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Business, Economics & Tax Policy 5.0: Can a blind nut find a squirrel?

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  • #76
    Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 5.0: Can a blind nut find a squirrel?

    Originally posted by Wisko McBadgerton View Post
    Unless the photo defames the woman, violates her right of publicity or invades her privacy, permission is not needed as far as I know. Why is it "a big no-no"?
    Twitter discourages, to help prevent bullying. The airline may have a policy against it, under some umbrella of obscure passenger safety rules.
    "The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." George Orwell, 1984

    "One does not simply walk into Mordor. Its Black Gates are guarded by more than just Orcs. There is evil there that does not sleep, and the Great Eye is ever watchful. It is a barren wasteland, riddled with fire and ash and dust, the very air you breathe is a poisonous fume." Boromir

    "Good news! We have a delivery." Professor Farnsworth

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    • #77
      Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 5.0: Can a blind nut find a squirrel?

      Originally posted by unofan View Post
      An airplane is not a public space, for one, so you can't claim the first amendment protects your right to photograph there. (If I invite you to come to my government office, that doesn't mean you get to take pictures of the non public portions of it.)

      I'm guessing airline rules/contract of carriage likely prohibit unauthorized photography.

      Considering the professional troll is essentially using the woman's image for marketing purposes, you could also argue misappropriation if she didn't get the woman's permission.
      Does having an substantial influence or harassing the person play into that?
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      • #78
        Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 5.0: Can a blind nut find a squirrel?

        A modest proposal.

        One seemingly simple policy could make the world twice as rich as it is: open borders.

        Workers become far more productive when they move from a poor country to a rich one. Suddenly, they can join a labour market with ample capital, efficient firms and a predictable legal system. Those who used to scrape a living from the soil with a wooden hoe start driving tractors. Those who once made mud bricks by hand start working with cranes and mechanical diggers. Those who cut hair find richer clients who tip better.

        “Labour is the world’s most valuable commodity—yet thanks to strict immigration regulation, most of it goes to waste,” argue Bryan Caplan and Vipul Naik in “A radical case for open borders”. Mexican labourers who migrate to the United States can expect to earn 150% more. Unskilled Nigerians make 1,000% more.

        “Making Nigerians stay in Nigeria is as economically senseless as making farmers plant in Antarctica,” argue Mr Caplan and Mr Naik. And the non-economic benefits are hardly trivial, either. A Nigerian in the United States cannot be enslaved by the Islamists of Boko Haram.

        The potential gains from open borders dwarf those of, say, completely free trade, let alone foreign aid. Yet the idea is everywhere treated as a fantasy. In most countries fewer than 10% of people favour it. In the era of Brexit and Donald Trump, it is a political non-starter. Nonetheless, it is worth asking what might happen if borders were, indeed, open.

        To clarify, “open borders” means that people are free to move to find work. It does not mean “no borders” or “the abolition of the nation-state”. On the contrary, the reason why migration is so attractive is that some countries are well-run and others, abysmally so.

        Workers in rich countries earn more than those in poor countries partly because they are better educated but mostly because they live in societies that have, over many years, developed institutions that foster prosperity and peace. It is very hard to transfer Canadian institutions to Cambodia, but quite straightforward for a Cambodian family to fly to Canada. The quickest way to eliminate absolute poverty would be to allow people to leave the places where it persists. Their poverty would thus become more visible to citizens of the rich world—who would see many more Liberians and Bangladeshis waiting tables and stacking shelves—but much less severe.
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        • #79
          Originally posted by unofan View Post
          An airplane is not a public space, for one, so you can't claim the first amendment protects your right to photograph there. (If I invite you to come to my government office, that doesn't mean you get to take pictures of the non public portions of it.)

          I'm guessing airline rules/contract of carriage likely prohibit unauthorized photography.

          Considering the professional troll is essentially using the woman's image for marketing purposes, you could also argue misappropriation if she didn't get the woman's permission.
          This. It's completely up to The Widget's corporate policies. They barred a particularly obnoxious (and possibly drunk) Trump voter for life, a handful of months back, after he antagonized the entire cabin.

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          • #80
            Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 5.0: Can a blind nut find a squirrel?

            Originally posted by unofan View Post
            An airplane is not a public space, for one, so you can't claim the first amendment protects your right to photograph there. (If I invite you to come to my government office, that doesn't mean you get to take pictures of the non public portions of it.)

            I'm guessing airline rules/contract of carriage likely prohibit unauthorized photography.

            Considering the professional troll is essentially using the woman's image for marketing purposes, you could also argue misappropriation if she didn't get the woman's permission.

            A plane may or may not technically be a public place but I thought this generally hinged on a person's reasonable expectation of privacy? You have it in your home, you may have some in your office, but I'm not seeing how a person has that expectation in a large airplane cabin full of strangers?


            I believe you are correct about the airlines rules. They may be able to stop you in the course of taking a picture, or even kick you off the plane when they see your do it, but I'd argue that unless they are fairly uniformly suspending passengers for taking any of the thousands of pictures I've seen published from inside of planes after the fact, they'd have a hard time suspending her over this one. I don't believe they can just arbitrarily apply their rules in that way.

            Misappropriation seems a stretch, but sure you can argue it. A lawyer can argue anything they can imaginate up with any chance at all of a given group of yokels buying into it!
            Originally posted by WiscTJK
            I'm with Wisko and Tim.
            Originally posted by Timothy A
            Other than Wisko McBadgerton and Badger Bob, who is universally loved by all?

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            • #81
              Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 5.0: Can a blind nut find a squirrel?

              Originally posted by Wisko McBadgerton View Post
              I believe you are correct about the airlines rules. They may be able to stop you in the course of taking a picture, or even kick you off the plane when they see your do it, but I'd argue that unless they are fairly uniformly suspending passengers for taking any of the thousands of pictures I've seen published from inside of planes after the fact, they'd have a hard time suspending her over this one. I don't believe they can just arbitrarily apply their rules in that way.

              Misappropriation seems a stretch, but sure you can argue it. A lawyer can argue anything they can imaginate up with any chance at all of a given group of yokels buying into it!
              Delta Air Lines is publicly-held, but ultimately a corporation. Yes, they can deny you service, as long as they aren't discriminating against a protected class, and Annie is a white female with a hypocritical persecution complex. You're just defending her because you're a conservative, and hate lawyers that don't agree with you.

              I know this is cited as a defense of those who can't defend their actual argument, but - "imaginate"? Really?

              EDIT: That's really a word? https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/imaginate

              Well then, I'll get off the grammar horse. The rest of my point, stands.

              And yeah, I'm a Delta loyalist. They've $%*$(%*ed me over a couple of times, but that's better than I can say for United or American. Sue me.
              Last edited by FadeToBlack&Gold; 07-17-2017, 10:28 PM.

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              • #82
                Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 5.0: Can a blind nut find a squirrel?

                Twitter had some great responses to Ann Coulter:

                http://www.salon.com/2017/07/17/delt...le-tweetstorm/
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                • #83
                  Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 5.0: Can a blind nut find a squirrel?


                  Comment


                  • #84
                    Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 5.0: Can a blind nut find a squirrel?

                    The pic, FWIW:

                    https://***********/AnnCoulter/statu...45961194348544

                    Of course, she got some brown-ish/Arabic-looking woman in "her" seat.

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                    • #85
                      Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 5.0: Can a blind nut find a squirrel?

                      Originally posted by FadeToBlack&Gold View Post
                      Delta Air Lines is publicly-held, but ultimately a corporation. Yes, they can deny you service, as long as they aren't discriminating against a protected class, and Annie is a white female with a hypocritical persecution complex. You're just defending her because you're a conservative, and hate lawyers that don't agree with you.

                      I know this is cited as a defense of those who can't defend their actual argument, but - "imaginate"? Really?

                      EDIT: That's really a word? https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/imaginate

                      Well then, I'll get off the grammar horse. The rest of my point, stands.

                      And yeah, I'm a Delta loyalist. They've $%*
                      $(%*ed me over a couple of times, but that's better than I can say for United or American. Sue me.
                      Everyone is a member of a protected class when it comes to discrimination. Age, sex, race, religion. You can't deny service to white males simply because they're white or male or both.

                      You can deny service with a reason, but that reason can't be arbitrarily applied. You said this:


                      Originally posted by FadeToBlack&Gold View Post
                      She also photographed the passenger who was assigned to sit in "her" seat, and posted it to Twitter without asking the woman's permission, which is a big no-no, and IMO that action should earn her a lifetime ban from the airline.

                      Unless the phrase "that action" is some sort of dangling modifier referring to something else ( and of course we've established your unfamiliarity with the English language, so it could it be, I suppose. ) I took it to mean that the action of photographing a person without permission and posting it should receive a lifetime ban. I don't believe it's illegal in this case and further, since Delta obviously hasn't banned countless other people who have taken and posted photos on their planes, I suggested that doing so here would be an arbitrary application of their rules. They may find reason within her subsequent actions, but I don't believe the one which you referred to can be it.

                      So I'm not defending AC because I like her (I was relatively unaware of the story beyond your post) or am conservative, (questionable) but rather because I enjoy pointing out when I think you are wrong.
                      Originally posted by WiscTJK
                      I'm with Wisko and Tim.
                      Originally posted by Timothy A
                      Other than Wisko McBadgerton and Badger Bob, who is universally loved by all?

                      Comment


                      • #86
                        Originally posted by Wisko McBadgerton View Post
                        Everyone is a member of a protected class when it comes to discrimination. Age, sex, race, religion. You can't deny service to white males simply because they're white or male or both.

                        You can deny service with a reason, but that reason can't be arbitrarily applied. You said this:





                        Unless the phrase "that action" is some sort of dangling modifier referring to something else ( and of course we've established your unfamiliarity with the English language, so it could it be, I suppose. ) I took it to mean that the action of photographing a person without permission and posting it should receive a lifetime ban. I don't believe it's illegal in this case and further, since Delta obviously hasn't banned countless other people who have taken and posted photos on their planes, I suggested that doing so here would be an arbitrary application of their rules. They may find reason within her subsequent actions, but I don't believe the one which you referred to can be it.

                        So I'm not defending AC because I like her (I was relatively unaware of the story beyond your post) or am conservative, (questionable) but rather because I enjoy pointing out when I think you are wrong.
                        You can deny service for any legal reason (which may be limited by the contract of carriage/FAA rules in this instance, which I do not know and don't comment on). You can't deny service to the professional troll because of her race or sex, but you can because you don't like her, or because she's a dead head, or because she wore tennis shoes, whatever.

                        Arbitrariness doesn't make it illegal per se. It may be evidence of an ulterior motive, but again, unless that motive is itself illegal, who cares.

                        Comment


                        • #87
                          Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 5.0: Can a blind nut find a squirrel?

                          Originally posted by unofan View Post
                          You can deny service for any legal reason (which may be limited by the contract of carriage/FAA rules in this instance, which I do not know and don't comment on). You can't deny service to the professional troll because of her race or sex, but you can because you don't like her, or because she's a dead head, or because she wore tennis shoes, whatever.

                          Arbitrariness doesn't make it illegal per se. It may be evidence of an ulterior motive, but again, unless that motive is itself illegal, who cares.
                          Ok, but if you use a reason that's arbitrary, in the inevitable lawsuit that follows you'll have a very hard time defending that as the actual reason. And you are wide open to any allegation of discrimination the plaintiff's attorney's can come up with. (imaginate!) So effectively, Delta is prevented from using an arbitrary reason unless they just want to be morons. They can say "We don't like you!" Banned!" And if that is the ultimate reason, then that is what they will say, not "She took a picture! Banned!"
                          Originally posted by WiscTJK
                          I'm with Wisko and Tim.
                          Originally posted by Timothy A
                          Other than Wisko McBadgerton and Badger Bob, who is universally loved by all?

                          Comment


                          • #88
                            Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 5.0: Can a blind nut find a squirrel?

                            What would you take from Home Depot if you could get away with it??

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                            • #89
                              Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 5.0: Can a blind nut find a squirrel?

                              The percentage of renters, when it comes to domiciles, is at a 50-year high. http://www.cnbc.com/2017/07/20/there...ince-1965.html

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                              • #90
                                Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 5.0: Can a blind nut find a squirrel?

                                Originally posted by FlagDUDE08 View Post
                                The percentage of renters, when it comes to domiciles, is at a 50-year high. http://www.cnbc.com/2017/07/20/there...ince-1965.html
                                The housing market can't sustain these prices. We're going to see another housing market correction - hopefully not a collapse.
                                "The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." George Orwell, 1984

                                "One does not simply walk into Mordor. Its Black Gates are guarded by more than just Orcs. There is evil there that does not sleep, and the Great Eye is ever watchful. It is a barren wasteland, riddled with fire and ash and dust, the very air you breathe is a poisonous fume." Boromir

                                "Good news! We have a delivery." Professor Farnsworth

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