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Making a Murderer (spoilers expected) did Steven Avery do it?

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  • #61
    Re: Making a Murderer (spoilers expected) did Steven Avery do it?

    The documentary was clearly slanted but I also read some other stuff after the fact that supported the other side. To me, the documentary's biggest strength was showing how the defense was able to expose some of the mistakes/flaws of the police/investigators. However you want to classify it.

    And even if they were using Dassey to make sure they got Avery, that doesn't change the fact that once they were finally able to get Dassey to tell them what they wanted to hear...the evidence STILL didn't support what the kid said. Amazing to me what they did to that kid.

    And yet it seems as if all the same small town bumpkins are still in place. They were all in over their head from the start but apparently zero repercussions.
    Last edited by J.D.; 01-13-2016, 07:48 AM.

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    • #62
      Re: Making a Murderer (spoilers expected) did Steven Avery do it?

      Interesting follow up on the blood situation:
      http://hellogiggles.com/blood-vial-making-a-murderer/
      Michigan Tech Legend, Founder of Mitch's Misfits, Co-Founder of Tech Hockey Guide, and Creator/Host of the Chasing MacNaughton Podcast covering MTU Hockey and the WCHA.

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      • #63
        Re: Making a Murderer (spoilers expected) did Steven Avery do it?

        Some details of Avery's past not in the documentary:

        http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/steve...b0ce4964243136

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        • #64
          Re: Making a Murderer (spoilers expected) did Steven Avery do it?

          Originally posted by ericredaxe View Post
          Some details of Avery's past not in the documentary:

          http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/steve...b0ce4964243136
          Kind of a joke article. The doc does not portray him as an innocent, really. They showed the letters to his former wife, the ones containing the death threats and such. Arguably, the doc basically said he's not a good man at all, but in this particular murder case...reasonable doubt. Nothing more, nothing less.
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          • #65
            Re: Making a Murderer (spoilers expected) did Steven Avery do it?

            Was watching hln earlier and there was another interview with dassey the documentary didn't show. The more i hear and read, the more flawed the documentary is.

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            • #66
              Re: Making a Murderer (spoilers expected) did Steven Avery do it?

              Originally posted by J.D. View Post
              Was watching hln earlier and there was another interview with dassey the documentary didn't show. The more i hear and read, the more flawed the documentary is.
              They had something like 700 hours of footage to cut down to 10, and they were telling the story from one side. But with all the additional information that is out there, on both sides (plenty of the defense is left out as well), there is still nothing that comes close to proving Avery's guilt beyond a reasonable doubt.

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              • #67
                Re: Making a Murderer (spoilers expected) did Steven Avery do it?

                I think there is. The question is do you think the main evidence was planted by police.

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                • #68
                  Re: Making a Murderer (spoilers expected) did Steven Avery do it?

                  We can all agree he was set up!! This is so dirty on so many levels..

                  Blood planted
                  No blood in house or garage except the deer blood drops
                  Burn site in gravel pit then put placed on Avery property
                  Halbeck none of her DNA on key weird lol comical actually
                  Blood put on vehicle same exact same pattern when use a cue tip
                  If u did it u wouldn't clean garage/house and not car
                  U would crush car
                  U would find key first day
                  Vival took blood out
                  And 36 million reason to set up.. Venus killing and losing 36 million hmmm pretty simple here
                  Son of volunteer policeman on jury
                  Husband of county clerk on jury
                  Bullet never match gun just same model 22
                  Car key was not original was a copy
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                  • #69
                    Re: Making a Murderer (spoilers expected) did Steven Avery do it?

                    Originally posted by J.D. View Post
                    I think there is. The question is do you think the main evidence was planted by police.
                    Where, when, and how was she killed? Where was the body burned? Those are some pretty fundamental questions that can't be clearly answered. I don't necessarily think Avery is innocent, but with the evidence you could make a good case for a total setup, Bobby Dassey or Scott Tadych or both, and Avery.

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                    • #70
                      Re: Making a Murderer (spoilers expected) did Steven Avery do it?

                      Unless you sat in the courtroom and listened to the prosecution (and the defense) present their case and cross-examine the witnesses, you really can't say for sure whether he was or wasn't proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.
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                      • #71
                        Originally posted by Kepler View Post

                        The moral may simply be something we already knew, and that Avery himself says at one point: the poor always lose.
                        This may very well be true. However it is important to remember that Avery wasn't "poor" for purposes of his case. He had the best defense money can buy, courtesy of the civil case.
                        That community is already in the process of dissolution where each man begins to eye his neighbor as a possible enemy, where non-conformity with the accepted creed, political as well as religious, is a mark of disaffection; where denunciation, without specification or backing, takes the place of evidence; where orthodoxy chokes freedom of dissent; where faith in the eventual supremacy of reason has become so timid that we dare not enter our convictions in the open lists, to win or lose.

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                        • #72
                          Re: Making a Murderer (spoilers expected) did Steven Avery do it?

                          Haven't gotten through this article yet but I thought I'd post before I forget to all together:
                          http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/20...dead-certainty
                          Michigan Tech Legend, Founder of Mitch's Misfits, Co-Founder of Tech Hockey Guide, and Creator/Host of the Chasing MacNaughton Podcast covering MTU Hockey and the WCHA.

                          Sports Allegiance: NFL: GB MLB: MIL NHL: MIN CB: UW CF: UW CH: MTU FIFA: USA MLS: MIN EPL: Everton

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                          • #73
                            Re: Making a Murderer (spoilers expected) did Steven Avery do it?

                            Originally posted by MinnesotaNorthStar View Post
                            Unless you sat in the courtroom and listened to the prosecution (and the defense) present their case and cross-examine the witnesses, you really can't say for sure whether he was or wasn't proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.
                            Unless the documentary is leaving out key evidence then I disagree. There's been a few articles pointing out some circumstantial evidence that was left out, I don't think it's enough to make a difference in terms of getting past reasonable doubt, especially for Brendan. As far as I can tell they showed the strongest evidence against him, why it was flawed, and some of the logical leaps that were taken to acquire a conviction. More than anything though they highlighted a lot of systemic issues in our legal system.

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                            • #74
                              Re: Making a Murderer (spoilers expected) did Steven Avery do it?

                              Originally posted by trixR4kids View Post
                              Unless the documentary is leaving out key evidence then I disagree. There's been a few articles pointing out some circumstantial evidence that was left out, I don't think it's enough to make a difference in terms of getting past reasonable doubt, especially for Brendan. As far as I can tell they showed the strongest evidence against him, why it was flawed, and some of the logical leaps that were taken to acquire a conviction. More than anything though they highlighted a lot of systemic issues in our legal system.
                              read the last link I posted, I think it does a very good job of explaining the major issue with the show. If I had (or eventually find) time, I'd sit through the whole Brendan Dassey interrogations to see how everything else is provided by him, to know if it was fed to him by them or if some of the important details were actually provided by Brendan...like the bit about him helping Avery move the car and witnessing Avery disconnect the battery to the vehicle which led them to swab under the hood for Avery's DNA, which they found.
                              Michigan Tech Legend, Founder of Mitch's Misfits, Co-Founder of Tech Hockey Guide, and Creator/Host of the Chasing MacNaughton Podcast covering MTU Hockey and the WCHA.

                              Sports Allegiance: NFL: GB MLB: MIL NHL: MIN CB: UW CF: UW CH: MTU FIFA: USA MLS: MIN EPL: Everton

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                              • #75
                                Re: Making a Murderer (spoilers expected) did Steven Avery do it?

                                I've been discussing this in a different forum and the other investigations of Dassey are as equally bad if not worse than the one we already saw in the documentary. Either way you're talking about a learning disabled kid and you can't just pick and choose which parts of it are valid and which parts are fed, he just wanted to get out of there and go back to watching wrestelmania and hand in his project. He basically just told them what they wanted to hear and if there was any truth in there it's so bogged down between so many layers of BS that there's no way of knowing.

                                Yes they found his DNA on the hood but she'd been around many times before and it's not that crazy to think he just touched it at some point. I guess I'd be curious as to where exactly they found it and whether the lab messed up like they did on various other things throughout this debacle.
                                Last edited by trixR4kids; 01-18-2016, 05:36 PM.

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