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UNH Wildcats 2017/2018 - Umile's Last Stand - The Grand Finale
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UNH Hockey: You can check out any time you like but you can never leave!
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Re: UNH Wildcats 2017/2018 - Umile's Last Stand - The Grand Finale
Originally posted by Dan View Posthere's how I'd break down the incoming freshmen (more in terms of career production than style, though both are considered when applicable)...
Crookshank - Blackburn/Downing
Esposito - MacAdams
Cippolone - K. Smith/ Correale
Green - Chanter/Krates
Verrier - Dawson/Marks-lite
Taylor - Foster
Not exactly a game changing group...
The teams from the early Umile years got MUCH better immediate recruiting returns and still took years to get back to where they wanted to be. I'd be wary about putting too much stock in last seasons FR either - MacAdams is who he is. Charlie Kelleher can be better, certainly, but will never be Tyler. Gildon has one more year on campus and Maass is a candidate to leave with Wyse the following year - the current pipeline of D is not at their level...
Esposito will not match MacAdams. MacAdams has some decent puck skills and grit, while not consistent or top end, but could get to the second line as a nice complementary player. Esposito just is a *****stirrer, who will have goals off is skates, etc. while drawing and taking penalties. Fourth line, Third line tops.
Cipollone will not be Correale level. I'd say Chris Miller/Borisenok sort.
Green - I don't get him. Seems the typical "size" project, where scouts talk about his upside, separate from his puck skills. He was supposed to have offensive skills, but the only one I saw was a shot, and his skating was sub par, and I didn't see any real puck handling or distribution. Then I heard decent reports on his defense during last year's playoffs. The offensive has not deveoped at all, and I'm skeptical that his skating can allow him to be a top defender (Chanter?), so it's a low projection.
Verrier is actually a kid who had low projections, but put together his skating and offensive skills in prep, and now at GB. He'll never be a top pair kid, but his offense seems to be enough to get him onto the second pair.
Now is the time to hit the trail hard and aggressively and say again and again - you, elite prospect, take our full scholarship and be the guy immediately. That is the only way out of this mess...Last edited by NCAA watcher; 02-25-2018, 02:26 PM.The Souza record:
15-16 10th place
16-17 10th place
17-18 11th place
18-19 8th place
19-20 9th place
20-21 10th place
21-22 9th place
22-23 10th place
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Re: UNH Wildcats 2017/2018 - Umile's Last Stand - The Grand Finale
Originally posted by e.cat View PostYou've always been one shy of a shot glass half empty Chuck You have no clue how UNH is going to do next year or the year after or the year after that. None of us do! There are too many variables involved. Yeah you're entitled to your opinion, in fact, I enjoy your posts. You're more like a contrary indicator though. Year over year comparisons will be easier to improve upon IMHO. I'd be very surprised if results don't improve moving forward. Then again, I have no better insight than you do!Originally posted by e.cat View PostOkay Dan. Let me get this straight. If the variable X=Chippah(preferably BLUE) then Souza and UNH will jump start the rebuild immediately. Do I have that right? If so I'm down with that!
Just for the record, no one wants me to be wrong on this more than I do. Is it possible Souza could turn it around quickly, in ways that 'watcher, Dan and others have suggested? Sure, no doubt, possible. But ... probable? I look at the long-term downwards trajectory of the UNH Men's Hockey program - something I sounded the alarm on many years ago, when many on here were still fat and happy with annual trips to the D-1 tourney, albeit sliding gradually away from legitimate FF contenders - and perhaps more importantly, I look at the more precipitous drop the program has experienced over the last three years of "Souza in training". Combine that with the rather modest projections I see on here about the incoming class - which consists of Crookshank, Taylor and (arguably) a healthy Grasso - and I don't see the kind of dynamic talent either on hand or coming on board in enough quantity to turn this thing around. Yet.
Since I know we've had past similar discussions about UNH Football, and Coach McDonnell's transition period after the Coach Bowes era, let's draw parallels there. Coach Bowes was in charge for roughly the same amount of years as Coach Umile has been, and not unlike Umile's flight path, Bowes had a few down years at the start, and his last 3-4 years in charge were trending down as well (and it took McDonnell another 5 years to get it turned back around after that). When McDonnell (and key assistant Chip Kelly) adopted the spread offense we now see everywhere, it transformed the program back into consistent national contention. But it still took McDonnell/Kelly about 5 years to get upwards traction. Before that, it didn't look like they would bring the program back to its Bowes era level.
Unless Souza brings in someone (or something) dynamic (and soon) to make immediate positive impacts on the UNH Hockey program, it's hard for me to think we've even seen the program hitting bottom yet. The roster for next season is mostly cast in stone, although there are openings/money available, it will require Souza's staff to bring in multiple players at (or probably above) the levels of the Crookshanks and Maasses of the world to see an immediate impact. He hasn't done that yet ... and even when he has (Commesso), or when he hasn't been able to convince some of the Borek holdovers, and those have slipped through his fingers ... doesn't that make you ask questions on just how effective Souza or his current team are at selling his message effectively?
As I said at the outset ... I want to be wrong about this. I wanted to be wrong about the gradual slide into oblivion over the last decade (plus?) too, but that turned out with where we see the program today, which is bottom of the league, and not by accident. And if it turns out that I'm wrong - like I was after 5 years into McDonnell's regime - I will only be too happy to admit I'm wrong. Certainly the current AD has a history of giving his coaches a lot of rope, and the scary thing (to me anyway) is that UNH Hockey could find itself in its current state of decay for another decade. Not a comforting thought, to say the least.
The next few steps will tell us a lot. How does Souza fill out his coaching staff for next year? Does he and his team have some quality recruits stashed until the coaching change officially takes place? And who will lead the team on-ice next season, and in seasons to follow?
There has been a talent shortage in recent years, no doubt. Watching the full replay of last night's debacle (which could have been 10-0 had Madigan not called off the dogs after the bizarre/pitiful Robinson "effort" on the recalled offsides goal) hints at the huge gap between UNH's talent at the top of this league. It's that stark, and shocking too. But I would say there may have been an even bigger leadership vacuum, both on and off the ice. And I have no idea if Souza or his staff even recognize this issue exists yet.
All of this, combined at once, and I think things get worse before they get better. JMHO.Sworn Enemy of the Perpetually Offended
Montreal Expos Forever ...
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Originally posted by Dan View PostFormer UNH teammates Kacey Bellamy (USA) and Jen Wakefield (CAN) face-off for gold tonight at 11:10 ET. Wakefield played two years at UNH before transferring to BU - if you needed another reason to root for the US.
Bobby Butler and the men are done due to poor roster construction...
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Originally posted by Chuck Murray View PostSo ... I guess it's safe to say you're a "glass half full" optimistic sort then, eh e.cat? "Don't bother me with that reality bullcrap, just tell me how the good stuff might play out, and I'm down with that!"
Just for the record, no one wants me to be wrong on this more than I do. Is it possible Souza could turn it around quickly, in ways that 'watcher, Dan and others have suggested? Sure, no doubt, possible. But ... probable? I look at the long-term downwards trajectory of the UNH Men's Hockey program - something I sounded the alarm on many years ago, when many on here were still fat and happy with annual trips to the D-1 tourney, albeit sliding gradually away from legitimate FF contenders - and perhaps more importantly, I look at the more precipitous drop the program has experienced over the last three years of "Souza in training". Combine that with the rather modest projections I see on here about the incoming class - which consists of Crookshank, Taylor and (arguably) a healthy Grasso - and I don't see the kind of dynamic talent either on hand or coming on board in enough quantity to turn this thing around. Yet.
Since I know we've had past similar discussions about UNH Football, and Coach McDonnell's transition period after the Coach Bowes era, let's draw parallels there. Coach Bowes was in charge for roughly the same amount of years as Coach Umile has been, and not unlike Umile's flight path, Bowes had a few down years at the start, and his last 3-4 years in charge were trending down as well (and it took McDonnell another 5 years to get it turned back around after that). When McDonnell (and key assistant Chip Kelly) adopted the spread offense we now see everywhere, it transformed the program back into consistent national contention. But it still took McDonnell/Kelly about 5 years to get upwards traction. Before that, it didn't look like they would bring the program back to its Bowes era level.
Unless Souza brings in someone (or something) dynamic (and soon) to make immediate positive impacts on the UNH Hockey program, it's hard for me to think we've even seen the program hitting bottom yet. The roster for next season is mostly cast in stone, although there are openings/money available, it will require Souza's staff to bring in multiple players at (or probably above) the levels of the Crookshanks and Maasses of the world to see an immediate impact. He hasn't done that yet ... and even when he has (Commesso), or when he hasn't been able to convince some of the Borek holdovers, and those have slipped through his fingers ... doesn't that make you ask questions on just how effective Souza or his current team are at selling his message effectively?
As I said at the outset ... I want to be wrong about this. I wanted to be wrong about the gradual slide into oblivion over the last decade (plus?) too, but that turned out with where we see the program today, which is bottom of the league, and not by accident. And if it turns out that I'm wrong - like I was after 5 years into McDonnell's regime - I will only be too happy to admit I'm wrong. Certainly the current AD has a history of giving his coaches a lot of rope, and the scary thing (to me anyway) is that UNH Hockey could find itself in its current state of decay for another decade. Not a comforting thought, to say the least.
The next few steps will tell us a lot. How does Souza fill out his coaching staff for next year? Does he and his team have some quality recruits stashed until the coaching change officially takes place? And who will lead the team on-ice next season, and in seasons to follow?
There has been a talent shortage in recent years, no doubt. Watching the full replay of last night's debacle (which could have been 10-0 had Madigan not called off the dogs after the bizarre/pitiful Robinson "effort" on the recalled offsides goal) hints at the huge gap between UNH's talent at the top of this league. It's that stark, and shocking too. But I would say there may have been an even bigger leadership vacuum, both on and off the ice. And I have no idea if Souza or his staff even recognize this issue exists yet.
All of this, combined at once, and I think things get worse before they get better. JMHO.UNH Hockey: You can check out any time you like but you can never leave!
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Originally posted by Felger View PostTechnically you may have been wrong Greg. But I think there is a big difference between finishing last in a seven team league in the mid-80's and finishing 11th in a league that now includes Vermont, Massachusetts Merrimack and UConn. Go back and look at some of the players that were in HockeyEast back then. Then factor in the WCHA element. (I mean Brett Hull played in Snively for chrisakes.) Not to mention that this has to be the weakest HE has been in years. Even though that 1988 team finished last (and only won 7 games) it had two players on the all rookie. As you say, things were looking up.
However to steven22's larger point - UNH did finish last THREE years in a row. So moving forward Chuck may very well be correct in that things get worse before they get better.
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Re: UNH Wildcats 2017/2018 - Umile's Last Stand - The Grand Finale
Originally posted by e.cat View PostFor the record, yes I am an optimist! So many issues not enough band width! So you predicted this decline? Of course you did. Even a broken clock is right twice a day. Give me a break! You're killin' me!
Again, I wish I were proven wrong with that, I really do. I want to see winning hockey at UNH again, and the sooner the better. If you want to take shots at me when I'm wrong, I'm good with that (see McDonnell, Sean) and if I'm wrong, I'll apologize gladly. This is not exactly life and death stuff, and we ALL miss the mark at times. But if you want to stick your fingers in your ears and ignore it when I've (sadly) been on target, then I guess I misjudged you as a fair and balanced contributor on here. Your call. I'll live, either way.Sworn Enemy of the Perpetually Offended
Montreal Expos Forever ...
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Originally posted by Chuck Murray View PostThose who've been on here as long as you and me will recall my "Open Letter to Coach Umile" almost 8 years ago, which was a couple of years AFTER I'd initially opined about the developing downturn in the program.
Again, I wish I were proven wrong with that, I really do. I want to see winning hockey at UNH again, and the sooner the better. If you want to take shots at me when I'm wrong, I'm good with that (see McDonnell, Sean) and if I'm wrong, I'll apologize gladly. This is not exactly life and death stuff, and we ALL miss the mark at times. But if you want to stick your fingers in your ears and ignore it when I've (sadly) been on target, then I guess I misjudged you as a fair and balanced contributor on here. Your call. I'll live, either way.UNH Hockey: You can check out any time you like but you can never leave!
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Originally posted by Chuck Murray View PostThose who've been on here as long as you and me will recall my "Open Letter to Coach Umile" almost 8 years ago, which was a couple of years AFTER I'd initially opined about the developing downturn in the program.
Again, I wish I were proven wrong with that, I really do. I want to see winning hockey at UNH again, and the sooner the better. If you want to take shots at me when I'm wrong, I'm good with that (see McDonnell, Sean) and if I'm wrong, I'll apologize gladly. This is not exactly life and death stuff, and we ALL miss the mark at times. But if you want to stick your fingers in your ears and ignore it when I've (sadly) been on target, then I guess I misjudged you as a fair and balanced contributor on here. Your call. I'll live, either way.
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Re: UNH Wildcats 2017/2018 - Umile's Last Stand - The Grand Finale
Originally posted by Greg Ambrose View PostI was told that he didn’t acknowledge the crowd at the end of the game. True?
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Originally posted by JAB View PostWe watched carefully. After the team handshakes Madigan came back to center ice to shake Umile's hand a second time. Then Umile turned and walked to the bench and down the tunnel with hardly a side-ward glance - very sad. Thankfully Boyd (I think) had picked up the UNH sweaters that had been tossed on the ice by some juveniles so the players wouldn't have to skate over them as they circled the ice. On the whole a disappointing scene.
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i once had pleasure of watching a unh practice umile ran with / during bobby butler & co days.. some 3x3, some other stuff, but he used just half ice the whole time. one of the better coll sessions i have seen. kids were beat at end of it. excellent stuff. he made it look so simple, but players were seriously working, getting better no doubt. no standing around.
well, best to him. good guy.GO NU HOCKEY
Always bullish on the future.
We don't always win Hockey East or the Beanpot (#trilogy).. but when we do.. we are the Champions
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Re: UNH Wildcats 2017/2018 - Umile's Last Stand - The Grand Finale
Originally posted by JAB View PostWe watched carefully. After the team handshakes Madigan came back to center ice to shake Umile's hand a second time. Then Umile turned and walked to the bench and down the tunnel with hardly a side-ward glance - very sad. Thankfully Boyd (I think) had picked up the UNH sweaters that had been tossed on the ice by some juveniles so the players wouldn't have to skate over them as they circled the ice. On the whole a disappointing scene.
BTW, I agree with Chuck ("You're absolutely right, Chuck!") Coach Madigan called off the dogs on Saturday night. As much as I wanted to see the 'Cats score, I knew if they did knock a goal or two in that NU would have just stepped on the accelerator and answered them. Umile seemed very gracious to Madigan after the game and I presume/hope Dick was thanking him for not running it up in his last contest at home. As many of you know I haven't been a big fan of the Northeastern coach, but he earned some points in my book. Not that Coach Madigan cares what I think.UNH Hockey: From "Why Not Us' to "Woe is Us"
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Re: UNH Wildcats 2017/2018 - Umile's Last Stand - The Grand Finale
Personally I think Coach did the right thing by leaving the ice the way he did on his own terms. No doubt/perhaps he saw the jersey toss and perhaps he didn't want to get more of the same....no shame there if you ask me. At FOH meetings he has said he'd rather talk after a win so maybe that was his thinking?
While there were only 2 jerseys thrown (and it was Boyd who picked them up) that was enough (and classless act on the part of the two fans who were sitting in the next section from us) I heard it was very upsetting to the team. Despite what we say about their abilities they are doing the best they can and do care about how things went. I wish them the best moving forward.Here we go 'Cats!!
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