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  • Re: College Football 2017-18: Now with more CTE!

    So I'm living in the dark ages here, but he has a coach on his staff convicted of spousal abuse?

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    • Re: College Football 2017-18: Now with more CTE!

      Originally posted by Slap Shot View Post
      So I'm living in the dark ages here, but he has a coach on his staff convicted of spousal abuse?
      That he's known about since at least 2015, and maybe knew about as early as 2009.
      FERRIS STATE UNIVERSITY: 2012 FROZEN FOUR


      God, that was fun...

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      • Re: College Football 2017-18: Now with more CTE!

        Originally posted by French Rage View Post
        OSU football is king there and it's a Trump state. I expect him to be brought back via parade in a couple of weeks.
        You don't really know the territory. It's a Purple state, leaning Red. Favorite son John Kasich beat Trump in the Republican Primary. Franklin County (Columbus) is solid Blue. There will be political pushback no matter what is decided.

        The determining factor will likely be the terms of his contract extension. That contract holds Meyer to a higher standard in terms of his reporting obligations, particularly on issues of this nature. We don't have all of the facts yet, but it looks like he's in serious trouble.

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        • Re: College Football 2017-18: Now with more CTE!

          I have always hated OSU and just add this to the list. If Urban keeps his job that is simply disgusting.
          AF 99

          M-A-V-E-R-I-C-K-S, MAVERICKS, MAVERICKS, GOOOOO STATE!

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          • Re: College Football 2017-18: Now with more CTE!

            My post did not deserve this response.

            Worse, by dumping pep rally nonsense into the mix, you're literally trivializing a very serious issue.

            Comment


            • Re: College Football 2017-18: Now with more CTE!

              Originally posted by pgb-ohio View Post
              You don't really know the territory. It's a Purple state, leaning Red. Favorite son John Kasich beat Trump in the Republican Primary. Franklin County (Columbus) is solid Blue. There will be political pushback no matter what is decided.

              The determining factor will likely be the terms of his contract extension. That contract holds Meyer to a higher standard in terms of his reporting obligations, particularly on issues of this nature. We don't have all of the facts yet, but it looks like he's in serious trouble.
              Probably why he says he reported it now. Muddies the water enough that he thinks they won't dare fire him for cause.
              "I went over the facts in my head, and admired how much uglier the situation had just become. Over the years I've learned that ignorance is more than just bliss. It's freaking orgasmic ecstasy".- Harry Dresden, Blood Rites


              Western Michigan Bronco Hockey- 2012 Mason Cup Champions

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              • Re: College Football 2017-18: Now with more CTE!

                Originally posted by pgb-ohio View Post
                My post did not deserve this response.

                Worse, by dumping pep rally nonsense into the mix, you're literally trivializing a very serious issue.
                Huh?

                Unless someone deleted a post I’m not sure what you’re referring to?
                Code:
                As of 9/21/10:         As of 9/13/10:
                College Hockey 6       College Football 0
                BTHC 4                 WCHA FC:  1
                Originally posted by SanTropez
                May your paint thinner run dry and the fleas of a thousand camels infest your dead deer.
                Originally posted by bigblue_dl
                I don't even know how to classify magic vagina smoke babies..
                Originally posted by Kepler
                When the giraffes start building radio telescopes they can join too.
                He's probably going to be a superstar but that man has more baggage than North West

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                • Re: College Football 2017-18: Now with more CTE!

                  Originally posted by MavHockey14 View Post
                  I have always hated OSU and just add this to the list. If Urban keeps his job that is simply disgusting.
                  I'm curious about this response.

                  The OSU case points out an interesting issue about sports, public opinion and employment.

                  I'll admit I haven't read up much on this matter, but as I understand it one of Urban Meyer's assistants stands accused of committing spousal abuse a few years back. The abused wife says that she told wives of the other coaches, including Meyer's wife. Back in 2015 Meyer was asked about the allegations and said that he didn't know about them. Based upon what the abused spouse has reported, there is now some question about whether Meyer was telling the truth. Are those the basic facts?

                  We start with this basic premise. Spousal abuse shouldn't be tolerated and anyone who commits such an attack should certainly be prosecuted fully. I see no reason why a period of incarceration shouldn't be served, especially in any repeat cases or cases with significant injuries.

                  Next is the question of whether the abuser should be fired from his (or I suppose, her) job. I suspect that in the "real world" the only abusers who are fired from their jobs as a result of committing spousal abuse are those who either miss time due to their incarceration, or persons who are in in high profile positions where the employer might be publicly embarrassed by the continuing employment of the abuser. Personally, I don't really have a problem with that. Let the criminal justice system handle it. If the employer wants to fire the employee because of possible embarrassment to the company, I guess they should have that right. But I don't support the idea of just saying that people who commit spousal abuse (or any other crime for that matter) should automatically be fired from a job that is unrelated to the crime.

                  Arguably this assistant coach fits into the "public image" issue I describe, so I don't have a problem with a University choosing to fire a coach who drives intoxicated or commits spousal abuse or shoplifts or anything else if it brings embarrassment to the University. But where does that leave someone like Meyer, who didn't commit the abuse, but maybe knew about it?

                  Let's say he did know about it but simply chose to say nothing? Should he be fired from his job? Is that the standard we all want applied to us? I suppose if I'm the University and I find out Meyer actively tried to cover it up or something and his specific actions brought disrepute to the University they can choose to fire him. But shouldn't that just be a University decision? Does the public (other than perhaps OSU alums) really have any say in that other than expressing general hatred for that particular institution?
                  That community is already in the process of dissolution where each man begins to eye his neighbor as a possible enemy, where non-conformity with the accepted creed, political as well as religious, is a mark of disaffection; where denunciation, without specification or backing, takes the place of evidence; where orthodoxy chokes freedom of dissent; where faith in the eventual supremacy of reason has become so timid that we dare not enter our convictions in the open lists, to win or lose.

                  Comment


                  • Re: College Football 2017-18: Now with more CTE!

                    Originally posted by SJHovey View Post
                    I'm curious about this response.

                    The OSU case points out an interesting issue about sports, public opinion and employment.

                    I'll admit I haven't read up much on this matter, but as I understand it one of Urban Meyer's assistants stands accused of committing spousal abuse a few years back. The abused wife says that she told wives of the other coaches, including Meyer's wife. Back in 2015 Meyer was asked about the allegations and said that he didn't know about them. Based upon what the abused spouse has reported, there is now some question about whether Meyer was telling the truth. Are those the basic facts?

                    We start with this basic premise. Spousal abuse shouldn't be tolerated and anyone who commits such an attack should certainly be prosecuted fully. I see no reason why a period of incarceration shouldn't be served, especially in any repeat cases or cases with significant injuries.

                    Next is the question of whether the abuser should be fired from his (or I suppose, her) job. I suspect that in the "real world" the only abusers who are fired from their jobs as a result of committing spousal abuse are those who either miss time due to their incarceration, or persons who are in in high profile positions where the employer might be publicly embarrassed by the continuing employment of the abuser. Personally, I don't really have a problem with that. Let the criminal justice system handle it. If the employer wants to fire the employee because of possible embarrassment to the company, I guess they should have that right. But I don't support the idea of just saying that people who commit spousal abuse (or any other crime for that matter) should automatically be fired from a job that is unrelated to the crime.

                    Arguably this assistant coach fits into the "public image" issue I describe, so I don't have a problem with a University choosing to fire a coach who drives intoxicated or commits spousal abuse or shoplifts or anything else if it brings embarrassment to the University. But where does that leave someone like Meyer, who didn't commit the abuse, but maybe knew about it?

                    Let's say he did know about it but simply chose to say nothing? Should he be fired from his job? Is that the standard we all want applied to us? I suppose if I'm the University and I find out Meyer actively tried to cover it up or something and his specific actions brought disrepute to the University they can choose to fire him. But shouldn't that just be a University decision? Does the public (other than perhaps OSU alums) really have any say in that other than expressing general hatred for that particular institution?
                    While those are good questions to ask, I think this falls under what happened at Penn St as what Universities are supposed to report.

                    In many states, it's required by law that someone like Meyer turn in his assistant for breaking the law. And this exact thing is going on at MSU- did anyone know what Nasser was doing, and were they required to turn him in.

                    If there's a law in Ohio that requires Meyer to do that, he's in serious trouble. Also, IMHO, the public DOES have a say, since OSU is a public institution, and their funds come from the State of Ohio. So while Meyer may be paid in funds from other sources, he's an employee of a public university, thus is under Ohio government guidelines.

                    And because it sounds like he knew in 2015, and didn't turn him in, or sanction him, given this is an abuse case- I don't see Meyer keeping his job.

                    Comment


                    • Re: College Football 2017-18: Now with more CTE!

                      Originally posted by SJHovey View Post
                      I'm curious about this response.

                      The OSU case points out an interesting issue about sports, public opinion and employment.

                      I'll admit I haven't read up much on this matter, but as I understand it one of Urban Meyer's assistants stands accused of committing spousal abuse a few years back. The abused wife says that she told wives of the other coaches, including Meyer's wife. Back in 2015 Meyer was asked about the allegations and said that he didn't know about them. Based upon what the abused spouse has reported, there is now some question about whether Meyer was telling the truth. Are those the basic facts?

                      We start with this basic premise. Spousal abuse shouldn't be tolerated and anyone who commits such an attack should certainly be prosecuted fully. I see no reason why a period of incarceration shouldn't be served, especially in any repeat cases or cases with significant injuries.

                      Next is the question of whether the abuser should be fired from his (or I suppose, her) job. I suspect that in the "real world" the only abusers who are fired from their jobs as a result of committing spousal abuse are those who either miss time due to their incarceration, or persons who are in in high profile positions where the employer might be publicly embarrassed by the continuing employment of the abuser. Personally, I don't really have a problem with that. Let the criminal justice system handle it. If the employer wants to fire the employee because of possible embarrassment to the company, I guess they should have that right. But I don't support the idea of just saying that people who commit spousal abuse (or any other crime for that matter) should automatically be fired from a job that is unrelated to the crime.

                      Arguably this assistant coach fits into the "public image" issue I describe, so I don't have a problem with a University choosing to fire a coach who drives intoxicated or commits spousal abuse or shoplifts or anything else if it brings embarrassment to the University. But where does that leave someone like Meyer, who didn't commit the abuse, but maybe knew about it?

                      Let's say he did know about it but simply chose to say nothing? Should he be fired from his job? Is that the standard we all want applied to us? I suppose if I'm the University and I find out Meyer actively tried to cover it up or something and his specific actions brought disrepute to the University they can choose to fire him. But shouldn't that just be a University decision? Does the public (other than perhaps OSU alums) really have any say in that other than expressing general hatred for that particular institution?
                      Meyer has admitted he knew in 2015. Meyer was directly asked about it at media day, lied and said he had no knowledge. Meyer is more than likely still lying, and knew as early as 2009 about the abuse while they were coaching together at UF. Smith was fired for this behavior in 2018, once OSU knew it was going to go public. OSU and Meyer were both aware for at least 3 years and did nothing, then fired the guy when they knew it was going to be an issue. They absolutely gaze zero fuchs until it was going to become a PR issue. Wins over human decency.

                      Comment


                      • Re: College Football 2017-18: Now with more CTE!

                        Originally posted by alfablue View Post
                        While those are good questions to ask, I think this falls under what happened at Penn St as what Universities are supposed to report.

                        In many states, it's required by law that someone like Meyer turn in his assistant for breaking the law. And this exact thing is going on at MSU- did anyone know what Nasser was doing, and were they required to turn him in.

                        If there's a law in Ohio that requires Meyer to do that, he's in serious trouble. Also, IMHO, the public DOES have a say, since OSU is a public institution, and their funds come from the State of Ohio. So while Meyer may be paid in funds from other sources, he's an employee of a public university, thus is under Ohio government guidelines.

                        And because it sounds like he knew in 2015, and didn't turn him in, or sanction him, given this is an abuse case- I don't see Meyer keeping his job.
                        I think the differences between the OSU case and what happened at PSU and MSU is that in the latter instances the abuse or crime was actually connected to the University, either because of where it happened or as part of the abusers official responsibilities. That's not the case at OSU, at least as far as I know.

                        What if Sandusky or Nasser had just been accused of molesting their grandchildren at the family lake cabin? Certainly they would have gone to prison just the same. But would the sanctions and outrage against the University have been the same? If the University facilitated a cover up, sure I suppose. But in this case Meyer was supposedly told by his wife that she was told by the abused spouse that one of his coaches was engaged in spousal abuse. Did Meyer cover anything up? Did he impede any official investigations? I'm even going to disagree with the idea that Meyer would have been a mandatory reporter of this crime. I don't think so. Maybe decency suggests that he should have intervened to try to protect the abused spouse (I think many of us would have felt compelled to do something), but I don't think legally he is required to.
                        That community is already in the process of dissolution where each man begins to eye his neighbor as a possible enemy, where non-conformity with the accepted creed, political as well as religious, is a mark of disaffection; where denunciation, without specification or backing, takes the place of evidence; where orthodoxy chokes freedom of dissent; where faith in the eventual supremacy of reason has become so timid that we dare not enter our convictions in the open lists, to win or lose.

                        Comment


                        • Re: College Football 2017-18: Now with more CTE!

                          Originally posted by jerphisch View Post
                          Meyer has admitted he knew in 2015. Meyer was directly asked about it at media day, lied and said he had no knowledge. Meyer is more than likely still lying, and knew as early as 2009 about the abuse while they were coaching together at UF. Smith was fired for this behavior in 2018, once OSU knew it was going to go public. OSU and Meyer were both aware for at least 3 years and did nothing, then fired the guy when they knew it was going to be an issue. They absolutely gaze zero fuchs until it was going to become a PR issue. Wins over human decency.
                          Sure, that makes complete sense. The University and Meyer aren't obligated to fire this guy just because he's committing a criminal act outside the scope of his employment duties. They will usually only do it when it becomes a stain on their own reputation. That's the way it should be.

                          What if they had fired this guy in 2009? All that means is that Meyer and OSU wouldn't have been "tainted" by their association with a wife abuser. Would it have prevented any further abuse? How so?
                          That community is already in the process of dissolution where each man begins to eye his neighbor as a possible enemy, where non-conformity with the accepted creed, political as well as religious, is a mark of disaffection; where denunciation, without specification or backing, takes the place of evidence; where orthodoxy chokes freedom of dissent; where faith in the eventual supremacy of reason has become so timid that we dare not enter our convictions in the open lists, to win or lose.

                          Comment


                          • Re: College Football 2017-18: Now with more CTE!

                            Originally posted by SJHovey View Post
                            I think the differences between the OSU case and what happened at PSU and MSU is that in the latter instances the abuse or crime was actually connected to the University, either because of where it happened or as part of the abusers official responsibilities. That's not the case at OSU, at least as far as I know.

                            What if Sandusky or Nasser had just been accused of molesting their grandchildren at the family lake cabin? Certainly they would have gone to prison just the same. But would the sanctions and outrage against the University have been the same? If the University facilitated a cover up, sure I suppose. But in this case Meyer was supposedly told by his wife that she was told by the abused spouse that one of his coaches was engaged in spousal abuse. Did Meyer cover anything up? Did he impede any official investigations? I'm even going to disagree with the idea that Meyer would have been a mandatory reporter of this crime. I don't think so. Maybe decency suggests that he should have intervened to try to protect the abused spouse (I think many of us would have felt compelled to do something), but I don't think legally he is required to.
                            I'm not sure what most of that has to do with anything? The abuse has been reported to the police multiple times since 2009, whether or not Meyer reported it doesn't matter, the wife did. This is about Meyer knowing that one of his coaches was a wife beater for nearly a decade and continuing to employ him, right until he fired him when all of it was about to come out.

                            Comment


                            • Re: College Football 2017-18: Now with more CTE!

                              Originally posted by jerphisch View Post
                              I'm not sure what most of that has to do with anything? The abuse has been reported to the police multiple times since 2009, whether or not Meyer reported it doesn't matter, the wife did. This is about Meyer knowing that one of his coaches was a wife beater for nearly a decade and continuing to employ him, right until he fired him when all of it was about to come out.
                              Why should he have to fire him? The only reason he "has" to fire him is if he thinks it reflects poorly on him or the University. Are employers required to fire all "wife beaters?"
                              That community is already in the process of dissolution where each man begins to eye his neighbor as a possible enemy, where non-conformity with the accepted creed, political as well as religious, is a mark of disaffection; where denunciation, without specification or backing, takes the place of evidence; where orthodoxy chokes freedom of dissent; where faith in the eventual supremacy of reason has become so timid that we dare not enter our convictions in the open lists, to win or lose.

                              Comment


                              • Re: College Football 2017-18: Now with more CTE!

                                Originally posted by SJHovey View Post
                                I think the differences between the OSU case and what happened at PSU and MSU is that in the latter instances the abuse or crime was actually connected to the University, either because of where it happened or as part of the abusers official responsibilities. That's not the case at OSU, at least as far as I know.

                                What if Sandusky or Nasser had just been accused of molesting their grandchildren at the family lake cabin? Certainly they would have gone to prison just the same. But would the sanctions and outrage against the University have been the same? If the University facilitated a cover up, sure I suppose. But in this case Meyer was supposedly told by his wife that she was told by the abused spouse that one of his coaches was engaged in spousal abuse. Did Meyer cover anything up? Did he impede any official investigations? I'm even going to disagree with the idea that Meyer would have been a mandatory reporter of this crime. I don't think so. Maybe decency suggests that he should have intervened to try to protect the abused spouse (I think many of us would have felt compelled to do something), but I don't think legally he is required to.
                                We will be finding out whether it is mandatory to report crimes or not. Any more, I don't think it's really up to your opinion- most states have decided that people in certain positions are required to report it.

                                Whether you agree with that or not may be a moot point.

                                And lets not equate a significant policy violation vs. a crime here, the worst think that will happen to Meyer is that he looses his job. He's not going to jail.

                                It's also interesting that Meyer being quiet about spousal abuse flies in the face of what he tells his athletes- to not hit women.

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