Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!

[Rover]

Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!

Although I would go farther than existing laws, I agree we at a bare minimum need someone with the knowledge and will to go after the corruption. That is something we never have under Republican administrations (where big money interest is a feature, not a bug), and have had only grudgingly and with few teeth under Clinton and Obama.

Where we may differ is in recognizing the laws themselves have been so weakened and corrupted that they have to be made much tighter and wider in scope. Since at least 1980 money has run roughshod over people in DC -- we have 35 years of rot to repair.

I think back to the time the NY Attorney General's office started doing the SEC's job for them. Lo and behold, it turns out you could send people to jail for fraud. Who would have thunk it? Or shine a spotlight on ridiculous pay packages (remember Dick Grasso getting $140M in one year as head of the NYSE until it became a public issue). To my knowledge NY didn't pass new laws regulating Wall St. They used existing ones while the SEC sat around with their thumbs up their @ sses until they decided to go after Martha Stewart for her whopping 10K insider trading scandal.

So, often times the anti-regulation crowd counters by saying we have enough of them. Okay - I'd call their bluff. Lets start actually enforcing those regulations and then see if there are any gaps.

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!

I did not write this to Kos, but it is basically how I feel about the current moment in Democratic politics.

tl; dr: We'll never get real progress unless we can know it when we see it. Clinton is status quo, which is lightyears better than dragging the country back to the orcs. But Bernie is real progress. Democrats, particularly people who call themselves Progressives or Liberals, should respect that and actively support all his "crazy" policies (which are basically mainstream Republican economic policies from 1970). If he loses the primary, fine, then we Drive Miss Daisy. Put until that happens, be the change you wish to see in the world.

[Rover]

Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!

daily kos is way too conservative for you, Kep.

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!

daily kos is way too conservative for you, Kep.

I'd be ok with a political spectrum with Hillary on the right and Bernie on the left, and each side winning about half the time.

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!

The clown car gets more crowded.

Rick Perry, the former governor of Texas, has launched his campaign to earn the Republican nomination for US president.
The 65-year-old made the announcement by launching a new fundraising website.

John Stewart really shouldn't have left until 2017.

[FadeToBlack&Gold]

Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!

So at this point, 2016 is basically ALL THE REPUBLICANS vs. Hildebeast

[Bob Gray]

Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!

I did not write this to Kos, but it is basically how I feel about the current moment in Democratic politics.

tl; dr: We'll never get real progress unless we can know it when we see it. Clinton is status quo, which is lightyears better than dragging the country back to the orcs. But Bernie is real progress. Democrats, particularly people who call themselves Progressives or Liberals, should respect that and actively support all his "crazy" policies (which are basically mainstream Republican economic policies from 1970). If he loses the primary, fine, then we Drive Miss Daisy. Put until that happens, be the change you wish to see in the world.

That's quite a skewed view. Clinton wouldn't advance and Dem interests? Simply a silly notion.

[Rover]

Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!

That's quite a skewed view. Clinton wouldn't advance and Dem interests? Simply a silly notion.

Thank you Bob. I'm still flabbergasted at how Clinton, a woman who the right has tried to take down for 25 years, is somehow really a Republican? Okay......

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!

That's quite a skewed view. Clinton wouldn't advance and Dem interests? Simply a silly notion.

"That's silly" is not a logical rebuttal. Please tell me in what areas do you think she would advance Democratic policy?

She, like any Democrat, would hold the ground we've gotten back, but I'm talking about moving the ball farther down the field. Would she do this? I don't see any specific policy area where she seems to be an improvement over Obama. One might argue that her SCOTUS nominations would improve the Court by either replacing a retiring conservative judge with a liberal, or resetting the odometer on a liberal slot, depending on the retirement. But again, any Democratic president would do the same, and I see nothing in Hillary's history or policy stances to suggest she would appoint a more liberal justice. Her Wins Above Democratic Replacement is 0.

[Bob Gray]

Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!

"That's silly" is not a logical rebuttal. Please tell me in what areas do you think she would advance Democratic policy?

She, like any Democrat, would hold the ground we've gotten back, but I'm talking about moving the ball farther down the field. Would she do this? I don't see any specific policy area where she seems to be an improvement over Obama. One might argue that her SCOTUS nominations would improve the Court by either replacing a retiring conservative judge with a liberal, or resetting the odometer on a liberal slot, depending on the retirement. But again, any Democratic president would do the same, and I see nothing in Hillary's history or policy stances to suggest she would appoint a more liberal justice. Her Wins Above Democratic Replacement is 0.

Really? Really? You don't know how she'd advance Dem interests?

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!

Thank you Bob. I'm still flabbergasted at how Clinton, a woman who the right has tried to take down for 25 years, is somehow really a Republican? Okay......

Again (and for perhaps the twentieth time), Hillary is not a Republican, but she is on the right margin of the Democratic party on many policies. That is of course miles better than any current Republican, and so she gets my full support as the nominee. But now, when we are choosing from the full spectrum of Democratic candidates, she is sub-optimal.

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!

Really? Really? You don't know how she'd advance Dem interests?

I know you understand what I'm saying: "compared to what?" Let's make this much simpler: in what way do you think Hillary is an improvement over the current administration?

[Bob Gray]

Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!

I know you understand what I'm saying: "compared to what?" Let's make this much simpler: in what way do you think Hillary is an improvement over the current administration?

See, your baseline is all wrong. The current administration is also Dem, but it ends at the next election. Or are you arguing that the current administration hasn't advanced Dem interests at all, which is also patently silly?

[Bob Gray]

Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!

Here's a fun one. Americans now like Bush more than Obama. Let the wailing begin.

https://www.yahoo.com/politics/more-...609395871.html

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!

See, your baseline is all wrong. The current administration is also Dem, but it ends at the next election. Or are you arguing that the current administration hasn't advanced Dem interests at all, which is also patently silly?

My baseline is my baseline -- it's the question. I'm talking about moving left or right and staying in the same place relative to now. There are candidates who would move us left (Bernie) and right (every Republican). Hillary would, in my opinion, "stay the course."

I haven't heard anybody argue against this.