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Thread: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

  1. #101
    Old Dirty Basterd Shirtless Guy's Avatar
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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Quote Originally Posted by bigblue_dl View Post
    Abandon the "national tournament" for the regionals. Rank the "east" 1-8, rank the "west" 1-8, and have 2 regionals in the east, since that works. In the west, have a super regional, with 8 teams, to determine the 2 west teams going to the F4. This can be done permanently in MSP, at either the X or TC, or rotating between the 2. Of course, the NCAA won't don this.
    I do think there is value to that and that Western regionals would do better if we knew that each would be full of 4 western teams vs what we have now...obviously I don't see the super regional happening.
    Michigan Tech Legend, Founder of Mitch's Misfits...Posted by Yager on 12/18/09: Remember, remember, the 18th of October (2003).

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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Shirtless Guy View Post
    I do think there is value to that and that Western regionals would do better if we knew that each would be full of 4 western teams vs what we have now...obviously I don't see the super regional happening.
    But what if BOTH The X and Target Center were used, with 4 teams at each?! At least the plan couldn't be immediately torpedoed by militant trainers & equipment managers.

    OK, I agree that a Super Regional of 6-8 teams isn't happening. But it is a fun thought.

    Before completely letting go of the idea, I will point out that the "travel certainty" would have real value for Western fans. Suppose that from Day 1 you know you're a Western team, AND that if you qualify for the NCAA tournament it's 100% certain you'll be sent to the Twin Cities. Suddenly planning a trip to the regionals isn't nearly as ridiculous as it is now. You can lock in flights and hotel rooms far in advance, and create a halfway affordable trip.

    Of course there's the obvious risk that your team won't qualify for the tournament. Want to improve the odds of a successful trip by waiting? Even if a travel decision is made only three weeks in advance, you're in much better shape than with the four days that are currently available. By the three week mark, many of the at-large teams have a pretty good idea of who they are. In contrast, the status quo gives those same "confident frontrunners" only a 1 of 4 chance of correctly predicting their destination.

  3. #103
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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Quote Originally Posted by pgb-ohio View Post
    But what if BOTH The X and Target Center were used, with 4 teams at each?! At least the plan couldn't be immediately torpedoed by militant trainers & equipment managers.

    OK, I agree that a Super Regional of 6-8 teams isn't happening. But it is a fun thought.

    Before completely letting go of the idea, I will point out that the "travel certainty" would have real value for Western fans. Suppose that from Day 1 you know you're a Western team, AND that if you qualify for the NCAA tournament it's 100% certain you'll be sent to the Twin Cities. Suddenly planning a trip to the regionals isn't nearly as ridiculous as it is now. You can lock in flights and hotel rooms far in advance, and create a halfway affordable trip.

    Of course there's the obvious risk that your team won't qualify for the tournament. Want to improve the odds of a successful trip by waiting? Even if a travel decision is made only three weeks in advance, you're in much better shape than with the four days that are currently available. By the three week mark, many of the at-large teams have a pretty good idea of who they are. In contrast, the status quo gives those same "confident frontrunners" only a 1 of 4 chance of correctly predicting their destination.
    I think there would be a ton of value in creating something like that. but to take a step back, if Target Center was interested in doing a regional, I think you could do a lot to fix the west by having a UND, Target Center, Xcel, Madison? rotation. I know that closes out everyone east of lake michigan but...idk
    If you had Xcel/Target Center alternating years and UND, the 4th could be a wildcard kinda like it is in the east with Manchester, Worcester, and Providence.
    Michigan Tech Legend, Founder of Mitch's Misfits...Posted by Yager on 12/18/09: Remember, remember, the 18th of October (2003).

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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Quote Originally Posted by pgb-ohio View Post
    But what if BOTH The X and Target Center were used, with 4 teams at each?! At least the plan couldn't be immediately torpedoed by militant trainers & equipment managers.

    OK, I agree that a Super Regional of 6-8 teams isn't happening. But it is a fun thought.

    Before completely letting go of the idea, I will point out that the "travel certainty" would have real value for Western fans. Suppose that from Day 1 you know you're a Western team, AND that if you qualify for the NCAA tournament it's 100% certain you'll be sent to the Twin Cities. Suddenly planning a trip to the regionals isn't nearly as ridiculous as it is now. You can lock in flights and hotel rooms far in advance, and create a halfway affordable trip.

    Of course there's the obvious risk that your team won't qualify for the tournament. Want to improve the odds of a successful trip by waiting? Even if a travel decision is made only three weeks in advance, you're in much better shape than with the four days that are currently available. By the three week mark, many of the at-large teams have a pretty good idea of who they are. In contrast, the status quo gives those same "confident frontrunners" only a 1 of 4 chance of correctly predicting their destination.
    There is an issue with the Target Center hosting. Depending on the weekend, the Target Center is already booked as it hosts the MSHSL Boys Basketball Tournament on Wed-Sat. There may be years when the tourney is earlier but for the next couple of years it is the last High School tourney and Willliams Arena(Minnesota Basketball Arena)doesn't want the boys tourney but doesn't mind the GBB tourney Also Penn St is the host of the Allentown Regional. The Big 10 is considered a "western league". The other 5(soon to be 6) members were in Western Leagues before the Big 10 formed.

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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    re: duties of the Regional Host

    pgb, thanks for your response. My question was a real question, not a challenge. I’m genuinely curious about what hosting involves and what the “sweat equity” includes. I don’t have any experience at all, only observations and assumptions from a distance.

    For many years, BU was the host at Worcester. Now I understood why BU might do this; it was a big advantage for BU to pretty much control where they went if they made the tournament, which BU generally did, and hockey is the “big dog” at BU. Then I noticed that Holy Cross began hosting, and that was less understandable to me. Other than one David and Goliath moment, Holy Cross has pretty much been a non-entity hockey-wise, and basketball is the big sport there; there’s no hockey equivalent to Bob Cousy and Tommy Heinsohn. If Holy Cross does make the tournament and gets to play in Worcester, it’s highly probable that they’ll play a high seed that’s fairly local and has a bigger fan base, so the home ice advantage isn’t significant.

    Both BU and Holy Cross have significantly smaller athletic departments than B1G schools, significantly fewer alumni, and significantly lower profile athletic programs. So it seemed to me that if it involved significant effort and/or expense and/or recruiting significant numbers of volunteers, it would be of questionable value for BU to host and a poor investment for Holy Cross. So I assumed that hosting at Worcester was at most a modest effort for the host school and that the venue did most of the work.

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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Quote Originally Posted by paulsonj72 View Post
    There is an issue with the Target Center hosting. Depending on the weekend, the Target Center is already booked as it hosts the MSHSL Boys Basketball Tournament on Wed-Sat. There may be years when the tourney is earlier but for the next couple of years it is the last High School tourney and Willliams Arena(Minnesota Basketball Arena)doesn't want the boys tourney but doesn't mind the GBB tourney Also Penn St is the host of the Allentown Regional. The Big 10 is considered a "western league". The other 5(soon to be 6) members were in Western Leagues before the Big 10 formed.
    Say whatever you want but I don't think Air Force will ever host an eastern regional in Colorado. We understand what happen with Allentown but its just crazy to most of us.
    Michigan Tech Legend, Founder of Mitch's Misfits...Posted by Yager on 12/18/09: Remember, remember, the 18th of October (2003).

    Sports Allegiance: NFL: GB MLB: MIL NHL: MIN CB: UW CF: UW CH: MTU FIFA: USA MLS: MIN EPL: Everton

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    2009 NCAA Champions Sean Pickett's Avatar
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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Quote Originally Posted by CLS View Post
    re: duties of the Regional Host

    pgb, thanks for your response. My question was a real question, not a challenge. I’m genuinely curious about what hosting involves and what the “sweat equity” includes. I don’t have any experience at all, only observations and assumptions from a distance.

    For many years, BU was the host at Worcester. Now I understood why BU might do this; it was a big advantage for BU to pretty much control where they went if they made the tournament, which BU generally did, and hockey is the “big dog” at BU. Then I noticed that Holy Cross began hosting, and that was less understandable to me. Other than one David and Goliath moment, Holy Cross has pretty much been a non-entity hockey-wise, and basketball is the big sport there; there’s no hockey equivalent to Bob Cousy and Tommy Heinsohn. If Holy Cross does make the tournament and gets to play in Worcester, it’s highly probable that they’ll play a high seed that’s fairly local and has a bigger fan base, so the home ice advantage isn’t significant.

    Both BU and Holy Cross have significantly smaller athletic departments than B1G schools, significantly fewer alumni, and significantly lower profile athletic programs. So it seemed to me that if it involved significant effort and/or expense and/or recruiting significant numbers of volunteers, it would be of questionable value for BU to host and a poor investment for Holy Cross. So I assumed that hosting at Worcester was at most a modest effort for the host school and that the venue did most of the work.
    As I understand it when BU hosted at the DCU Center they ran the show like pgb has said. It is a big investment in people and time and that is one of the reasons BU hosts fewer events now (the women's 2020 FF will be the first event BU has hosted since the women's 2009 FF). As for hosting the regional in Worcester, as I recall the mayor spoke up and basically said he wanted Holy Cross to host and with the school making the tournament in 2004 they agreed. I know nothing of the agreement between the two, but it's possible that part of the agreement between them is that the DCU Center does most of the work, not the school.

    Sean
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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    The DCU Center is owned by the city of Worcester and the mayor said that since Worcester already has a Div I school in the city (Holy Cross), they will be the host whenever the tourney is there. I don't know if that guy is still mayor or if that could change if he wasn't in office.

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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Have a western University step up, make a bid and provide the following requirements. You should be complaining to the Universities, Colleges and Cities that did not bid.
    HOST INSTITUTION/CONFERENCE AND/OR SPONSORING AGENCY PROVIDES:
    1. Facilities.
    2. Key personnel and all other volunteers.
    3. Public relations coordination.
    4. First aid/medical services/AED on-site/ambulance on-site.
    5. Championships hospitality.
    6. Food/beverage concessions.
    7. Public address system, scoreboard, video board and production crew.
    8. Support personnel – ushers, ticket takers, media runners, etc.
    9. Security.
    10. Media room (fully equipped).
    11. Media seating/work area with constant refreshments.
    12. Tickets.
    13. All computers, printers, fax machines, video equipment, photocopy machines, telephone lines, DSL lines, etc.
    necessary to administer the championships, and as may be required by the NCAA.
    14. Appropriate directional signage within and outside the venue.
    15. Off-ice officials.
    16. Other items as later requested by the NCAA.
    17. Athletic training staff.
    18. Dasher boards clean of any advertising/signage.
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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    BTW, I still have no idea why Fairfield U is a co-host with Yale for Bridgeport in Sacred Hearts home rink. Not the first time either.
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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    I think item #16 on that list is hookers and coke, but don't quote me lol.
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    Quote Originally Posted by LTsatch View Post
    I think item #16 on that list is hookers and coke, but don't quote me lol.
    Coke is an NCAA champion.

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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Sean, Scarlet, and LT, thanks.

    It seems to me that a lot of the things on the list could be provided by the venue, so hosting could entail a wide range of effort. And in the Worcester case, if the city owns the venue, they could very well give HC a lot of assistance.

  14. #114
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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Quote Originally Posted by pgb-ohio View Post
    But what if BOTH The X and Target Center were used, with 4 teams at each?! At least the plan couldn't be immediately torpedoed by militant trainers & equipment managers.

    OK, I agree that a Super Regional of 6-8 teams isn't happening. But it is a fun thought.

    Before completely letting go of the idea, I will point out that the "travel certainty" would have real value for Western fans. Suppose that from Day 1 you know you're a Western team, AND that if you qualify for the NCAA tournament it's 100% certain you'll be sent to the Twin Cities. Suddenly planning a trip to the regionals isn't nearly as ridiculous as it is now. You can lock in flights and hotel rooms far in advance, and create a halfway affordable trip.

    Of course there's the obvious risk that your team won't qualify for the tournament. Want to improve the odds of a successful trip by waiting? Even if a travel decision is made only three weeks in advance, you're in much better shape than with the four days that are currently available. By the three week mark, many of the at-large teams have a pretty good idea of who they are. In contrast, the status quo gives those same "confident frontrunners" only a 1 of 4 chance of correctly predicting their destination.
    If there was a permanent 8 team west regional in MSP, you'd start to rebuild the Final 5 event atmosphere that was torpedoed by the Big 10 and UND.
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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Doesn't the MSHSL use both the Target and X around tbat time for basketball or wrestling?

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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Quote Originally Posted by bigblue_dl View Post
    If there was a permanent 8 team west regional in MSP, you'd start to rebuild the Final 5 event atmosphere that was torpedoed by the Big 10 and UND.
    I do find it a bit ironic that Michigan Tech fans get so upset about conference realignment when their program not once, but twice torpedoed its conference for what it perceived as greener pastures.
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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Fighting Sioux 23 View Post
    I do find it a bit ironic that Michigan Tech fans get so upset about conference realignment when their program not once, but twice torpedoed its conference for what it perceived as greener pastures.
    When did MTU ever leave the WCHA?

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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Ralph Baer View Post
    When did MTU ever leave the WCHA?
    Michigan Tech abandoned the WCHA following the 1980-1981 season to go to the CCHA. The Huskies then left the CCHA high and dry following the 1983-1984 season to head back to the WCHA.
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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Ralph Baer View Post
    When did MTU ever leave the WCHA?
    Tech, Michigan State, Michigan and Notre Dame all left the WCHA for the CCHA in 1981. Tech returned to the WCHA in 1984, bringing along NMU.

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  20. #120
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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Sean Pickett View Post
    Tech, Michigan State, Michigan and Notre Dame all left the WCHA for the CCHA in 1981. Tech returned to the WCHA in 1984, bringing along NMU.

    Sean
    I had forgotten that MTU left then.
    Last edited by Ralph Baer; 04-23-2017 at 03:27 PM. Reason: typo

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