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Thread: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

  1. #21
    Kichizapi Chetan
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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    The NCAA has stated a preference for off-campus, non home rink, sites.

    If you bid with your home rink, you're rolling the dice that the local youth commission doesn't bid with the outdoor rink in the park (that has hillside "seating").
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  2. #22
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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Quote Originally Posted by The Sicatoka View Post
    Do we know who all bid for West and Midwest?

    There are claims on another board that some schools bid but with their on-campus/home rink.
    Brad's tweet seems to suggest there might have been some on-campus bids.
    That community is already in the process of dissolution where each man begins to eye his neighbor as a possible enemy, where non-conformity with the accepted creed, political as well as religious, is a mark of disaffection; where denunciation, without specification or backing, takes the place of evidence; where orthodoxy chokes freedom of dissent; where faith in the eventual supremacy of reason has become so timid that we dare not enter our convictions in the open lists, to win or lose.

  3. #23
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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Quote Originally Posted by UML Puck Hawk View Post
    Humourously Lowell and BU could bid for their home arena's to host, as neither is legally "on campus"
    Duluth doesn't play on campus, but the DECC is their home rink and home rinks are not preferred.
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  4. #24
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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    This year the hosts would've been Denver, Duluth, Harvard, and Minnesota if the top four hosted.
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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Quote Originally Posted by UML Puck Hawk View Post
    I understand his issues, I am simply pointing out the obvious answer which might hurt his feelings. Notre Dame got to host at Compton 2 years ago. Nothing is stopping Duluth from bidding for a home regional, I would bet good money (or beer) that they would have received it had they bid. The NCAA must abhor the idea of allowing schools to host in back to back years (3 years now for NoDak), it makes them look bush-league.

    To answer your second question, for 2017 I would guess about 150 Lowell fans would go to Denver for a regional because they could make a vacation out of it. And similar numbers plus a student trip with about 80 students at discounted rates for the FF. So about 150-200 at the regional, 300 at the FF
    I think Sic is right. Notre Dame hosted because no one else bid an off-campus site. Since then I think North Dakota has taken the position they'd just as soon bid Fargo and Sioux Falls rather than bid Grand Forks and run the risk Xcel or some other off campus site bids.
    That community is already in the process of dissolution where each man begins to eye his neighbor as a possible enemy, where non-conformity with the accepted creed, political as well as religious, is a mark of disaffection; where denunciation, without specification or backing, takes the place of evidence; where orthodoxy chokes freedom of dissent; where faith in the eventual supremacy of reason has become so timid that we dare not enter our convictions in the open lists, to win or lose.

  6. #26
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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Quote Originally Posted by SJHovey View Post
    I think Sic is right. Notre Dame hosted because no one else bid an off-campus site. Since then I think North Dakota has taken the position they'd just as soon bid Fargo and Sioux Falls rather than bid Grand Forks and run the risk Xcel or some other off campus site bids.
    Yup, Notre Dame hosted at Compton because they were the only bid.

    I suspect UND is throwing in a Scheels (Fargo)/Sanford ("Hawks" Falls) bid to ward off having to play a "regional" in the DECC or Baxter or Magness or ...

    And it worked.


    However, I'd bet UND threw in "2018 in Sanford" ... and "2018 in REA" just in case the NCAA had a fit of sanity.
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  7. #27
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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Caustic Undertow View Post
    A lot of schools would love to host, but the NCAA won't host at home sites, only near-home sites, and charges outrageous ticket prices on top of that. There's little question to me that places like UMD, Michigan, Wisconsin, et al could be interested if they were allowed to host at home. Alas, they want neutral sites that also sell well.

    Eastern people don't see a problem with this because all of the regionals are two hours or less from a dozen schools including almost the entirety of whole conferences. Things work differently out west, a constituency that consists of half the sport and should be respected. They find a neutral site somewhere that's close to nobody, host games there, and charge outrageous prices for inferior products. And I say that as someone who has actually spent significant money to take my family to a regional hours away from home.

    The obvious, logical answer is to host the first two rounds at the home sites of the higher seed, as they do in many NCAA sports. Worried about home crowds? No problem, make them earned. Your boys can host a game or two at Tsongas, a surprise high seed out of the WCHA (like Mankato a couple of years ago) gets to expose its fans to real playoff hockey instead of sending them to Indiana, North Dakota can host at the Ralph instead of dummy not-quite-home locations nearby. More fans come, the product is better, everybody is happy.

    But as long as the Boston-area folks are happy, you know, the sport must be ok.
    You had me till your last sentence. I have some delectable cheese to serve you with that whine. Here's another one....build a bridge and get over yourself. The NCAA is trying to do a one-size fits all model for NCAA Championships. With regards to hockey, this serves the East a lot better than the West. It also means that there are more all-purpose arenas (read: neutral sites) in the East. Answer me this (not just you - all readers here) - are your college arenas that are all the perfect size for regionals used for anything other than college sports? For example - Agganis Arena is a popular concert venue here in Boston. Do concerts come to campus because that's where the venues are?

    The West is always an issue because everything is so far apart. I don't even see what good putting the games on campus sites is going to do. And if they go back to including campus sites, they will have to be treated as neutral sites, meaning same number of allotted tickets that all the other schools get. And honestly, they shouldn't even get the benefit of staying if they make the tournament. But then, the crying will start all over again I suppose.

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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Quote Originally Posted by The Sicatoka View Post
    Yup, Notre Dame hosted at Compton because they were the only bid.

    I suspect UND is throwing in a Scheels (Fargo)/Sanford ("Hawks" Falls) bid to ward off having to play a "regional" in the DECC or Baxter or Magness or ...

    And it worked.


    However, I'd bet UND threw in "2018 in Sanford" ... and "2018 in REA" just in case the NCAA had a fit of sanity.
    I'm going to be shocked if UND doesn't bid to host every single year in either Fargo or Sioux Falls, assuming they can sell out Sioux Falls like they do Fargo. They'd be crazy not to. Not only do they block any possibility of playing in the home rinks of Minnesota or Omaha or Duluth or Wisconsin, they basically block ever having to travel at all beyond the border of the Dakotas, since they are a host school.

    I'd keep doing it until the NCAA changes their format. They're either going to have to get rid of the preference for off-campus sites, or get rid of the regional format once and for all. Sooner or later enough eastern schools will have to come out to the Dakotas to play a #3 or #4 seeded North Dakota to get a critical mass to change the system.
    That community is already in the process of dissolution where each man begins to eye his neighbor as a possible enemy, where non-conformity with the accepted creed, political as well as religious, is a mark of disaffection; where denunciation, without specification or backing, takes the place of evidence; where orthodoxy chokes freedom of dissent; where faith in the eventual supremacy of reason has become so timid that we dare not enter our convictions in the open lists, to win or lose.

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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Quote Originally Posted by SJHovey View Post
    I'd keep doing it until the NCAA changes their format. They're either going to have to get rid of the preference for off-campus sites, or get rid of the regional format once and for all. Sooner or later enough eastern schools will have to come out to the Dakotas to play a #3 or #4 seeded North Dakota to get a critical mass to change the system.
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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Quote Originally Posted by UML Puck Hawk View Post
    BU this year...
    Yep.

    Sometimes they'll come out and win. Most of the time they won't. It'll just take enough teams, and the right teams, to whine about it.
    That community is already in the process of dissolution where each man begins to eye his neighbor as a possible enemy, where non-conformity with the accepted creed, political as well as religious, is a mark of disaffection; where denunciation, without specification or backing, takes the place of evidence; where orthodoxy chokes freedom of dissent; where faith in the eventual supremacy of reason has become so timid that we dare not enter our convictions in the open lists, to win or lose.

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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Quote Originally Posted by UML Puck Hawk View Post
    Humourously Lowell and BU could bid for their home arena's to host, as neither is legally "on campus"
    Agganis is absolutely on BU's campus. It's surrounded by two BU dorms and BU's fitness facility. That said, it's not about whether the site is on the campus, it has to do with how many "home games" are played at the facility during the regular season that determines whether a rink considered a team's home rink for the purposes of NCAA tournament play. In basketball, Villanova got around this when the East regional was held in Philly at the Flyers/76ers arena (where VU usually plays 5-6 home games per year) by only scheduling three home games that season, below the NCAA's threshold, and were able to play in that region. They went back to scheduling 5-6 games there the following year. Dumb setup.

    I agree this regional problem would be fixed by going on campus, but I do not agree the NCAA is simply catering to the eastern teams. If there aren't bids out west, absent making the rule changes we're advocating, they go with the sites they have.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Sicatoka View Post
    Duluth doesn't play on campus, but the DECC is their home rink and home rinks are not preferred.
    I'd almost ask that at this point "home" rinks should be allowed but possibly with caveat that the normal home team couldn't host.

    The idea you can't find a venue in minnesota is nutty-nuts

  13. #33
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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Patman View Post
    I'd almost ask that at this point "home" rinks should be allowed but possibly with caveat that the normal home team couldn't host.

    The idea you can't find a venue in minnesota is nutty-nuts
    So Bemidji State bids to host at the DECC (UMD) or NHC (SCSU) or REA (UND)?
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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Quote Originally Posted by brassbonanza View Post
    Agganis is absolutely on BU's campus. It's surrounded by two BU dorms and BU's fitness facility.
    My understanding was it was not, cited as the reason you were still allowed to serve alcohol. I've been to Agganis ~10 times, I am aware of where it is.
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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Quote Originally Posted by UML Puck Hawk View Post
    My understanding was it was not, cited as the reason you were still allowed to serve alcohol. I've been to Agganis ~10 times, I am aware of where it is.
    100% on campus and owned by the university. I have no idea how they got an alcohol license.
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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Sioux Falls is an interesting site. Both Mankato and St. Cloud are closer to Sioux Falls than Grand Forks is. If it works as a site, perhaps there could be a different host school in future years.

    And it's a nice new building.

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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Quote Originally Posted by purpleinnebraska View Post
    Sioux Falls is an interesting site. Both Mankato and St. Cloud are closer to Sioux Falls than Grand Forks is. If it works as a site, perhaps there could be a different host school in future years.

    And it's a nice new building.
    Something tells me the only reason the NCAA signed on to a 10K arena in the middle of South Dakota is the guarantee of North Dakota fans filling it up.
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  18. #38

    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Quote Originally Posted by purpleinnebraska View Post
    Sioux Falls is an interesting site. Both Mankato and St. Cloud are closer to Sioux Falls than Grand Forks is. If it works as a site, perhaps there could be a different host school in future years.

    And it's a nice new building.
    Perhaps. However, North Dakota has the advantage of likely being able to sell out all available tickets to its champions club and guaranteeing a successful (at least monetarily) regional well in advance of the NCAA Tournament. If there is no guarantee that North Dakota is going to Sioux Falls, I doubt that the regional would sell out unless the right group of teams were placed in the regional. Plus, Chris Semrau (Assistant G.M. at the Sanford Center in Sioux Falls) is the former events director at the Ralph and has many connections with UND.
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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    Quote Originally Posted by UML Puck Hawk View Post
    My understanding was it was not, cited as the reason you were still allowed to serve alcohol. I've been to Agganis ~10 times, I am aware of where it is.
    Being able to serve alcohol has zero to do with whether it is on campus or not.

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    Re: NCAA Hockey Administrators to western fans: Drop Dead

    About a year ago, I asked rhetorically if the East should handle all 4 regionals. A small part of me was serious, in that would be one way to make the currently arrangement actually work -- meaning 4 neutral sites that can attract a critical mass of fans. But mostly I was hoping to get widespread agreement that such a thing would be inherently unfair. Simply unthinkable.

    Well, we're now half way to the "unthinkable" solution. And when people get sick of traveling to the Dakotas and giving UND a "home state" advantage every year...


    Next Point: For those claiming that the only problem is that Westerners are refusing to bid: Please just stop. Bids aren't coming because responsible planners are refusing to get on a sinking ship. Instructing people to act like lemmings is no answer at all.

    More soon.

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