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Thread: UNH Wildcats-The Back Nine and Beyond!

  1. #781
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    Re: UNH Wildcats-The Back Nine and Beyond!

    Quote Originally Posted by Snively65 View Post
    Yes, it was unfair for you answer, chickod. Chuck's whole point is to get newbies and young-uns to look up stuff, and you spoiled that. Shame on you!
    It wouldn't call it the correct answer. Perhaps partial credit.

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    Re: UNH Wildcats-The Back Nine and Beyond!

    Pop Quiz!

    How many more saves does Danny T need to overtake Kevin Regan's saves during his career???
    Let's Go 'Cats!

  3. #783
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Murray View Post
    Scored 20 goals in 3 seasons, pretty fair and reliable 3rd line forward at that level. Not all that unlike what JvR has turned into, actually. Of course, the old-timers on this thread (myself included) will always have a soft spot for BG in our hearts for a terrific UNH moment that still lives to this day.
    Good grief! Did you say soft-spot or blind spot? Bobby Gould was a great player, who had a great moment, at UNH and had a nice NHL career. JVR is on another level, has had a FAR more successful professional career and calling him a third liner indicates a clear agenda. There's a big difference between not a HOF and the scrubby bust you're constantly trying to turn him into. Lots of top picks don't end up in the HOF and still turn in well above average careers...

    JVR has already scored 29 more NHL goals than Gould in 151 fewer games played (in a era of much lower scoring games) and has been a top-six forward since walking into the league at 20 years old.

    JVRs biggest issue has been health and missed games. Yet, he ranks sixth in his draft class in goals scored, despite ranking only tenth in games played. He has had three seasons cut in half due to injury, missing 117 games as a result. Based on his pace in each season, those injuries cost him 38 more goals and 76 more points. 38 more goals would put him fourth in his draft class with 212. Is he a bust at pick #2 because Benn (from out of nowhere) and Paccioretty have surpassed his production? Not in any objective reality...

    Without injuries he would currently be on pace for his 7TH 20+ goal season and third 30+ goal campaign (compared to Gould's 3 and 0) in nine seasons. This season he is on pace for 41 goals...

    Yes, injuries happen - But raw and extrapolated numbers confirm that JVR is (by far) the most prolific NHL goal and point scorer in UNH history, both in total and in GPG. Bobby Gould is not close even now, let alone when JVRs career is done. With good health, he will surpass the career length of all the others in due time. He has also been 'elite' enough to represent the US in the Olympic Games...

    It's sad that so many hold ill feelings towards JVR because they think he owed them more production while at UNH and made it look easy and effortless while playing there (Note - that's what dominant players naturally do! See Gildon. See Poturalski. See all the other players you hate). If JVR stays four years at UNH he is the team's fourth all-time 200 point career scorer (and potentially its second Hobey Baker winner).

    As is, he scored 74 points in two seasons as an 18/19 year old. Only three other UNH forwards have scored as many points in their first two seasons, since 1999, and that would be Haydar (102), Collins (75) and (brace yourself Chuck!) Poturalski (81). Haydar had the benefit of playing with a SR Krog during his FR season. Collins played with SR Haydar in his first year. Poturalski was a 20 year old FR. JVR was the leader of his line both years (primarily Pollostrone and Dries as a FR and Sislo, Leblanc as a SO, if I recall correctly). Not enough?!
    Last edited by Dan; 11-14-2017 at 03:01 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Snively65 View Post
    Yes, it was unfair for you answer, chickod. Chuck's whole point is to get newbies and young-uns to look up stuff, and you spoiled that. Shame on you!
    Im sorry. Is that a major or a minor? (Am I banned for two weeks or five?).

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    Quote Originally Posted by chickod View Post
    Im sorry. Is that a major or a minor? (Am I banned for two weeks or five?).
    Just a two-minute minor for interference, but the zebras will be watching you closely. :-)

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    Quote Originally Posted by HockeyRef View Post
    Pop Quiz!

    How many more saves does Danny T need to overtake Kevin Regan's saves during his career???
    Six? Pretty amazing, but he has not had great D in front of him, so has seen (or not seen) a lot of shots, even if just a little more than 2.5 years.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Snively65 View Post
    Six? Pretty amazing, but he has not had great D in front of him, so has seen (or not seen) a lot of shots, even if just a little more than 2.5 years.
    Even a greater feat considering the D then...or am I not understanding your point...

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    Re: UNH Wildcats-The Back Nine and Beyond!

    Quote Originally Posted by Snively65 View Post
    Six? Pretty amazing, but he has not had great D in front of him, so has seen (or not seen) a lot of shots, even if just a little more than 2.5 years.
    Actually, while conventional wisdom is that Tirone has faced far more rubber than most UNH goalies, he has made saves at almost the exact same rate as Regan. Remember, Regan split time with Pietrasiak his first two seasons and also conceded nearly 20% of the playing time to Brian Foster as an upper-classman...

    Saves/60 Minutes
    Regan - 29.41
    Tirone - 29.39

    Tirone has 495.67 minutes until he catches Regan for minutes played - that is essentially 8.25 sixty-minute games. He has to average 29.7 saves over those 8.25 games to match Regan's pace to 3,235. Tirone has 102 appearances to Regan's 112 and needs to average 24.5 saves over his next ten games to match Regan in saves/games played...
    Last edited by Dan; 11-14-2017 at 05:51 PM.

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    Re: UNH Wildcats-The Back Nine and Beyond!

    Are the mods deleting posts these days? Ive seen two very accurate and funny posts from Dan and e.cat magically disappear after being posted, just in the last two weeks. Sad

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    Re: UNH Wildcats-The Back Nine and Beyond!

    Quote Originally Posted by HockeyRef View Post
    Even a greater feat considering the D then...or am I not understanding your point...
    My point was that Regan probably had better D men overall in front him than Tirone.

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    2007/08: Switzer, Flaishans, Fritsch, Charlebois, Kapsted, Krates
    Last edited by Snively65; 11-14-2017 at 10:53 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by wildcatdc View Post
    Are the mods deleting posts these days? Ive seen two very accurate and funny posts from Dan and e.cat magically disappear after being posted, just in the last two weeks. Sad
    My post mysteriously disappeared somewhere in cyberspace and I saw that post by Dan you refer to also that disappeared.

    Just to recap, Chuck's reference to JVR as a "third liner" is beyond rediculous. Chuck is always glass half empty. The gift that keeps on giving!!

    Thanks for pointing that out DC.
    Last edited by e.cat; 11-14-2017 at 10:04 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by e.cat View Post
    My post mysteriously disappeared somewhere in cyberspace and I saw that post by Dan you refer to also that disappeared.

    Just to recap, Chuck's reference to JVR as a "third liner" is beyond rediculous. Chuck is always glass half empty. The gift that keeps on giving!!

    Thanks for pointing that out DC.
    Will you grace our presence at the 'Whitt this Friday?

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    Quote Originally Posted by wildcatdc View Post
    Are the mods deleting posts these days? Ive seen two very accurate and funny posts from Dan and e.cat magically disappear after being posted, just in the last two weeks. Sad
    I took mine down - if you recall I waded into that conversation hesitantly and, ultimately, it was one I didn't want/need to have...

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    Quote Originally Posted by HockeyRef View Post
    Will you grace our presence at the 'Whitt this Friday?
    I'll be there

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    Re: UNH Wildcats-The Back Nine and Beyond!

    How are we looking on the injury front for Friday night? I know lots have been out but not sure of their status near-term!
    The Chicago Blackhawks - your 2009-2010 Stanley Cup Champions!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by UNHSince1969 View Post
    How are we looking on the injury front for Friday night? I know lots have been out but not sure of their status near-term!
    Normally on Wednesdays Coach U has a presser...maybe he divulges that info? At the very least I'm thinking Vela out of the four...maybe CHKell (Kelleher?)

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    Re: UNH Wildcats-The Back Nine and Beyond!

    Quote Originally Posted by chickod View Post
    Didn't he score the winning goal 40 seconds into OT in the 1977 East Regional semi-finals in that wild 10-9 win over Cornell at the Garden? (I should know this because I was there, but I seem to always confuse him with someone else).

    As an aside to anyone who left after that game, the second game was almost as good. BU scored three in the last five minutes to beat Dave Taylor's Clarkson team, 6-5 in the other semi. And we all know who won the final the next night...

    (was it "unfair" for me to answer because I'm not a young'un?) It doesn't matter anyway, because anyone can just look it up on the internet now...
    I was there as well. Our group left the BU Clarkson game with about five or six minutes to go to head for Chinatown and a celebratory feast. Never forget my buddy Mike yelling out of his car window while we were stuck in traffic that BU had won. Also should be noted that two years later, in the ECAC final vs. Dartmouth, Bob Gould, #17, scored at 17:17 of the third period to give UNH its only ECAC championship. BG was a great player, pretty intense, on some great teams. He would be around 60 today. Believe he is still teaching high school back in his home town of Petrolia, ONT.

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    Re: UNH Wildcats-The Back Nine and Beyond!

    Quote Originally Posted by Dan View Post
    Good grief! Did you say soft-spot or blind spot? Bobby Gould was a great player, who had a great moment, at UNH and had a nice NHL career. JVR is on another level, has had a FAR more successful professional career and calling him a third liner indicates a clear agenda. There's a big difference between not a HOF and the scrubby bust you're constantly trying to turn him into. Lots of top picks don't end up in the HOF and still turn in well above average careers...

    JVR has already scored 29 more NHL goals than Gould in 151 fewer games played (in a era of much lower scoring games) and has been a top-six forward since walking into the league at 20 years old.

    JVRs biggest issue has been health and missed games. Yet, he ranks sixth in his draft class in goals scored, despite ranking only tenth in games played. He has had three seasons cut in half due to injury, missing 117 games as a result. Based on his pace in each season, those injuries cost him 38 more goals and 76 more points. 38 more goals would put him fourth in his draft class with 212. Is he a bust at pick #2 because Benn (from out of nowhere) and Paccioretty have surpassed his production? Not in any objective reality...

    Without injuries he would currently be on pace for his 7TH 20+ goal season and third 30+ goal campaign (compared to Gould's 3 and 0) in nine seasons. This season he is on pace for 41 goals...

    Yes, injuries happen - But raw and extrapolated numbers confirm that JVR is (by far) the most prolific NHL goal and point scorer in UNH history, both in total and in GPG. Bobby Gould is not close even now, let alone when JVRs career is done. With good health, he will surpass the career length of all the others in due time. He has also been 'elite' enough to represent the US in the Olympic Games...

    It's sad that so many hold ill feelings towards JVR because they think he owed them more production while at UNH and made it look easy and effortless while playing there (Note - that's what dominant players naturally do! See Gildon. See Poturalski. See all the other players you hate). If JVR stays four years at UNH he is the team's fourth all-time 200 point career scorer (and potentially its second Hobey Baker winner).

    As is, he scored 74 points in two seasons as an 18/19 year old. Only three other UNH forwards have scored as many points in their first two seasons, since 1999, and that would be Haydar (102), Collins (75) and (brace yourself Chuck!) Poturalski (81). Haydar had the benefit of playing with a SR Krog during his FR season. Collins played with SR Haydar in his first year. Poturalski was a 20 year old FR. JVR was the leader of his line both years (primarily Pollostrone and Dries as a FR and Sislo, Leblanc as a SO, if I recall correctly). Not enough?!
    Since I watched them both, I'd say that Gould had the better collegiate career, JVR the better pro one. Perhaps if JVR had spent four years at UNH he would have surpassed Gould, although BG was a big game player and I never got the sense that JVR was. And please don't overlook the fact that JVR was the second pick in the draft. Because of it he was afforded opportunities at the pro level that Gould, who was a lowly draft pick in the first wave of college players who reached the NHL, would never have dreamed of. Bottom line for me is that I appreciated JVR's skills but I loved Gould's grit and sense of the big time moment.
    Last edited by Greg Ambrose; 11-15-2017 at 11:21 AM.

  19. #799
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    Quote Originally Posted by UNHSince1969 View Post
    How are we looking on the injury front for Friday night? I know lots have been out but not sure of their status near-term!
    According to our good friend C-H-C on Twitter coach Umile reports Marcus Vela and Charlie Kelleher will skate Friday. BvR uncertain. Shane Eiserman still out and joining him with an injury is Joe Sacco.

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    Re: UNH Wildcats-The Back Nine and Beyond!

    Quote Originally Posted by Greg Ambrose View Post
    Since I watched them both, I'd say that Gould had the better collegiate career, JVR the better pro one. Perhaps if JVR had spent four years at UNH he would have surpassed Gould, although BG was a big game player and I never got the sense that JVR was. And please don't overlook the fact that JVR was the second pick in the draft. Because of it he was afforded opportunities at the pro level that Gould, who was a lowly draft pick in the first wave of college players who reached the NHL, would never have dreamed of. Bottom line for me is that I appreciated JVR's skills but I loved Gould's grit and sense of the big time moment.
    This sounds like an excellent assessment to me. I am really sorry that I missed seeing all of these great UNH players in the mid- to late-70s, including Bobby Gould. I did catch a couple of post-season games on TV from Colorado, but that was about it.

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