POTUS 45.20 - Doddering Dotards Dodging Detente

[Kepler]

Re: POTUS 45.20 - Doddering Dotards Dodging Detente

The Jews have figured it out, anyway.

For Flag, make that (((Jews))).

[leswp1]

Re: POTUS 45.20 - Doddering Dotards Dodging Detente

Okay, but in my anecdotal experience none of the diseases that were included in the vaccine schedule were ever contracted by any kid I have seen or heard about. If that's true the difference appears to be negligible.



I'm not sure why you have such an issue with my take on this. I have very clearly stated multiple times that I do not believe the MMR was the cause. I've never said to not give kids the shots, only to be smart about how they are given. What's wrong with that?

I will not go into my personal experiences but with how things played out, I don't know how anyone could not come to the conclusion the MMR was at least involved or a trigger of the onset of symptoms until an actual cause is identified. Neither one of us will see it any other way, so that is the end of that.

I promise you that I am just as involved as you, so being active in national groups is hardly a convincing argument. They are primarily about awareness. Well, I'm pretty aware of this topic already so it's time for more action beyond the "light it up blue" campaigns. I'm not saying stop doing them. But there has to be more in the mainstream optics from these groups before I will go back to them.



Again, it's not about less exposure. It's about controlling the exposure.

You, of course, must do what you feel is best. Sadly I HAVE seen little kids/people contract these diseases. They are on the rise. When I first started practice there were no cases for quite some time of Mumps, measles, German measles, whooping cough in my state. Now we have yearly outbreaks of Pertussis and we have had all the others in the state in mini outbreaks. All these diseases are on the rise. These are things that kill infants (not to mention what it does to pregnant women). They are helpless if exposed. Vaccines are not 100% effective so the only way to protect is herd immunity. That is why I have an issue. Having had to send a non-responsive kid out in an ambulance, have them be intubated, end up with multiple lifetime consequences that impact not only them but the whole family tends to make one a bit reactive.

Controlling the 'exposure' seems to make parents feel comforted but splitting vaccines out means sometimes there is sig delay in completing the series. This puts both the kid who isn't vaccinated on time at risk but also those who can't be vaccinated. Parents of kids who can't be vaccinated end up feeling like they need to keep their kid isolated or take the crap shoot. You never know who could be a carrier because they haven't been vaccinated when they were supposed to be. Having dealt with parents who lived in constant fear because of non-vaccinators or those who picked and chose what they wanted when probably gives my a hypersensitivity. Used to be we could say- oh- your kid is X old. Kids that age are vaccinated against this so you should be OK. Now we have to say- well, they should be vaccinated but we can't be sure. You should stay away.

[FadeToBlack&Gold]

Re: POTUS 45.20 - Doddering Dotards Dodging Detente

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/05/u...imes&smtyp=cur

Don't worry America. Viagra is covered.

Fck "sincerely held religious beliefs". So tired of this crap.

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: POTUS 45.20 - Doddering Dotards Dodging Detente

When, in the history of Donald Trump, has Donald Trump ever stopped, listened to the contradictory voice telling him a differing opinion, and then taken a moment to consider the outcome?

Constant negativity against the person does not constitute a differing opinion.

[rufus]

Re: POTUS 45.20 - Doddering Dotards Dodging Detente

It's all you have when your mind is impotent and deficient.

I'm pretty sure it's not just the mind.

[WisconsinWildcard]

Re: POTUS 45.20 - Doddering Dotards Dodging Detente

So you expect a parent to subject their kid to something they think is unreasonable? They are still getting all the shots, so what's the problem doing it a little differently?

Based on the best evidence available, the problem with doing them differently is it increases the risk for side effects from the vaccine, it increases the risk of getting preventable diseases, it increases the risk of getting encephalitis of any cause, and it increases the risk of serious morbidity and mortality. We do not have the vaccine schedule on a whim or a guess. If your "different" or the MDs that oppose the current vaccine schedule is better, show us. Do the hard work, do the research, back your points with solid evidence in peer reviewed journals and I will be first in line, pounding on the door to get the vaccine schedule changed. There are thousands of researchers work put into this, thousands of healthcare workers who have studied and thought long and hard about this.

Okay, but in my anecdotal experience none of the diseases that were included in the vaccine schedule were ever contracted by any kid I have seen or heard about. If that's true the difference appears to be negligible.

I have seen children die of vaccine preventable disease. I have seen people have lifelong injury to vaccine preventable diseases. I have taken care of children suffering from subacute sclerosing panencephalitis and had to tell the parents they will slowly watch their child die from a measles related illness and there is nothing we know to stop it. About 1 in 20 children who get measles get pneumonia. About 1 in 1000 get encephalitis with about the same number dying. These illness are most severe in the very young so delaying the vaccines is no trivial matter.

You may think you are involved, and I think your heart is probably in the right place, but your reasoning is flawed and it can have deadly consequences.

[rufus]

Re: POTUS 45.20 - Doddering Dotards Dodging Detente

She would just shake her finger at them at say, "Bad North Korea" and toss more sanctions. Not saying that's a bad thing, just saying that there is no way she'd threaten with military action.

And that's all Trumpy's done too, that and some snarky name-calling, but somehow, you think he's all tough and manly.

[Jimjamesak]

If he were actually stopped (as opposed to having been convinced not to do it), that would mean that the nuclear launch procedures had failed. They are designed with two purposes in mind: that only the president can initiate a nuclear launch, and that a nuclear launch is initiated when the president so orders.

Don't orders have to follow the two-man rule? Somebody has to validate the order.

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: POTUS 45.20 - Doddering Dotards Dodging Detente

Don't orders have to follow the two-man rule? Somebody has to validate the order.

LOL. Like Trump isn't the Supreme Leader.

[leswp1]

Re: POTUS 45.20 - Doddering Dotards Dodging Detente

Based on the best evidence available, the problem with doing them differently is it increases the risk for side effects from the vaccine, it increases the risk of getting preventable diseases, it increases the risk of getting encephalitis of any cause, and it increases the risk of serious morbidity and mortality. We do not have the vaccine schedule on a whim or a guess. If your "different" or the MDs that oppose the current vaccine schedule is better, show us. Do the hard work, do the research, back your points with solid evidence in peer reviewed journals and I will be first in line, pounding on the door to get the vaccine schedule changed. There are thousands of researchers work put into this, thousands of healthcare workers who have studied and thought long and hard about this.



I have seen children die of vaccine preventable disease. I have seen people have lifelong injury to vaccine preventable diseases. I have taken care of children suffering from subacute sclerosing panencephalitis and had to tell the parents they will slowly watch their child die from a measles related illness and there is nothing we know to stop it. About 1 in 20 children who get measles get pneumonia. About 1 in 1000 get encephalitis with about the same number dying. These illness are most severe in the very young so delaying the vaccines is no trivial matter.

You may think you are involved, and I think your heart is probably in the right place, but your reasoning is flawed and it can have deadly consequences.

This is a really great post. Much more articulate than mine. I would add that the consequences affect more than just the child involved. The parents, the extended family, the community exposed to the sick child and the healthcare system all pay for the longterm consequences.

[The Rube]

Re: POTUS 45.20 - Doddering Dotards Dodging Detente

And that's all Trumpy's done too, that and some snarky name-calling, but somehow, you think he's all tough and manly.

I don't think that, so you can stop that line of thinking.

[Tiggsy]

Re: POTUS 45.20 - Doddering Dotards Dodging Detente

You may think you are involved, and I think your heart is probably in the right place, but your reasoning is flawed and it can have deadly consequences.

You missed one of my main points about the effectiveness of the shots on a slower schedule.

My reasoning is to protect my children to the best of my ability. No way that is flawed.

[FadeToBlack&Gold]

Don't orders have to follow the two-man rule? Somebody has to validate the order.

If it comes directly from tDon, I suspect that's not the case. However, I hope that "The Generals" have a tacit agreement that if he orders a preemptive nuke, he's getting Article 25'd on the double.

[leswp1]

Re: POTUS 45.20 - Doddering Dotards Dodging Detente

You missed one of my main points about the effectiveness of the shots on a slower schedule.

My reasoning is to protect my children to the best of my ability. No way that is flawed.

I completely get your wanting to protect your child but as Wisco said it is clear from all the evidence collected you are actually increasing risk to your child at the same time choosing a path resulting in a less vigorous immune response so the benefit is less. This whole exchange is like an audio-visual aid for the research showing no amount of science can displace parents views once they have fixed on them. I do not miss having to have this discussion with parents one little bit.

[Tiggsy]

Re: POTUS 45.20 - Doddering Dotards Dodging Detente

I completely get your wanting to protect your child but as Wisco said it is clear from all the evidence collected you are actually increasing risk to your child at the same time choosing a path resulting in a less vigorous immune response so the benefit is less. This whole exchange is like an audio-visual aid for the research showing no amount of science can displace parents views once they have fixed on them. I do not miss having to have this discussion with parents one little bit.

Very well. I can see this is going nowhere. I will end this discussion to save you the issue of lecturing me further and to stop you from calling protective services to try and take my kids away for my negligence.