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Thread: 2020 Democratic Challengers

  1. #521
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers

    Quote Originally Posted by joecct View Post
    Who under 60? Heck, find 70.
    Manchin is 70.
    Biden is 70++
    Downtown Jerry Brown is 79.
    Liz is 68!!!!
    Cuomo is around 60? maybe. Believe Ohio Senator Sherrod Brown is in his early 60's. Booker and Gillenbrand might still be in their 40's.

    Mind you, Trump will be 74 next time around.
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  2. #522
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers

    Quote Originally Posted by joecct View Post
    Who under 60? Heck, find 70.
    Manchin is 70.
    Biden is 70++
    Downtown Jerry Brown is 79.
    Liz is 68!!!!
    The SNL skit calling Warren "hot young thing" really drove the age of the D leadership home.

    "Mouth breathers from Wisconsin" rejoice! The Ds haven't forgotten you.
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  3. #523
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers

    Quote Originally Posted by SJHovey View Post
    I don't think they'd be opposed to free speech rights of corporations. At least I hope not. The idea that anyone in this country would argue against the free speech rights of anyone, or anything, is appalling to me. BUT THE MONEYEEZ!?!?!

    Sorry, free speech isn't based upon how much or how little money someone or some thing has to spend on it. Furthermore, it's only speech. It's simply the free expression of an idea or opinion. No one is forcing you to listen to it or believe it.
    You lose me, and your argument, when you have to throw in the anything and the some thing. Utterly ludicrous. Are you going to tell us next that corporations should be allowed to vote in elections. People can vote in elections, corporations are people, should every corporation have a vote?

    Plus "BUT THE MONEYEEZ" nice ham handed false equivalency - and Republicans wonder why anyone with a brain thinks they're morons.
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  4. #524
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers

    Quote Originally Posted by Rover View Post
    Cuomo is around 60? maybe. Believe Ohio Senator Sherrod Brown is in his early 60's. Booker and Gillenbrand might still be in their 40's.

    Mind you, Trump will be 74 next time around.
    hillary will be how old when she is sworn in??
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  5. #525
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers

    Quote Originally Posted by E.J. Smith View Post
    People can vote in elections, corporations are people, should every corporation have a vote?
    People are a legal entity with certain rights; corporations are a legal entity with certain rights. People and corporations do not have the same rights, but they each have rights and obligations under the law.

    Like I posited a scenario in the taxes thread, if you want to take away speech right of a corporation, that's fundamental, and in that case I'd argue the tax code should be set up that corporations would no longer be taxable either. (It'd move them away from posturing to manipulate tax code so they wouldn't need speech rights. That said, please keep tax code conversations over there however.)
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  6. #526

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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers

    Quote Originally Posted by The Sicatoka View Post
    Seems there'll be some serious sifting and winnowing to be done.
    Yes. 16 enter, one leaves.
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  7. #527
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers

    Quote Originally Posted by E.J. Smith View Post
    You lose me, and your argument, when you have to throw in the anything and the some thing. Utterly ludicrous. Are you going to tell us next that corporations should be allowed to vote in elections. People can vote in elections, corporations are people, should every corporation have a vote?

    Plus "BUT THE MONEYEEZ" nice ham handed false equivalency - and Republicans wonder why anyone with a brain thinks they're morons.
    Oh for crying out loud. Who said anything about voting? So you only get free speech if you also have the right to vote, and vice versa?

    Corporations spend millions trying to entice you to buy boner pills and light beer. Why is it that people only seem to get worked up when the content of the speech turns political?

    Isn't that kind of the whole point of free speech? It doesn't matter who is speaking or what they are saying?
    Last edited by SJHovey; 11-13-2017 at 02:20 PM.
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  8. #528
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers

    Quote Originally Posted by The Sicatoka View Post
    Like I posited a scenario in the taxes thread, if you want to take away speech right of a corporation, that's fundamental, and in that case I'd argue the tax code should be set up that corporations would no longer be taxable either.
    Wait what?

  9. #529
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers

    Quote Originally Posted by The Sicatoka View Post
    Like I posited a scenario in the taxes thread, if you want to take away speech right of a corporation, that's fundamental, and in that case I'd argue the tax code should be set up that corporations would no longer be taxable either.
    Wait what?

  10. #530
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers

    Quote Originally Posted by Kepler View Post
    Yes. 16 enter, one leaves.
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    Pay. Per. View.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rover View Post
    Cuomo is around 60? maybe. Believe Ohio Senator Sherrod Brown is in his early 60's. Booker and Gillenbrand might still be in their 40's.

    Mind you, Trump will be 74 next time around.
    No thit. The White House has, with few exceptions, been an old folks home.

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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers

    Quote Originally Posted by SJHovey View Post
    Corporations spend millions trying to entice you to buy boner pills and light beer. Why is it that people only seem to get worked up when the content of the speech turns political?
    Do you really not see the difference? And since when do donations = speech?

  13. #533
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers

    John Smith is running for mayor of Anytown, USA.
    John Smith has more money for campaign signs than his opponent.
    John Smith buys up the only two billboards in town for his campaign signs.

    Is that free speech?
    Is the issue "more money" or "corporation"?
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers

    Quote Originally Posted by trixR4kids View Post
    Do you really not see the difference? And since when do donations = speech?
    If a corporation, or a human being, wants to say "buy this light beer" or "vote for this candidate" there is no difference in my opinion. Both the corporation and the individual should be free to utter both statements, if we want to accept free speech as something to protect in this country.

    People complain that corporations have and spend so much money on campaign ads and donations, and that somehow that is a legitimate reason for restricting that speech. But why? We don't restrict the speech of Bill Gates compared with you and me, just because he has billions to spend.

    With respect to your question as to why donations = speech, I think the logical argument is that if a person is limited in the amount they can spend for political advertising, or light beer ads even, then the quantity of a persons speech is restricted, and even the quality because you don't have the same opportunity to discuss as wide a variety of issues relating to the subject.
    That community is already in the process of dissolution where each man begins to eye his neighbor as a possible enemy, where non-conformity with the accepted creed, political as well as religious, is a mark of disaffection; where denunciation, without specification or backing, takes the place of evidence; where orthodoxy chokes freedom of dissent; where faith in the eventual supremacy of reason has become so timid that we dare not enter our convictions in the open lists, to win or lose.

  15. #535
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Sicatoka View Post
    Royal Rumble or Hell In The Cell?

  16. #536
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers

    Quote Originally Posted by ShirtlessBob View Post
    Royal Rumble or Hell In The Cell?
    Can we take Kep's 16 down to 8 via Royal Rumble and then change format?
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  17. #537
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    Quote Originally Posted by SJHovey View Post
    If a corporation, or a human being, wants to say "buy this light beer" or "vote for this candidate" there is no difference in my opinion. Both the corporation and the individual should be free to utter both statements, if we want to accept free speech as something to protect in this country.

    People complain that corporations have and spend so much money on campaign ads and donations, and that somehow that is a legitimate reason for restricting that speech. But why? We don't restrict the speech of Bill Gates compared with you and me, just because he has billions to spend.

    With respect to your question as to why donations = speech, I think the logical argument is that if a person is limited in the amount they can spend for political advertising, or light beer ads even, then the quantity of a persons speech is restricted, and even the quality because you don't have the same opportunity to discuss as wide a variety of issues relating to the subject.
    So you’re equating advertising and campaign donations with speech which is dubious at best.

    As for why campaign donations should be restricted, people are supposed to have one vote and be on a level playing field in terms of the political process. Not the rich guy/corporation just buys all the political power until we enter a system of feudalism where dopamine is injected into our veins so that we can work for them 24/7.

  18. #538
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers

    Can a corporation go to jail?
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  19. #539
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers

    Quote Originally Posted by trixR4kids View Post
    So you’re equating advertising and campaign donations with speech which is dubious at best.

    As for why campaign donations should be restricted, people are supposed to have one vote and be on a level playing field in terms of the political process. Not the rich guy/corporation just buys all the political power until we enter a system of feudalism where dopamine is injected into our veins so that we can work for them 24/7.
    Sorry. The measure of your right to free speech is not measured by your bank account.

    Do you know why corporations and rich people spend all of their cash trying to buy political party? Because it works. The 1% have the power because the 99% are morons.
    That community is already in the process of dissolution where each man begins to eye his neighbor as a possible enemy, where non-conformity with the accepted creed, political as well as religious, is a mark of disaffection; where denunciation, without specification or backing, takes the place of evidence; where orthodoxy chokes freedom of dissent; where faith in the eventual supremacy of reason has become so timid that we dare not enter our convictions in the open lists, to win or lose.

  20. #540
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    Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers

    Quote Originally Posted by Handyman View Post
    Can a corporation go to jail?
    Of course not. Why not ask if a corporation can ride a horse. Both questions are equally relevant to the issue of free speech.
    That community is already in the process of dissolution where each man begins to eye his neighbor as a possible enemy, where non-conformity with the accepted creed, political as well as religious, is a mark of disaffection; where denunciation, without specification or backing, takes the place of evidence; where orthodoxy chokes freedom of dissent; where faith in the eventual supremacy of reason has become so timid that we dare not enter our convictions in the open lists, to win or lose.

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