Business, Economics & Tax Policy 6.0: Nope, it only found woven strands

[joecct]

And now the Dow futures are off by 1,000+

Tomorrow is going to be a wild ride.

Turn off the computers

[LynahFan]

Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 6.0: Nope, it only found woven strands

Brokerage houses have two sets of books, or accounts, if you will. They have one set of accounts which are entirely setup for their clients. Those trade based upon agreements with the clients - either directed by an account/investment manager, or only triggered by instructions put forth by the client. Even those trades directed by an agent of the brokerage can have limits set by account contract to keep them from being churned to death, ergo fees eating all the clients' profits. The other set of books are for accounts strictly held by brokerage firms for their own benefit. When it comes to stocks and bonds, they can (mostly) buy and sell as often as they want. There are limits, but there are easy ways to skirt most of the those limits, too.

With regards to limiting the purchases/sales of assets, mutual funds have 30-day limits in place as under-educated investors were churning their own 401k accounts. Now it's setup so that if you purchase on Day X, and sell prior to X+30, then the mutual fund company can place a purchase-block on your account, keeping you from moving your money into that specific investment again for a set period of time (I forget the period).

Also interesting to note that it is illegal for the brokerage houses to take advantage of client instructions to make decisions about their own trades first. That is, if a bunch of clients are issuing "Sell Amazon" instructions, they can't first go sell off their own Amazon shares and then get around to selling the clients' shares after their own selling has depressed the price.

However, it's really darn hard to catch them doing this, and there's a pretty strong assumption that it happens quite a lot. A friend of ours from CERN had actually worked for Goldman before going back into physics, and he was in talks with some of the European regulators about using some of the software techniques for triggering* recordings of particle collision events in the LHC for looking for and recording suspicious trading patterns. I'm not sure anything ever came of that, though.

*In particle colliders, there are so many collisions and resulting particles showering off of them that you can't possibly record all the data. You have to have software that looks at the raw data stream in near real time (~800 MHz, if I recall correctly) to decide if a set of data "looks interesting" - a trigger. The interesting few nanoseconds of data are recorded, and the rest disappears into the aether. Even so, the data that they do record annually would just about fit on a stack of CDs...that would reach the moon. Without jewel cases. Even the highest frequency trading is in the 10 MHz range, 2 orders of magnitude slower than the CERN triggers, so technologically, it would be child's play for them.

[ticapnews]

Are you selling low?

No. I normally don't look at my account but was curious. I earned a 7% return last year, but have lost 8% since Friday, and early indicators are the DJIA will open down a thousand tomorrow. Fortunately only 27% of my account is in the US stock market. It hurts though. Seeing Forbes estimate Jeff Bezos lost $2.2 billion today doesn't make me feel any better.

[Deutsche Gopher Fan]

Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 6.0: Nope, it only found woven strands

In just not even checking. Don’t want to panic. Not much I can do.
Maybe I should try to pick up a few things low

[ticapnews]

In just not even checking. Don’t want to panic. Not much I can do.
Maybe I should try to pick up a few things low

It's not low yet.

[Deutsche Gopher Fan]

It's not low yet.

No I have time. I have things vesting each feb but I won’t be selling anything real soon

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 6.0: Nope, it only found woven strands

If we’re off another thousand today, I’ll be in a buying mood. Anything below around 24,000 and we’re in full correction mode.

ETA: while you were sleeping, the VIX hit 50.
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/02/06/key-measure-of-market-volatility--the-vix--jumps-above-50-highest-level-since-aug-2015.html

In context:
https://www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/files/inline-images/ETF%20in%20context.jpg

That’s the highest since 2015 and the largest single day spike ever. Be careful reading too much into it though. As was discussed earlier, there’s some shenanigans going on in the volatility markets right now, but this isn’t going to help things.

If it cracks 52, it’s the highest since the Great Recession. Buckle up buttercup.

ETA: this was an interesting article. I’m not sure if this is the kind of person who will buy tactical butt wipes but the logic seems to check out.

https://www.diyinvesting.org/risk/liquidation-xiv-short-volatility-etn-stock-market-crash

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 6.0: Nope, it only found woven strands

If I had money I'd probably be a buyer. If I had a real broker who got me out and in on time I would have made a lot of money. Instead, I'll dollar cost average cause that's what I'm stuck with. Wheeeeeee.

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 6.0: Nope, it only found woven strands

If you had access to any of these, you -specifically- would be broke. You would chase the markets with your retirement and you would lose. Periodic investment or DCAing (as most of us know it) are saving you from yourself.

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 6.0: Nope, it only found woven strands

If you had access to any of these, you -specifically- would be broke. You would chase the markets with your retirement and you would lose. Periodic investment or DCAing (as most of us know it) are saving you from yourself.

The good news is I was unaffected by yesterday. At least so far. That's how well diversified I am.

The steep declines in the stock markets in recent days have many investors nervous, but some local investment professionals said it is not time to panic.

They said the overheated markets were due for a reset of expectations. So while the markets have already shown more volatility in 2018 than all of last year, they said they still expect them to end the year higher than they started.

Lisa Erickson, senior vice president and head of the traditional investments group at U.S. Bank Wealth Management, said her bank’s message to clients on Monday was to stay the course and focus on long-term goals while monitoring the situation closely.

“We don’t see it has an immediate reason for concern,” Erickson said.

http://www.startribune.com/local-inv...nes/472830133/

[unh_hockey]

Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 6.0: Nope, it only found woven strands

If I had money I'd probably be a buyer. If I had a real broker who got me out and in on time I would have made a lot of money. Instead, I'll dollar cost average cause that's what I'm stuck with. Wheeeeeee.

I would say its unreasonable to expect your broker ( or anyone for that matter) to reliably time the markets. Think of it this way, the best time to make money would be to perfectly time the tops, sell, and buy back at the bottoms. Of course in rising markets, the prevailing mindset is to buy more…not sell. Would a broker have much money if they faded strength , and reported to you that you missed the last 5% move in the S&P500? I do not think so. You’d fire them faster than Donald Trump fires whitehouse staff.

In the grocery store, you buy more of cheaper products, and less of the more expensive products. The stock market is the opposite where people want to buy more as things get more costly, and want to buy less as they become cheaper.

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 6.0: Nope, it only found woven strands

I would say its unreasonable to expect your broker ( or anyone for that matter) to reliably time the markets. Think of it this way, the best time to make money would be to perfectly time the tops, sell, and buy back at the bottoms. Of course in rising markets, the prevailing mindset is to buy more…not sell. Would a broker have much money if they faded strength , and reported to you that you missed the last 5% move in the S&P500? I do not think so. You’d fire them faster than Donald Trump fires whitehouse staff.

In the grocery store, you buy more of cheaper products, and less of the more expensive products. The stock market is the opposite where people want to buy more as things get more costly, and want to buy less as they become cheaper.

"And no matter whether our clients make money, Duke and Duke collect their commissions."

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 6.0: Nope, it only found woven strands

Dammit. The market already looks to be smarter than the average bear. Instead of continuing to sell off because of the cluster Fark in XIV, the market is almost up.

I was really hoping for a big sell off again.

[unh_hockey]

Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 6.0: Nope, it only found woven strands

Dammit. The market already looks to be smarter than the average bear. Instead of continuing to sell off because of the cluster Fark in XIV, the market is almost up.

I was really hoping for a big sell off again.

Yeah from what I hear they suspended trading of xiv and svxy.

[unh_hockey]

Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 6.0: Nope, it only found woven strands

"And no matter whether our clients make money, Duke and Duke collect their commissions."

exactly. Its less than a zero sum game for most. The middle men always get their piece of the pie. always.