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The PPACA Thread Part V: Doctor! Doctor! Give me the news!

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  • Re: The PPACA Thread Part V: Doctor! Doctor! Give me the news!

    Originally posted by Kepler View Post
    Interesting. Read the whole thing, but the tl; dr is McConnell, Paul, Cruz and Cornyn seem to be on board with a complete end run where they pass an intentionally anodyne, non-implementable gimmick just to get to conference committee. The real decisions -- the ones that actually will force them to deal with the hard stuff -- will then be postponed until conference committee, so they can announce with fanfare that they've passed a Senate version even though they haven't actually accomplished anything.

    They'll still have to face all the hard work they ought to have been doing now, but they'll have kicked the can down the road just a little farther, and they'll have cleared the docket so they can get to the Great Treasury Robbery of their tax cut.
    Stalling is an even worse idea because it prolongs the story. The only way this was going to work was to get it through fast the longer they delay the more people learn and get mad.
    "It's as if the Drumpf Administration is made up of the worst and unfunny parts of the Cleveland Browns, Washington Generals, and the alien Mon-Stars from Space Jam."
    -aparch

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    • Re: The PPACA Thread Part V: Doctor! Doctor! Give me the news!

      Originally posted by Kepler View Post
      It's not weird, it's the standard way a legislature works. You make a motion to proceed to bring the bill to the floor for a vote. It's loading the chamber before you can fire the gun, or moving to the line of scrimmage before snapping the ball.
      Sure, and that's fine. It's just more wimpiness from our representatives in Congress. They avoid votes on things entirely by preventing them from coming to the floor in the first place.

      Originally posted by Handyman View Post
      Stalling is an even worse idea because it prolongs the story. The only way this was going to work was to get it through fast the longer they delay the more people learn and get mad.
      True, but it allows them to move on to tax cuts for the rich.
      **NOTE: The misleading post above was brought to you by Reynold's Wrap and American Steeples, makers of Crosses.

      Originally Posted by dropthatpuck-Scooby's a lost cause.
      Originally Posted by First Time, Long Time-Always knew you were nothing but a troll.

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      • Re: The PPACA Thread Part V: Doctor! Doctor! Give me the news!

        Originally posted by ScoobyDoo View Post


        True, but it allows them to move on to tax cuts for the rich.
        I am not sure it does...this isnt going away just because they pass a piece of crap legislation because they then need to deal with it in committee. They wont get to move on to Tax Cuts until they pass this completely.
        "It's as if the Drumpf Administration is made up of the worst and unfunny parts of the Cleveland Browns, Washington Generals, and the alien Mon-Stars from Space Jam."
        -aparch

        "Scenes in "Empire Strikes Back" that take place on the tundra planet Hoth were shot on the present-day site of Ralph Engelstad Arena."
        -INCH

        Of course I'm a fan of the Vikings. A sick and demented Masochist of a fan, but a fan none the less.
        -ScoobyDoo 12/17/2007

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        • Re: The PPACA Thread Part V: Doctor! Doctor! Give me the news!

          Originally posted by Handyman View Post
          I am not sure it does...this isnt going away just because they pass a piece of crap legislation because they then need to deal with it in committee. They wont get to move on to Tax Cuts until they pass this completely.
          We'll see. If they let this languish in committee and fast track the tax cuts they might be able to pull it off.
          **NOTE: The misleading post above was brought to you by Reynold's Wrap and American Steeples, makers of Crosses.

          Originally Posted by dropthatpuck-Scooby's a lost cause.
          Originally Posted by First Time, Long Time-Always knew you were nothing but a troll.

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          • Re: The PPACA Thread Part V: Doctor! Doctor! Give me the news!

            It's on. Turtle Boy has started the process of destroying Health Care. Many places to watch live. Facebook, Youtube, CSPAN.
            **NOTE: The misleading post above was brought to you by Reynold's Wrap and American Steeples, makers of Crosses.

            Originally Posted by dropthatpuck-Scooby's a lost cause.
            Originally Posted by First Time, Long Time-Always knew you were nothing but a troll.

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            • Re: The PPACA Thread Part V: Doctor! Doctor! Give me the news!

              Originally posted by ScoobyDoo View Post
              It's on. Turtle Boy has started the process of destroying Health Care. Many places to watch live. Facebook, Youtube, CSPAN.
              No: Collins.
              Yes: Capito, Cruz, Heller, Portman, Paul.
              No comment yet: Johnson, Moran, Murkowski, Lee.

              Motion to proceed will pass
              Last edited by bronconick; 07-25-2017, 01:32 PM.
              "I went over the facts in my head, and admired how much uglier the situation had just become. Over the years I've learned that ignorance is more than just bliss. It's freaking orgasmic ecstasy".- Harry Dresden, Blood Rites


              Western Michigan Bronco Hockey- 2012 Mason Cup Champions

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              • Re: The PPACA Thread Part V: Doctor! Doctor! Give me the news!

                Originally posted by ScoobyDoo View Post
                We'll see. If they let this languish in committee and fast track the tax cuts they might be able to pull it off.
                My understanding is they can't pass the tax cuts by reconciliation if they have not already passed the Medicaid cuts, because to use reconciliation you have to be revenue neutral and the cuts offset the giveaway of revenue to the rich.

                This is cutting poor people's health insurance to give the super rich more money. That's all this is. But if they do the latter without the former they will need 60 votes. The only way around that is if they change cloture on everything to 50+, and a large majority of Senators of both parties are against that.
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                • Re: The PPACA Thread Part V: Doctor! Doctor! Give me the news!

                  Originally posted by Kepler View Post
                  My understanding is they can't pass the tax cuts by reconciliation if they have not already passed the Medicaid cuts, because to use reconciliation you have to be revenue neutral and the cuts offset the giveaway of revenue to the rich.

                  This is cutting poor people's health insurance to give the super rich more money. That's all this is. But if they do the latter without the former they will need 60 votes. The only way around that is if they change cloture on everything to 50+, and a large majority of Senators of both parties are against that.
                  That's true. You're correct. My bad.

                  I can't believe this passed to the floor. Holy Crap.
                  **NOTE: The misleading post above was brought to you by Reynold's Wrap and American Steeples, makers of Crosses.

                  Originally Posted by dropthatpuck-Scooby's a lost cause.
                  Originally Posted by First Time, Long Time-Always knew you were nothing but a troll.

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                  • Re: The PPACA Thread Part V: Doctor! Doctor! Give me the news!

                    If you're all wondering what happens after conference committee, I was too.

                    Most times, the conference committee produces a conference report melding the work of the House and Senate into a final version of the bill. A conference report proposes legislative language as an amendment to the bill committed to conference. The conference report also includes a joint explanatory statement of the conference committee. This statement provides one of the best sources of legislative history on the bill. Chief Justice William Rehnquist once observed that the joint conference report of both Houses of Congress is considered highly reliable legislative history when interpreting a statute.

                    Once a bill has been passed by a conference committee, it goes directly to the floor of both houses for a vote, and is not open to further amendment. In the first house to consider the conference report, a Member may move to recommit the bill to the conference committee. But once the first house has passed the conference report, the conference committee is dissolved, and the second house to act can no longer recommit the bill to conference.

                    Conference reports are privileged. In the Senate, a motion to proceed to a conference report is not debatable, although Senators can generally filibuster the conference report itself. The Congressional Budget Act of 1974 limits debate on conference reports on budget resolutions and budget reconciliation bills to ten hours in the Senate, so Senators cannot filibuster those conference reports.
                    They are doing all this under reconciliation to avoid the 60. That was what eventually killed the Senate version; the Parliamentarian found about a dozen violations of the reconciliation criteria. So they have to somehow come up with a bill that will pass the moderates in the Senate, the nutbars in the House, and still stay under reconciliation according to the Parliamentarian, and cut enough people from health insurance to pay for their tax cut for the rich which is the only purpose of this whole charade, all in the teeth of enormous public opposition and in the shadow of the drunkard's walk of Trump.

                    Good luck.
                    Last edited by Kepler; 07-25-2017, 02:01 PM.
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                    • Re: The PPACA Thread Part V: Doctor! Doctor! Give me the news!

                      Is the current motion to process for proceed to debate or proceed to vote?

                      Cornell '04, Stanford '06


                      KDR

                      Rover Frenchy, Classic! Great post.
                      iwh30 I wish I could be as smart as you. I really do you are the man
                      gregg729 I just saw your sig, you do love having people revel in your "intelligence."
                      Ritt18 you are the perfect representation of your alma mater.
                      Miss Thundercat That's it, you win.
                      TBA#2 I want to kill you and dance in your blood.
                      DisplacedCornellian Hahaha. Thread over. Frenchy wins.

                      Test to see if I can add this.

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                      • Re: The PPACA Thread Part V: Doctor! Doctor! Give me the news!

                        Originally posted by Kepler View Post
                        If you're all wondering what happens after conference committee, I was too.



                        They are doing all this under reconciliation to avoid the 60. That was what eventually killed the Senate version; the Parliamentarian found about a dozen violations of the reconciliation criteria. So they have to somehow come up with a bill that will pass the moderates in the Senate, the nutbars in the House, and still stay under reconciliation according to the Parliamentarian, and cut enough people from health insurance to pay for their tax cut for the rich which is the only purpose of this whole charade, all in the teeth of enormous public opposition and in the shadow of the drunkard's walk of Trump.

                        Good luck.
                        ..or they cut out the Parliamentarian
                        "I went over the facts in my head, and admired how much uglier the situation had just become. Over the years I've learned that ignorance is more than just bliss. It's freaking orgasmic ecstasy".- Harry Dresden, Blood Rites


                        Western Michigan Bronco Hockey- 2012 Mason Cup Champions

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                        • Re: The PPACA Thread Part V: Doctor! Doctor! Give me the news!

                          Originally posted by French Rage View Post
                          Is the current motion to process for proceed to debate or proceed to vote?
                          Proceed to debate I believe. They said they would allow amendments, etc. We'll see.
                          **NOTE: The misleading post above was brought to you by Reynold's Wrap and American Steeples, makers of Crosses.

                          Originally Posted by dropthatpuck-Scooby's a lost cause.
                          Originally Posted by First Time, Long Time-Always knew you were nothing but a troll.

                          Comment


                          • Re: The PPACA Thread Part V: Doctor! Doctor! Give me the news!

                            Originally posted by French Rage View Post
                            Is the current motion to process for proceed to debate or proceed to vote?
                            My understanding is it's a motion to proceed to consider, which means debate. Under reconciliation cloture is triggered automatically after ten hours of debate after which they proceed directly to the vote, so this is the equivalent of passing the bill unless somebody actually changes their vote during the debate which doesn't happen because nobody in the history of any legislature has ever listened to the debate, even when they themselves are speaking. That's strictly a show for the rubes. The cynical threats and bribes, er, I mean intellectually and morally robust negotiations have already happened by the time of the motion to proceed.
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                            • Re: The PPACA Thread Part V: Doctor! Doctor! Give me the news!

                              Budget Reconciliation Act just passed 51/50.
                              **NOTE: The misleading post above was brought to you by Reynold's Wrap and American Steeples, makers of Crosses.

                              Originally Posted by dropthatpuck-Scooby's a lost cause.
                              Originally Posted by First Time, Long Time-Always knew you were nothing but a troll.

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                              • Re: The PPACA Thread Part V: Doctor! Doctor! Give me the news!

                                Originally posted by ScoobyDoo View Post
                                Proceed to debate I believe. They said they would allow amendments, etc. We'll see.
                                The amendment schedule is controlled by the majority leadership -- they'll only allow votes on what they want. The only real power the minority has is the threat of filibuster which is nullified under reconciliation.
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                                ECAC Champion 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1973, 1980, 1986, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2005, 2010
                                Ivy League Champion 1966, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1977, 1978, 1983, 1984, 1985, 1996, 1997, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2012, 2014, 2018, 2019, 2020

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