Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

UNH 2018 Offseason- Out with the old , in with the semi new?

Collapse
This topic is closed.
X
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Re: UNH 2018 Offseason- Out with the old , in with the semi new?

    Originally posted by HockeyRef View Post
    With all due respect I hardly think there's nothing going on at 128 Main..I do realize that results speak for themselves and all but highly doubt it's as simple as all that. We fans only wish we had a clue as to what is really going on....
    Agree. I would just repeat that while other programs with a new coach (Mich State/Wisc/U.Mass/etc) flood the team with too many players the first year, and ethical debate about cutting guys, UNH is in the unique situation of looking for players to fill out the roster for his first year. We don't know what's going on behind the scenes, just that the scenes we see are atypical.

    I would agree that in the event the new assistant is indeed who we think it is, his obligations are elsewhere at the moment. Don't forget we have two other coaches in place...
    Again, we agree that a recruiting assistant is critical, and we will have to wait for the Jets to be eliminated. I'd note, again, that it seems unusual for a team with a new Head Coach being in a position of waiting on the third coach before they can fill immediate recruiting needs.

    And to Dan's point, I guess that filling out this class is less urgent, because presumably Souza and Stewart have that planned. What is more important is getting back on the right side of recruiting, not playing catch up after the fact, but getting commitments from the 02s and 03s who will form the foundation for the future, with space to fill around the edges. Having not secured that foundation in 2015 to 2018 (or of having misjudged the core, a la Miller and Green on D) has put them in this current position. We need a guy who can get that foundation.
    The Souza record:
    15-16 10th place
    16-17 10th place
    17-18 11th place
    18-19 8th place
    19-20 9th place
    20-21 10th place
    21-22 9th place
    22-23 10th place

    Comment


    • Re: UNH 2018 Offseason- Out with the old , in with the semi new?

      Maybe Mark White has done some scouting in Finland for the Jets? And, maybe he can recruit some Finns to UNH?
      Last edited by Snively65; 04-28-2018, 01:36 PM.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Snively65 View Post
        Maybe Mark White has done some recruiting in Finland for the Jets? And, maybe he can recruit some Finns to UNH?
        From his position he’s in charge of college free agents, so he watches the college game. Whether that incidentally involves seeing future college players in the USHL?? The best we can hope for it that he knows the player agents/advisors and can sell them in steering their players to UNH. The jets also have euro scouts and maybe they’ll put in a good word.
        The Souza record:
        15-16 10th place
        16-17 10th place
        17-18 11th place
        18-19 8th place
        19-20 9th place
        20-21 10th place
        21-22 9th place
        22-23 10th place

        Comment


        • Originally posted by NCAA watcher View Post
          From his position he’s in charge of college free agents, so he watches the college game. Whether that incidentally involves seeing future college players in the USHL?? The best we can hope for it that he knows the player agents/advisors and can sell them in steering their players to UNH. The jets also have euro scouts and maybe they’ll put in a good word.
          Jets have a bunch of Euro players, including Finn Forward Patrik Laine. :-)

          Comment


          • Re: UNH 2018 Offseason- Out with the old , in with the semi new?

            https://www.ushl.com/view#/player/70...nteri-virtanen
            The Souza record:
            15-16 10th place
            16-17 10th place
            17-18 11th place
            18-19 8th place
            19-20 9th place
            20-21 10th place
            21-22 9th place
            22-23 10th place

            Comment


            • Originally posted by NCAA watcher View Post
              ...The best we can hope for it that he knows the player agents/advisors and can sell them in steering their players to UNH...
              This doesn’t get emphasized enough. The family “advisors”, who often are affiliated with professional player management agencies, have a lot of power in the college recruiting world. Sure, some kids commit to a school because they always wanted to play there. But just as often (and probably more often than not), the family advisor plays a major role in guiding a kid and his family to one program or another.
              The UNH Men's Hockey Blog

              Comment


              • Yes! Bring him to Durham!!

                Comment


                • Re: UNH 2018 Offseason- Out with the old , in with the semi new?

                  Originally posted by Snively65 View Post
                  Yes! Bring him to Durham!!

                  Terrific ... looks like the Finnish Shane Eiserman. At least he'd project to be a 4 year player ...
                  Sworn Enemy of the Perpetually Offended
                  Montreal Expos Forever ...

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Chuck Murray View Post
                    Terrific ... looks like the Finnish Shane Eiserman. At least he'd project to be a 4 year player ...
                    I would still like to see some more two-and-done and three-and-done recruits added to the mix, like Gildon and Maass this past year. And, no more sitting future NHL'ers like Warren Foegeli in the stands or wallowing on the fourth line.
                    Last edited by Snively65; 04-30-2018, 09:39 AM.

                    Comment


                    • Re: UNH 2018 Offseason- Out with the old , in with the semi new?

                      Originally posted by Snively65 View Post
                      And, no more sitting future NHL'ers like Warren Foegeli in the stands or wallowing on the fourth line.
                      But that practice has worked so well....
                      "Now Progress Takes Away What Forever Took To Find" Dave Matthews Band, The Dreaming Tree

                      Comment


                      • Re: UNH 2018 Offseason- Out with the old , in with the semi new?

                        Originally posted by NCAA watcher View Post
                        we will have to wait for the Jets to be eliminated.
                        Looks like they may not...you might be waiting until June.

                        Comment


                        • Re: UNH 2018 Offseason- Out with the old , in with the semi new?

                          Originally posted by chickod View Post
                          Looks like they may not...you might be waiting until June.
                          I will never understand this idea that White is somehow 'obligated' to the Jets and cannot tear himself away to take the job at UNH. I suppose it comes from the need to rationalize the idea that UNH is making the right decisions and taking the steps needed to get back to the top of HE - but this scenario, to me, paints a picture that once again they don't understand the depth to which the program has sunk (and the urgent need to turn it around quickly). White is the COLLEGE FREE AGENT SCOUT. College hockey is over for the year - Winnipeg has pro scouts. They also have an army of additional scouts who can help the pro scouts during the playoffs. We all assume he's the guy - and it sure seems clear he is - which means he is staying in Winnipeg because he would rather enjoy the potential cup run than get to work in Durham. And the UNH head coach thinks its cooler for him to enjoy the potential cup run than to get to work in Durham - where A LOT of work is needed. The correct answer, when White indicated he couldn't have come immediately, would have been - thank you, I guess the timing just isn't right. Good luck...

                          When Walter McCarty took the Evansville job he left immediately. He didn't hang around to finish the season with the Celtics and he was an actual assistant coach. Coaching and recruiting is a job where you're hired and you have to get to work immediately or you are behind (and one where there are no hard feelings from your existing employer when you do). At Miami, they posted after UNH and have already made TWO hires (and flipped a handful of recruits). In the time period of the search they hired an interim assistant coach to do the job - because its critical and a lot of work. It is a lot of work for three coaches and full-time 'volunteers'. Its way too much work for two coaches to do alone - especially during the most critical recruiting periods of the year (even more so when it lines up with recruiting being the most glaring need for the program). This is simply, not good decision making, there is no way around it...

                          None of this even addresses the hire - which would be a comfortable and friendly hire and not one that moves the needles UNH needs to move. They would end up with a staff full of coaches who have NEVER had real recruiting success at the college level - convincing high-level players, parents OR recruiting advisors to send their kids to their schools. We should all hope this argument is for not and they have decided to pursue other candidates - because whether White arrives in Durham in a week or a month, he just isn't the high-end recruiting sidekick we've all been clamoring for since Souza's arrival. Quite honestly, he's not even the best choice on the Winnipeg Jets staff...

                          And even if one wants to put all his eggs in the advisors make decisions blindly for the prospects myth - they certainly don't do so just because they know a guy. They offer advice based on how a program has proven to develop players for the next level and because they win and offer exposure. UNH (and especially the new staff) still has a lot of work to do in those areas - dirty work - before advisors begin to just throw prospects in their direction...

                          ----

                          JB's approach nails it - 100%. The unfortunate reality is this: before you can sell those types of visions you actually have to believe it yourself...
                          Last edited by Dan; 05-01-2018, 10:00 AM.
                          Live Free or Die!!
                          Miami University '03

                          Comment


                          • Re: UNH 2018 Offseason- Out with the old , in with the semi new?

                            Originally posted by Dan View Post
                            I will never understand this idea that White is somehow 'obligated' to the Jets and cannot tear himself away to take the job at UNH. I suppose it comes from the need to rationalize the idea that UNH is making the right decisions and taking the steps needed to get back to the top of HE - but this scenario, to me, paints a picture that once again they don't understand the depth to which the program has sunk (and the urgent need to turn it around quickly). White is the COLLEGE FREE AGENT SCOUT. College hockey is over for the year - Winnipeg has pro scouts. They also have an army of additional scouts who can help the pro scouts during the playoffs. We all assume he's the guy - and it sure seems clear he is - which means he is staying in Winnipeg because he would rather enjoy the potential cup run than get to work in Durham. And the UNH head coach thinks its cooler for him to enjoy the potential cup run than to get to work in Durham - where A LOT of work is needed. The correct answer, when White indicated he couldn't have come immediately, would have been - thank you, I guess the timing just isn't right. Good luck...
                            I assume they are banking on his connections with the team, its scouts, and advisors to be the best part of his recruiting, so maintaining that is more important. Its an interesting perspective, that focuses not on selling to the kids, but to their network. If so, the extra month isn't going to make or break them. And we don't know that he isn't already working for UNH within that framework, trying to get his colleagues (Euro scouts for the Jets) push their drafts and potential drafts to UNH.

                            Coaching and recruiting is a job where you're hired and you have to get to work immediately or you are behind (and one where there are no hard feelings from your existing employer when you do). At Miami, they posted after UNH and have already made TWO hires. In the time period of the search they hired an interim assistant coach to do the job - because its critical and a lot of work.
                            The more interesting part of this was that two recruits, including the USHL rookie of the year, followed him to Miami. Just like when Borek left his recruits followed him or left UNH, but UNH didn't pick up anything in its hire.

                            None of this even addresses the hire - which would be a comfortable and friendly hire and not one that moves the needles UNH needs to move. They would end up with a staff full of coaches who have NEVER had real recruiting success at the college level - convincing high-level players, parents OR recruiting advisors to send their kids to their schools. We should all hope this argument is for not and they have decided to pursue other candidates - because whether White arrives in Durham in a week or a month, he just isn't the high-end recruiting sidekick we've all been clamoring for since Souza's arrival...
                            It's Mike's job, and let him run it the way he wants. (see point 1, above) That way we don't have to try and dissect how much the results reflect his work or the restraints under which he labored (like we have the past three years). At this point he has chosen that path, so our job is solely to sit back and watch if it works. Who knows, maybe it will work.
                            The Souza record:
                            15-16 10th place
                            16-17 10th place
                            17-18 11th place
                            18-19 8th place
                            19-20 9th place
                            20-21 10th place
                            21-22 9th place
                            22-23 10th place

                            Comment


                            • Re: UNH 2018 Offseason- Out with the old , in with the semi new?

                              Originally posted by NCAA watcher View Post
                              I assume they are banking on his connections with the team, its scouts, and advisors to be the best part of his recruiting, so maintaining that is more important. Its an interesting perspective, that focuses not on selling to the kids, but to their network. If so, the extra month isn't going to make or break them. And we don't know that he isn't already working for UNH within that framework, trying to get his colleagues (Euro scouts for the Jets) push their drafts and potential drafts to UNH.
                              And you think he would lose those connections or they would begrudge him for leaving to begin his new job ASAP - despite the fact that his job with the Jets is already done for the year? That is awfully hard for me to believe...
                              Live Free or Die!!
                              Miami University '03

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Dan View Post
                                I will never understand this idea that White is somehow 'obligated' to the Jets and cannot tear himself away to take the job at UNH. I suppose it comes from the need to rationalize the idea that UNH is making the right decisions and taking the steps needed to get back to the top of HE - but this scenario, to me, paints a picture that once again they don't understand the depth to which the program has sunk (and the urgent need to turn it around quickly). White is the COLLEGE FREE AGENT SCOUT. College hockey is over for the year - Winnipeg has pro scouts. They also have an army of additional scouts who can help the pro scouts during the playoffs. We all assume he's the guy - and it sure seems clear he is - which means he is staying in Winnipeg because he would rather enjoy the potential cup run than get to work in Durham. And the UNH head coach thinks its cooler for him to enjoy the potential cup run than to get to work in Durham - where A LOT of work is needed. The correct answer, when White indicated he couldn't have come immediately, would have been - thank you, I guess the timing just isn't right. Good luck...

                                When Walter McCarty took the Evansville job he left immediately. He didn't hang around to finish the season with the Celtics and he was an actual assistant coach. Coaching and recruiting is a job where you're hired and you have to get to work immediately or you are behind (and one where there are no hard feelings from your existing employer when you do). At Miami, they posted after UNH and have already made TWO hires (and flipped a handful of recruits). In the time period of the search they hired an interim assistant coach to do the job - because its critical and a lot of work. It is a lot of work for three coaches and full-time 'volunteers'. Its way too much work for two coaches to do alone - especially during the most critical recruiting periods of the year (even more so when it lines up with recruiting being the most glaring need for the program). This is simply, not good decision making, there is no way around it...

                                None of this even addresses the hire - which would be a comfortable and friendly hire and not one that moves the needles UNH needs to move. They would end up with a staff full of coaches who have NEVER had real recruiting success at the college level - convincing high-level players, parents OR recruiting advisors to send their kids to their schools. We should all hope this argument is for not and they have decided to pursue other candidates - because whether White arrives in Durham in a week or a month, he just isn't the high-end recruiting sidekick we've all been clamoring for since Souza's arrival. Quite honestly, he's not even the best choice on the Winnipeg Jets staff...

                                And even if one wants to put all his eggs in the advisors make decisions blindly for the prospects myth - they certainly don't do so just because they know a guy. They offer advice based on how a program has proven to develop players for the next level and because they win and offer exposure. UNH (and especially the new staff) still has a lot of work to do in those areas - dirty work - before advisors begin to just throw prospects in their direction...

                                ----

                                JB's approach nails it - 100%. The unfortunate reality is this: before you can sell those types of visions you actually have to believe it yourself...
                                So, if Miami's new staff has already flipped some recruits, what does that mean? Probably not the same thing as deferrals, which has not worked well for UNH? Would UNH consider dropping any players from the current roster if last-minute better recruits could be identified? Certainly not the UNH way, but would doing that move the needle? I am still holding out hope that a couple of Euro players are on the way to UNH for this fall.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X