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The States. It's 10th Amendment or bust!

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  • #196
    Originally posted by E.J. Smith View Post
    The bill at the end of a nice meal sucks, too. So does what I pay at the pump when I fill my car. The paying for the thing you used is usually the suckiest part of it, pretty sure we all agree with that.

    Trust me, I'm not a passionate fan of toll roads but I'm not sure why you single that charge out from among the hundreds of charges we pay in life. And with open road tolling...there are places where you literally don't even know where the toll is taken.

    The free market can be a force for good, but I could also post examples for the next hour where it's a force for bad. Not sure where I took either position in my post.

    As for patently absurd, I guess, if logic is not a strength. In each case, you're receiving a service. In each case, the amount of that service received can be measured. Yet in one case you want there to be a flat fee and in another you want there to be discrete charges. Yes, absurd.
    Attending an NHL game is neither a necessity of life nor the type of good that benefits society as a whole.

    Roads are both. You need to be able to travel (or have people travel to you), and society benefits from everyone being able to move freely.

    I recognize you're playing devil's advocate, but that doesn't make it any less an absurd comparison.

    As far as utilities go, every utility bill I've seen has a fixed component and a usage component. The fixed charge helps keep the usage charge lower, inherently socializing some portion of the cost of service.

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    • #197
      Re: The States. It's 10th Amendment or bust!

      Originally posted by St. Clown View Post
      Toll roads are not funded by taxes. They are set aside into a separate pool of funding entirely dependent upon the tolls collected. Sometimes they're even privately owned and operated.

      Minnesota used to have a toll bridge that crossed the Mississippi River in the S. St. Paul/Newport area (roughly). It stayed in operation until a barge operator messed up and damaged the bridge so badly that it had to shutdown operations. The barge company had insufficient insurance to cover the fix, and the company that owned the toll bridge couldn't cover the expense of replacing the bridge.
      Right I know that...but you dont need toll roads to pay for usage since your usage would be paid for on a non-toll road by taxes. EJ seems to imply that that isnt true.
      "It's as if the Drumpf Administration is made up of the worst and unfunny parts of the Cleveland Browns, Washington Generals, and the alien Mon-Stars from Space Jam."
      -aparch

      "Scenes in "Empire Strikes Back" that take place on the tundra planet Hoth were shot on the present-day site of Ralph Engelstad Arena."
      -INCH

      Of course I'm a fan of the Vikings. A sick and demented Masochist of a fan, but a fan none the less.
      -ScoobyDoo 12/17/2007

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      • #198
        Re: The States. It's 10th Amendment or bust!

        Originally posted by unofan View Post
        Certain things lend themselves to socialized costs. Public parks. Libraries. Roads. And yes, garbage hauling. I preferred Omaha including residential garbage pickup as a city service rather than paying for a private company, which I have to do now.

        And toll roads suck. Suck it up and raise your taxes rather than charging tolls.

        The free market is merely a means to an end, not a goal in and of itself. So your example comparing an NHL game ticket to garbage service is, frankly, patently absurd.
        This. Also it's a private service vs a public one. You just can't compare them.
        Code:
        As of 9/21/10:         As of 9/13/10:
College Hockey 6       College Football 0
BTHC 4                 WCHA FC:  1
        Originally posted by SanTropez
        May your paint thinner run dry and the fleas of a thousand camels infest your dead deer.
        Originally posted by bigblue_dl
        I don't even know how to classify magic vagina smoke babies..
        Originally posted by Kepler
        When the giraffes start building radio telescopes they can join too.
        He's probably going to be a superstar but that man has more baggage than North West

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        • #199
          Re: The States. It's 10th Amendment or bust!

          Originally posted by St. Clown View Post
          Minnesota used to have a toll bridge that crossed the Mississippi River in the S. St. Paul/Newport area (roughly). It stayed in operation until a barge operator messed up and damaged the bridge so badly that it had to shutdown operations. The barge company had insufficient insurance to cover the fix, and the company that owned the toll bridge couldn't cover the expense of replacing the bridge.
          One more reason toll roads are stupid.
          Code:
          As of 9/21/10:         As of 9/13/10:
College Hockey 6       College Football 0
BTHC 4                 WCHA FC:  1
          Originally posted by SanTropez
          May your paint thinner run dry and the fleas of a thousand camels infest your dead deer.
          Originally posted by bigblue_dl
          I don't even know how to classify magic vagina smoke babies..
          Originally posted by Kepler
          When the giraffes start building radio telescopes they can join too.
          He's probably going to be a superstar but that man has more baggage than North West

          Comment

          • #200
            Re: The States. It's 10th Amendment or bust!

            Originally posted by dxmnkd316 View Post
            Maybe. The roads were still crap in Illinois and Indiana. Plus trying to pay for tolls when you just drive through was stupid. The links to search by license plate were broken or didn't work. Florida is the only tollway I've seen that actually has their **** figured out.
            The Indiana Tollway is hot garbage. I'll happily agree with you there.

            The ISTHA website is also hot garbage. But it's better than it was. Any time friends need to come through I'll throw 'em on my IPass account so they can zip through the toll plazas without worrying about tolls. Just buy me a dinner. Although ISTHA seems to want to fix my red wagon.

            The upkeep of the roads are much better than IDOT's tollways and highways.


            I used to be in the "Tollways are stupid" camp, until I came to use the ISHTA ones as much as I have.
            “Demolish the bridges behind you… then there is no choice but to build again.”

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            • #201
              Originally posted by aparch View Post
              The Indiana Tollway is hot garbage. I'll happily agree with you there.
              It's not just the Tollway...roads all over the state, especially Indianapolis, are a mess.
              Jordan Kawaguchi for Hobey!!
              Originally posted by Quizmire
              mns, this is why i love you.
              Originally posted by Markt
              MNS - forking genius.
              Originally posted by asterisk hat
              MNS - sometimes you gotta answer your true calling. I think yours is being a pimp.
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              I am a fan of MNS.

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              • #202
                Re: The States. It's 10th Amendment or bust!

                The North Carolina House, not to be outdone, got in just before the buzzer for a third installment in today's "What Would a Dick Do?"

                Comment

                • #203
                  Re: The States. It's 10th Amendment or bust!

                  Originally posted by FadeToBlack&Gold View Post
                  The North Carolina House, not to be outdone, got in just before the buzzer for a third installment in today's "What Would a Dick Do?"
                  Can the state decriminalize what everybody would consider a criminal act as long as the state isn't doing the action and it isn't discriminatory?

                  Can Texas pass a law that decriminalizes murder, for example, as long as they don't pin it to a suspect classification? I'll take my answer off the air.
                  Cornell University
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                  ECAC Champion 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1973, 1980, 1986, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2005, 2010
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                  • #204
                    Re: The States. It's 10th Amendment or bust!

                    I think they could as long as there are no federal statutes that apply.
                    Code:
                    As of 9/21/10:         As of 9/13/10:
College Hockey 6       College Football 0
BTHC 4                 WCHA FC:  1
                    Originally posted by SanTropez
                    May your paint thinner run dry and the fleas of a thousand camels infest your dead deer.
                    Originally posted by bigblue_dl
                    I don't even know how to classify magic vagina smoke babies..
                    Originally posted by Kepler
                    When the giraffes start building radio telescopes they can join too.
                    He's probably going to be a superstar but that man has more baggage than North West

                    Comment

                    • #205
                      Re: The States. It's 10th Amendment or bust!

                      Sure, but it would not stop the Feds from prosecuting for a civil rights violation (right to life) in the event of some hot Texan-on-Texan violence.
                      If you don't change the world today, how can it be any better tomorrow?

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                      • #206
                        Re: The States. It's 10th Amendment or bust!

                        Yep. And I doubt any federal court including the SC would support that law should it be challenged.
                        "It's as if the Drumpf Administration is made up of the worst and unfunny parts of the Cleveland Browns, Washington Generals, and the alien Mon-Stars from Space Jam."
                        -aparch

                        "Scenes in "Empire Strikes Back" that take place on the tundra planet Hoth were shot on the present-day site of Ralph Engelstad Arena."
                        -INCH

                        Of course I'm a fan of the Vikings. A sick and demented Masochist of a fan, but a fan none the less.
                        -ScoobyDoo 12/17/2007

                        Comment

                        • #207
                          Re: The States. It's 10th Amendment or bust!

                          Originally posted by LynahFan View Post
                          Sure, but it would not stop the Feds from prosecuting for a civil rights violation (right to life) in the event of some hot Texan-on-Texan violence.
                          Until Sessions tells them to hold them so he could drive down and hit them himself
                          "I went over the facts in my head, and admired how much uglier the situation had just become. Over the years I've learned that ignorance is more than just bliss. It's freaking orgasmic ecstasy".- Harry Dresden, Blood Rites


                          Western Michigan Bronco Hockey- 2012 Mason Cup Champions

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                          • #208
                            Originally posted by Kepler View Post
                            Can the state decriminalize what everybody would consider a criminal act as long as the state isn't doing the action and it isn't discriminatory?

                            Can Texas pass a law that decriminalizes murder, for example, as long as they don't pin it to a suspect classification? I'll take my answer off the air.
                            Sure. States control about 90% of criminal law. They could simply remove all murder laws from the criminal code.

                            Comment

                            • #209
                              Re: The States. It's 10th Amendment or bust!

                              Originally posted by unofan View Post
                              Sure. States control about 90% of criminal law. They could simply remove all murder laws from the criminal code.
                              Would it be a violation of a person's Constitutional right to be alive?

                              I'm actually serious. How does that work?
                              Cornell University
                              National Champion 1967, 1970
                              ECAC Champion 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1973, 1980, 1986, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2005, 2010
                              Ivy League Champion 1966, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1977, 1978, 1983, 1984, 1985, 1996, 1997, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2012, 2014, 2018, 2019, 2020

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                              • #210
                                Originally posted by Kepler View Post
                                Would it be a violation of a person's Constitutional right to be alive?

                                I'm actually serious. How does that work?
                                Remember, the Constitution (generally) only applies to government actions. So Texas cannot deprive you of life without due process (but it could with due process). But it's silent about whether a private citizen could do the same.

                                If they simply removed murder from the criminal code, you could argue that the common law prohibition on murder brought over from England would still apply in its place. If they not only removed it but added an affirmative statement that homicide is no longer prohibited as a criminal offense? I don't think there's anything stopping them from doing so.

                                Comment

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