 2017 and 2016 respectively. *shrugs*
    I think the indy product is improved to the point that it's worth watching again, which I'm very glad to see. And Ferrari wins two straight. Who would have thought that.
    MTU: Three time NCAA champions.

    It never get's easier, you just go faster. -Greg Lemond

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    • #32
      Re: Open Wheel Racing 2018- with less winglets.

      Originally posted by manurespreader View Post
      I think the indy product is improved to the point that it's worth watching again, which I'm very glad to see. And Ferrari wins two straight. Who would have thought that.
      And ESPN finally gets their act together, showing F1 races commercial free. Now that I had never thought was going to happen!

      P.S. Do we start a pool on which race Ferrari begins their choke job...?
      Russell Jaslow
      [Former] SUNYAC Correspondent
      U.S. College Hockey Online

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      • #33
        Originally posted by Russell Jaslow View Post
        And ESPN finally gets their act together, showing F1 races commercial free. Now that I had never thought was going to happen!

        P.S. Do we start a pool on which race Ferrari begins their choke job...?
        Canada
        CCT '77 & '78
        4 kids
        5 grandsons (BCA 7/09, CJA 5/14, JDL 8/14, JFL 6/16, PJL 7/18)
        1 granddaughter (EML 4/18)

        ”Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both.”
        - Benjamin Franklin

        Banned from the St. Lawrence University Facebook page - March 2016 (But I got better).

        I want to live forever. So far, so good.

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        • #34
          Re: Open Wheel Racing 2018- with less winglets.

          Originally posted by joecct View Post
          Canada
          I'm going to give them to at least the three in a row sequence right after Canada, when the "wonderful" Italian management structure causes the team to implode under the scheduling stress...
          Russell Jaslow
          [Former] SUNYAC Correspondent
          U.S. College Hockey Online

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          • #35
            Re: Open Wheel Racing 2018- with less winglets.

            Originally posted by Russell Jaslow View Post
            And ESPN finally gets their act together, showing F1 races commercial free. Now that I had never thought was going to happen!

            P.S. Do we start a pool on which race Ferrari begins their choke job...?
            There were indications of that today- Kimi should have pitted in the SC (Just like Lewis should have). It's interesting to see that only Red Bull were ready for that happening at the last moment. And Ricciardo really too advantage of that.

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            • #36
              Re: Open Wheel Racing 2018- with less winglets.

              Originally posted by alfablue View Post
              There were indications of that today- Kimi should have pitted in the SC (Just like Lewis should have). It's interesting to see that only Red Bull were ready for that happening at the last moment. And Ricciardo really too advantage of that.
              Things happened so fast at that point (heck, I think the two leaders were already past the pit entry point, so the others were pretty darn close to it), that I don't blame the decision makers for not reacting quickly. Red Bull knew all along they had to be very aggressive to try and pull the upset, so as soon as the SC car came out, they immediately knew they were going to pit and could call their drivers in right away. They never had to think about it.
              Russell Jaslow
              [Former] SUNYAC Correspondent
              U.S. College Hockey Online

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              • #37
                Re: Open Wheel Racing 2018- with less winglets.

                Originally posted by Russell Jaslow View Post
                Things happened so fast at that point (heck, I think the two leaders were already past the pit entry point, so the others were pretty darn close to it), that I don't blame the decision makers for not reacting quickly. Red Bull knew all along they had to be very aggressive to try and pull the upset, so as soon as the SC car came out, they immediately knew they were going to pit and could call their drivers in right away. They never had to think about it.
                I do, a lot. If Mercedes had a weak point in their dominance, it's been SC strategy. They should always have something game planned around it, ready to go. It's not as if these events never happen- and it's also easy to be ready- have a stack of tires in warmers ready to go all the time. I don't see it at all that Red Bull took a chance- they grabbed the opportunity to get a massive increase in pace that Mercedes and Ferrari decided against for Kimi and Lewis. Both of which were behind Verstappen, and could have easily been ready to go.

                Wolf has excused this as 20-20 hindsight, and I just don't buy that. The situation was just not being ready for it.

                There were plenty of laps left to make those tires last, the pace was clearly enough (based on data, not post race analysis) that Kimi and Lewis would have had the pace to easily get Valteri and Seb. Even if the SC call came out 10 seconds earlier, the same info applies- all cars should have pitted- they had plenty of space to the latter half and they would have had pace on a track easy to pass on.

                Red Bull didn't take a chance, they knew exactly the cost-gain equation. And won.

                It's not that hard to have a running game plan in a program where you can always make an easy call based on available data. IMHO, this was a no brainer.

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                • #38
                  Re: Open Wheel Racing 2018- with less winglets.

                  Originally posted by alfablue View Post
                  I do, a lot. If Mercedes had a weak point in their dominance, it's been SC strategy. They should always have something game planned around it, ready to go. It's not as if these events never happen- and it's also easy to be ready- have a stack of tires in warmers ready to go all the time. I don't see it at all that Red Bull took a chance- they grabbed the opportunity to get a massive increase in pace that Mercedes and Ferrari decided against for Kimi and Lewis. Both of which were behind Verstappen, and could have easily been ready to go.

                  Wolf has excused this as 20-20 hindsight, and I just don't buy that. The situation was just not being ready for it.

                  There were plenty of laps left to make those tires last, the pace was clearly enough (based on data, not post race analysis) that Kimi and Lewis would have had the pace to easily get Valteri and Seb. Even if the SC call came out 10 seconds earlier, the same info applies- all cars should have pitted- they had plenty of space to the latter half and they would have had pace on a track easy to pass on.

                  Red Bull didn't take a chance, they knew exactly the cost-gain equation. And won.

                  It's not that hard to have a running game plan in a program where you can always make an easy call based on available data. IMHO, this was a no brainer.
                  This article explains a lot:

                  http://www.espn.co.uk/f1/story/_/id/...n-won-shanghai

                  I'm not totally disagreeing with you. And at the very least, teams should have split alternate strategies for their two drivers (just as they usually do under normal circumstances) when changes in the race occur. But, this particular situation wasn't as easy to decipher. And the article implies that they were not expecting the Red Bulls to gain as much as they did with new tires, so they went with the "track position" is king strategy. Plus, Kimi had just been in, so new(er) tires probably would not have made much of a difference for him versus losing track position.

                  Hamilton on the other hand was going nowhere from the start, so he certainly should have tried it just because nothing else was working. But maybe the team is still gun shy after the Monaco debacle...
                  Last edited by Russell Jaslow; 04-16-2018, 11:32 AM.
                  Russell Jaslow
                  [Former] SUNYAC Correspondent
                  U.S. College Hockey Online

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                  • #39
                    Re: Open Wheel Racing 2018- with less winglets.

                    The thing about "track position" is that it's not quite as import on that track as others. It's one of the few places where an advantage can be used.

                    Unless, the Mercedes and Ferrari are just that bad following other cars. And they knew that, too- it's not as if passing was that hard during the race, and had either Ferrari or Mercedes had given the two drivers a chance, seems like they would have not had that much trouble dispensing with Vettel and Bottas.

                    What's the most frustrating thing- neither Ferrari nor Mercedes seemed to have learned from past SC/VSC/ pitting mistakes. So we can expect these issues to continue, and the "hindsight is 20-20" excuses to continue, when, in fact, good planning could take advantage of the situation.

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                    • #40
                      Re: Open Wheel Racing 2018- with less winglets.

                      I’m happy for Ricciardo, that was a good win for him and good for F1 really. To show another team just may be catching up with Mercedes and Ferrari.

                      I like this Vesrstappen kid, he’s got guts and a go for it attitude.


                      Long Beach had 185,000 spectators and evidently NBC is wasting no time announcing INDYCAR is coming in 2019. They announced it during an nhl game last week. Good stuff!

                      Rossi has turned into the real deal with Newgarden as well. At this point both of these guys are destroying Andretti and Rahal. I hope we see a rivalry develop between Rossi and JoNew.
                      Everything in its right place, Wisconsin Hockey National Champs!


                      "but you're not as confused as him are you. it's not your job to be as confused as Nigel". Tap pt 1.

                      "I think it's ****ing stock. What--? Which part of that is unclear to you? I think it sounds stock to my ears. I mean, do you want me to write it down?" Tap Pt. 2

                      Who???! So What!!!! Big Deal!!!!

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                      • #41
                        Re: Open Wheel Racing 2018- with less winglets.

                        Originally posted by solovsfett View Post
                        Rossi has turned into the real deal with Newgarden as well. At this point both of these guys are destroying Andretti and Rahal. I hope we see a rivalry develop between Rossi and JoNew.
                        I've been saying it for a while, these two are going to be competing for the championship for the next 10+ years. Rossi is absolutely the real deal. Actually, my kid has been saying this from Day 1 when he came over to Indycar... I was a doubter. Andretti Autosport locking him up in the offseason was big, I was hoping Ganassi would grab him for the #10 car and we'd have a continued Chip vs Roger rivalry for a long time but this puts Andretti very much in the mix with them for a long time and somewhat downgrades CGR. Rossi plus all of AA being absolutely beastly in the Indy 500 really makes things interesting.

                        Hondas have been looking strong early on in the season.

                        I really can't stand this closed pits yellow thing although I'm still trying to get a good handle on the ins and outs of it. Absolutely dicked Bourdais and Dixon who should have been top 4. The totality of the post-race comments from Seabass just made my week calling everyone an idiot. Dude cracks me up.

                        How about Zach Veach finishing 4th. Dude looked like he won the race he was so happy. Nice kid that has worked hard.
                        Last edited by Nick Papagiorgio; 04-18-2018, 02:58 PM.
                        Originally posted by Greg Ambrose on 3/7/2010
                        The fact that you BC fans revel in the superiority of your team in an admittedly weak league leads me to believe you will be more sorely disappointed when the end comes than we will.

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Nick Papagiorgio View Post
                          I've been saying it for a while, these two are going to be competing for the championship for the next 10+ years. Rossi is absolutely the real deal. Actually, my kid has been saying this from Day 1 when he came over to Indycar... I was a doubter. Andretti Autosport locking him up in the offseason was big, I was hoping Ganassi would grab him for the #10 car and we'd have a continued Chip vs Roger rivalry for a long time but this puts Andretti very much in the mix with them for a long time and somewhat downgrades CGR. Rossi plus all of AA being absolutely beastly in the Indy 500 really makes things interesting.

                          Hondas have been looking strong early on in the season.

                          I really can't stand this closed pits yellow thing although I'm still trying to get a good handle on the ins and outs of it. Absolutely dicked Bourdais and Dixon who should have been top 4. The totality of the post-race comments from Seabass just made my week calling everyone an idiot. Dude cracks me up.

                          How about Zach Veach finishing 4th. Dude looked like he won the race he was so happy. Nice kid that has worked hard.
                          Yes! I think Indy needs a rivalry as much if not even more than the nbc contract. Robin Miller’s recent mailbag contained an interesting thought... a Rossi vs Newgarden rivalry would be great, but perhaps better if they’re on the same team? Pure speculation but I would suspect the Captain has his eyes on Rossi now.

                          I don’t know much about Veach, I was honestly hoping Brabham would move up for that spot but effing INDYCAR sponsorship money is so thin.
                          Everything in its right place, Wisconsin Hockey National Champs!


                          "but you're not as confused as him are you. it's not your job to be as confused as Nigel". Tap pt 1.

                          "I think it's ****ing stock. What--? Which part of that is unclear to you? I think it sounds stock to my ears. I mean, do you want me to write it down?" Tap Pt. 2

                          Who???! So What!!!! Big Deal!!!!

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Re: Open Wheel Racing 2018- with less winglets.

                            Pretty interesting commentary on the state of the F1 engine formula. I'd like to see it be cheaper to make .
                            https://www.bbc.com/sport/formula1/43801377
                            MTU: Three time NCAA champions.

                            It never get's easier, you just go faster. -Greg Lemond

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                            • #44
                              Re: Open Wheel Racing 2018- with less winglets.

                              Originally posted by manurespreader View Post
                              Pretty interesting commentary on the state of the F1 engine formula. I'd like to see it be cheaper to make .
                              https://www.bbc.com/sport/formula1/43801377
                              I laugh every time Fiat comes up with the idea that Ferrari will go someplace else. Where, exactly? It's not as if they've not caved every single time a new engine formula comes up. Seems like they are worried about their Ferrari Bonus.

                              It will be interesting if the 4 really want to keep it as complicated as they do... No new engines that way.

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                              • #45
                                Re: Open Wheel Racing 2018- with less winglets.

                                Originally posted by alfablue View Post
                                I laugh every time Fiat comes up with the idea that Ferrari will go someplace else. Where, exactly? It's not as if they've not caved every single time a new engine formula comes up. Seems like they are worried about their Ferrari Bonus.
                                It's always about the money!
                                Russell Jaslow
                                [Former] SUNYAC Correspondent
                                U.S. College Hockey Online

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