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Thread: UNH Wildcats 2017/2018 - Umile's Last Stand - The Grand Finale

  1. #681
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    Quote Originally Posted by Felger View Post
    Technically you may have been wrong Greg. But I think there is a big difference between finishing last in a seven team league in the mid-80's and finishing 11th in a league that now includes Vermont, Massachusetts Merrimack and UConn. Go back and look at some of the players that were in HockeyEast back then. Then factor in the WCHA element. (I mean Brett Hull played in Snively for chrisakes.) Not to mention that this has to be the weakest HE has been in years. Even though that 1988 team finished last (and only won 7 games) it had two players on the all rookie. As you say, things were looking up.

    However to steven22's larger point - UNH did finish last THREE years in a row. So moving forward Chuck may very well be correct in that things get worse before they get better.
    And, we finished the regular season below all but two AHA teams in the PWR, although we still have a chance to catch those two next weekend. This season's rush for the bottom of the PWR is not over!

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    Re: UNH Wildcats 2017/2018 - Umile's Last Stand - The Grand Finale

    Quote Originally Posted by e.cat View Post
    For the record, yes I am an optimist! So many issues not enough band width! So you predicted this decline? Of course you did. Even a broken clock is right twice a day. Give me a break! You're killin' me!
    Those who've been on here as long as you and me will recall my "Open Letter to Coach Umile" almost 8 years ago, which was a couple of years AFTER I'd initially opined about the developing downturn in the program.

    Again, I wish I were proven wrong with that, I really do. I want to see winning hockey at UNH again, and the sooner the better. If you want to take shots at me when I'm wrong, I'm good with that (see McDonnell, Sean) and if I'm wrong, I'll apologize gladly. This is not exactly life and death stuff, and we ALL miss the mark at times. But if you want to stick your fingers in your ears and ignore it when I've (sadly) been on target, then I guess I misjudged you as a fair and balanced contributor on here. Your call. I'll live, either way.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Murray View Post
    Those who've been on here as long as you and me will recall my "Open Letter to Coach Umile" almost 8 years ago, which was a couple of years AFTER I'd initially opined about the developing downturn in the program.

    Again, I wish I were proven wrong with that, I really do. I want to see winning hockey at UNH again, and the sooner the better. If you want to take shots at me when I'm wrong, I'm good with that (see McDonnell, Sean) and if I'm wrong, I'll apologize gladly. This is not exactly life and death stuff, and we ALL miss the mark at times. But if you want to stick your fingers in your ears and ignore it when I've (sadly) been on target, then I guess I misjudged you as a fair and balanced contributor on here. Your call. I'll live, either way.
    Hindsight is 20/20 Chuck. If you say you predicted this decline 8 years ago, then good for you. I predict in the next 8 years UNH will place higher than last place. BFD! If that doesn't happen you can call me out. Your call!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Murray View Post
    Those who've been on here as long as you and me will recall my "Open Letter to Coach Umile" almost 8 years ago, which was a couple of years AFTER I'd initially opined about the developing downturn in the program.

    Again, I wish I were proven wrong with that, I really do. I want to see winning hockey at UNH again, and the sooner the better. If you want to take shots at me when I'm wrong, I'm good with that (see McDonnell, Sean) and if I'm wrong, I'll apologize gladly. This is not exactly life and death stuff, and we ALL miss the mark at times. But if you want to stick your fingers in your ears and ignore it when I've (sadly) been on target, then I guess I misjudged you as a fair and balanced contributor on here. Your call. I'll live, either way.
    I remember that letter, the first post that I read of yours, as I had joined the forum only a short while before that, I guess. I remember thinking at the time, if Umile reads this letter, he will never step down, out of spite.

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    Re: UNH Wildcats 2017/2018 - Umile's Last Stand - The Grand Finale

    Quote Originally Posted by Greg Ambrose View Post
    I was told that he didnít acknowledge the crowd at the end of the game. True?
    We watched carefully. After the team handshakes Madigan came back to center ice to shake Umile's hand a second time. Then Umile turned and walked to the bench and down the tunnel with hardly a side-ward glance - very sad. Thankfully Boyd (I think) had picked up the UNH sweaters that had been tossed on the ice by some juveniles so the players wouldn't have to skate over them as they circled the ice. On the whole a disappointing scene.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JAB View Post
    We watched carefully. After the team handshakes Madigan came back to center ice to shake Umile's hand a second time. Then Umile turned and walked to the bench and down the tunnel with hardly a side-ward glance - very sad. Thankfully Boyd (I think) had picked up the UNH sweaters that had been tossed on the ice by some juveniles so the players wouldn't have to skate over them as they circled the ice. On the whole a disappointing scene.
    Just donít get that. Yes, things ended very badly for Dick, a lot of due to his own inattention. But he had a lot of great years, a lot of teams that provided a lot of great enjoyment for a lot of fans. Count me as one who was incredibly disappointed as how it all ended as it did, especially do to his failures as the leader of the program. But it shouldnít take away everything that he did before. I spent a lot of thoroughly enjoyable years watching UNH Hockey and my guess is a lot of people there last night did as well. To not acknowledge their gratitude is really disappointing.

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    i once had pleasure of watching a unh practice umile ran with / during bobby butler & co days.. some 3x3, some other stuff, but he used just half ice the whole time. one of the better coll sessions i have seen. kids were beat at end of it. excellent stuff. he made it look so simple, but players were seriously working, getting better no doubt. no standing around.

    well, best to him. good guy.

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    Re: UNH Wildcats 2017/2018 - Umile's Last Stand - The Grand Finale

    Quote Originally Posted by JAB View Post
    We watched carefully. After the team handshakes Madigan came back to center ice to shake Umile's hand a second time. Then Umile turned and walked to the bench and down the tunnel with hardly a side-ward glance - very sad. Thankfully Boyd (I think) had picked up the UNH sweaters that had been tossed on the ice by some juveniles so the players wouldn't have to skate over them as they circled the ice. On the whole a disappointing scene.
    Truth be told, I wanted to leave after the second NU goal. So soft. It was clear the game was just going to be MOTS. However I stuck it out because I felt I owed it to Dick. I know that sounds corny, but that is honestly how I felt. So like JAB, I was paying more attention to Umile at the end. I did think it was strange he didn't do more. Just a very sad ending. But I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. No matter what he did it would have been wrong. People would have complained he took a victory lap after winning only one game in three months. Others would have said he was taking attention away from the team, you had your celebration two weeks earlier. You had a few neanderthals throwing Umile shirts on the ice. A no win situation (no pun intended) Perhaps that is how it should have ended.

    BTW, I agree with Chuck ("You're absolutely right, Chuck!") Coach Madigan called off the dogs on Saturday night. As much as I wanted to see the 'Cats score, I knew if they did knock a goal or two in that NU would have just stepped on the accelerator and answered them. Umile seemed very gracious to Madigan after the game and I presume/hope Dick was thanking him for not running it up in his last contest at home. As many of you know I haven't been a big fan of the Northeastern coach, but he earned some points in my book. Not that Coach Madigan cares what I think.
    UNH Hockey: From "Why Not Us' to "Woe is Us"

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    Re: UNH Wildcats 2017/2018 - Umile's Last Stand - The Grand Finale

    Personally I think Coach did the right thing by leaving the ice the way he did on his own terms. No doubt/perhaps he saw the jersey toss and perhaps he didn't want to get more of the same....no shame there if you ask me. At FOH meetings he has said he'd rather talk after a win so maybe that was his thinking?

    While there were only 2 jerseys thrown (and it was Boyd who picked them up) that was enough (and classless act on the part of the two fans who were sitting in the next section from us) I heard it was very upsetting to the team. Despite what we say about their abilities they are doing the best they can and do care about how things went. I wish them the best moving forward.

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    Re: UNH Wildcats 2017/2018 - Umile's Last Stand - The Grand Finale

    HE tix for the UMaine v UNH games go on sale at 10:00 this morning...

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    Re: UNH Wildcats 2017/2018 - Umile's Last Stand - The Grand Finale

    Finishing last in Hockey East in a down year for the league sums it up. The worst part is I dont think UNH has hit rock bottom yet. How does UNH climb out of the basement? A coaching change - is Souza really any different than Umile in terms of style/systems? Doubtful as Souza has been tutored by Umile. The other option is bringing in more talent and thats the recruiting pipeline which is severely lacking already. Good luck trying to convince a blue chip player/advisor that the last place Hockey East team with an unproven coach is a great landing spot.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lemonade View Post
    Finishing last in Hockey East in a down year for the league sums it up. The worst part is I dont think UNH has hit rock bottom yet. How does UNH climb out of the basement? A coaching change - is Souza really any different than Umile in terms of style/systems? Doubtful as Souza has been tutored by Umile. The other option is bringing in more talent and thats the recruiting pipeline which is severely lacking already. Good luck trying to convince a blue chip player/advisor that the last place Hockey East team with an unproven coach is a great landing spot.
    I remain cautiously optimistic. Other programs have rebounded from years of mediocrity and outright futility. You can look it up just by scanning the Pairwise. Like I said before, it takes a change in mindset and commitment. To me it will hinge on who Souza hires as his assistant. If itís a safe choice, a guy he perhaps played with at UNH, it is not going to work. The ideal manager hires people who complement his strengths rather just complimenting his strengths. Just have to see.

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    Re: UNH Wildcats 2017/2018 - Umile's Last Stand - The Grand Finale

    Quote Originally Posted by Felger View Post
    Truth be told, I wanted to leave after the second NU goal. So soft. It was clear the game was just going to be MOTS. However I stuck it out because I felt I owed it to Dick. I know that sounds corny, but that is honestly how I felt. So like JAB, I was paying more attention to Umile at the end. I did think it was strange he didn't do more. Just a very sad ending. But I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. No matter what he did it would have been wrong. People would have complained he took a victory lap after winning only one game in three months. Others would have said he was taking attention away from the team, you had your celebration two weeks earlier. You had a few neanderthals throwing Umile shirts on the ice. A no win situation (no pun intended) Perhaps that is how it should have ended.

    BTW, I agree with Chuck ("You're absolutely right, Chuck!") Coach Madigan called off the dogs on Saturday night. As much as I wanted to see the 'Cats score, I knew if they did knock a goal or two in that NU would have just stepped on the accelerator and answered them. Umile seemed very gracious to Madigan after the game and I presume/hope Dick was thanking him for not running it up in his last contest at home. As many of you know I haven't been a big fan of the Northeastern coach, but he earned some points in my book. Not that Coach Madigan cares what I think.
    Felger or others paying attention after the game. One thing that I did notice was that after leaving center ice DU was pointing or jestering in the direction of Gravallese. It wasn't his angry pointing that we have seen after a horribly called game. could not tell if he was saluting or did have a bit of an issue, it was a wag rather than is punctuating point. Anyone else see it?
    NU also was playing some kids that don't always start.
    My call, he wanted this to be the seniors night, he had his with more than the 4000 someone noted. Decent crowd perhaps close to the number reported - 5500. The GA end was as full as it has been all year.

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    Re: UNH Wildcats 2017/2018 - Umile's Last Stand - The Grand Finale

    Quote Originally Posted by After the Whistle View Post
    Felger or others paying attention after the game. One thing that I did notice was that after leaving center ice DU was pointing or jestering in the direction of Gravallese. It wasn't his angry pointing that we have seen after a horribly called game. could not tell if he was saluting or did have a bit of an issue, it was a wag rather than is punctuating point. Anyone else see it?
    NU also was playing some kids that don't always start.
    My call, he wanted this to be the seniors night, he had his with more than the 4000 someone noted. Decent crowd perhaps close to the number reported - 5500. The GA end was as full as it has been all year.
    Benedetto and Gravellese for Coach's final home game. Perfect.
    I will not be out cheered in my own building.

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    Re: UNH Wildcats 2017/2018 - Umile's Last Stand - The Grand Finale

    Quote Originally Posted by After the Whistle View Post
    Felger or others paying attention after the game. One thing that I did notice was that after leaving center ice DU was pointing or jestering in the direction of Gravallese. It wasn't his angry pointing that we have seen after a horribly called game. could not tell if he was saluting or did have a bit of an issue, it was a wag rather than is punctuating point. Anyone else see it?
    NU also was playing some kids that don't always start.
    My call, he wanted this to be the seniors night, he had his with more than the 4000 someone noted. Decent crowd perhaps close to the number reported - 5500. The GA end was as full as it has been all year.
    You're right, I forgot to mention Umile's friendly wave (his only one) to Grav and Grav's return wave. And yes, Darius, how fitting HE assigned Grav and Benedetto - his old friends (and antagonists): remember DU bending over slamming the boards at some call they missed? "Those were the days my friends.... "

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    Quote Originally Posted by e.cat View Post
    Okay Dan. Let me get this straight. If the variable X=Chippah(preferably BLUE) then Souza and UNH will jump start the rebuild immediately. Do I have that right? If so I'm down with that!
    Yes it's possible - though you can include me in the less than optimistic camp. The two players Watcher and I have discussed Filip Suchy (38 GP: 27-24--51 / Horni Lukavice, CZE) and Marek Valach (42 GP: 18-15--33 / Ilava, SVK) remain available, among others who could make immediate top-six impacts - and yes, 1932, I watched both play Des Moines earlier this month (Suchy for the second time). There are also a number of talented kids who could be brought in a year early and make an impact down the road...

    I'm not sure what either strategy - especially the latter really does for next year's team, but both would signal that UNH is heading in the right direction and that Souza has a vision and capability. That would be jumpstarting the rebuild in my eyes and I'd be the first to jump on the bandwagon...

    If they get nothing this summer - I guess I'll have to continue to be the negative a-hole with the nerve to discuss the reality of the situation UNH is in. Much to 32's chagrin...
    Last edited by Dan; 02-26-2018 at 10:47 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Darius View Post
    Benedetto and Gravellese for Coach's final home game. Perfect.
    Ugh don't get me started...🙄

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    Re: UNH Wildcats 2017/2018 - Umile's Last Stand - The Grand Finale

    Quote Originally Posted by NCAA watcher View Post
    Crookshank has better skills than Blackburn -- gets around the ice, which is Liam's biggest problem. Blackburn will be productive, but needs guys whose skills he can play off. Production wise Angus will match Downing, but Downing was more two way than Crookshank, who is more of a darter, sneaky player.

    Esposito will not match MacAdams. MacAdams has some decent puck skills and grit, while not consistent or top end, but could get to the second line as a nice complementary player. Esposito just is a *****stirrer, who will have goals off is skates, etc. while drawing and taking penalties. Fourth line, Third line tops.

    Cipollone will not be Correale level. I'd say Chris Miller/Borisenok sort.

    Green - I don't get him. Seems the typical "size" project, where scouts talk about his upside, separate from his puck skills. He was supposed to have offensive skills, but the only one I saw was a shot, and his skating was sub par, and I didn't see any real puck handling or distribution. Then I heard decent reports on his defense during last year's playoffs. The offensive has not deveoped at all, and I'm skeptical that his skating can allow him to be a top defender (Chanter?), so it's a low projection.

    Verrier is actually a kid who had low projections, but put together his skating and offensive skills in prep, and now at GB. He'll never be a top pair kid, but his offense seems to be enough to get him onto the second pair.

    ---

    I think the current group has given all it can. I assume that pitch has been out there for a while. Hopefully the Slovaks/Czechs are interested, and their TOEFL and transcripts are the holdup why we haven't heard anything. Seems odd to have that much money likely available and unused this late, unless there's that sort of thing with the kids they're after.
    Fair enough Watcher - love the added opinion. Like I said, my comps were more based on production than anything else and the second names on my comp list were more ceiling potential than expectations.

    Crookshank is a different type of player than Downing, but I think he ends up around the same levels of production. Downing had a rough junior year, otherwise he ends up around 125-130 career points (he finished with 112, i believe). I think that is where Crookshank ends up - based on the teams he'll likely play for (as currently put together) and the linemates he'll likely play with. Add a couple of real skill players to the team and his units and those numbers could be much more. But he can only do so much on his own...

    I agree with your assessment of Esposito, I guess Im not as bullish on MacAdams.

    I think my Cipollone/Kyle Smith comparison is a fit - high scoring EJ kids who come to UNH with offensive style games, but lacking the ability to translate that offense. If he ends up having a more well-rounded game like Borisenok (and can forecheck and defend at a solid level on a lower line) that would be a win for UNH. I do think he has enough offense (and he scored a bit in the BCHL - I wish he had gone back there instead of coming home for JRs) to produce at a limited level with the right linemates (a la Correale alongside AP and TK - DC had 11 goals in three seasons before playing with those two. I don't think thats too high a bar - although he was a hard skating guy to play against). But, if Cipollone is playing that role, UNH is probably in trouble...

    I don't buy Green and his offensive game - aside from getting shots through from the point. He was a projectable offensive kid in the EHL, it hasn't translated to the USHL at all. I remember the video of him when he committed - going end to end - and your comment that he was never challenged and just outskated inferior opponents. If he ends up as a quietly, stable third pair or #4 defensemen like Nick Krates I'd take it. I don't think he can be Charlebois and I don't see much offense showing at the NCAA level. If he can surpass Chanter and be more consistent and safer, than UNH wins...

    I'm not as bullish on Verrier either. I think he's a third pair guy on a good UNH team. If he can be dependable and break pucks out without being a liability defensively (Marks lite), I'll be happy. I'd rather have Miller to be honest. If Verrier is playing on the second pair than UNH's defense just isnt going to be as deep as it can be...

    None of these guys aside from Crookshank are the game changers UNH needs to really rebound. I truly hope you are right and Souza is looking aggressively at filling holes this summer. I'd do cartwheels if they land the two Euro forwards - or equivalents - out of the USHL. I'd be equally as thrilled if they took flyers on some of the young forwards and defenseman out of the BCHL and put them right into top-six/top-four roles as true (or early) freshmen and looked ahead to the future. If they stand pat or fill in with 20 year old EHL/NCDC type kids I'll be up in arms...
    Last edited by Dan; 02-26-2018 at 11:35 AM.

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    Re: UNH Wildcats 2017/2018 - Umile's Last Stand - The Grand Finale

    Quote Originally Posted by JB View Post
    I will note UNH1932 did not come visit me. I was a little disappointed...
    Very surprising!! Looks like he laid off the moonshine this weekend though so... no drunk posting which is good.
    Quote Originally Posted by Greg Ambrose on 3/7/2010 View Post
    The fact that you BC fans revel in the superiority of your team in an admittedly weak league leads me to believe you will be more sorely disappointed when the end comes than we will.

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    Re: UNH Wildcats 2017/2018 - Umile's Last Stand - The Grand Finale

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick Papagiorgio View Post
    Looks like he laid off the moonshine this weekend though so... no drunk posting which is good.
    But drunk posting can be very entertaining for the rest of us.
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