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  • Re: Utica College Pioneers 2012-13 Season

    I'll be checking in when I can. When will UC offer some streams?!?

    Comment


    • Re: Utica College Pioneers 2012-13 Season

      Originally posted by fisheralum91 View Post
      Hey guys,
      I know that many of the UC faithful are fed up with the USCHO rankings.
      Why not go over to D3boards.com and strike up the conversation over there.
      They are the most comprehensive all D3 sports boards and have a great following!
      The endorsed rankings over there make even less sense that the human polls here. Why bother to make the trip?

      Comment


      • Re: Utica College Pioneers 2012-13 Season

        Originally posted by Fishman'81 View Post
        The endorsed rankings over there make even less sense that the human polls here. Why bother to make the trip?
        It is less about rankings and more about an all encompassing D3 sport board.
        Pat and his guys really do a nice job in moderating thought provoking conversations and it really is a conduit for everything that is D3 Sports.
        You should check them out.

        Comment


        • Re: Utica College Pioneers 2012-13 Season

          Originally posted by fisheralum91 View Post
          Hey guys,
          I know that many of the UC faithful are fed up with the USCHO rankings.
          Why not go over to D3boards.com and strike up the conversation over there.
          They are the most comprehensive all D3 sports boards and have a great following!
          What does a poll voted on by coaches have anything to do with a message board?
          Russell Jaslow
          [Former] SUNYAC Correspondent
          U.S. College Hockey Online

          Comment


          • Re: Utica College Pioneers 2012-13 Season

            Not sure exactly what the conversation has turned-into here, but clearly the coaches/media poll is silly at best... I'll bet that 85% of the voters have never seen 25% of the teams that they vote for, and that's a generous estimate in both respects.

            The NCAA puts out D-3 rankings late in the year that look suspiciously similar to the PWR in recent years, and seem to use those to make their AL selection... I don't have a problem with that at all- it's made for better choices- but one has to wonder about the secrecy involved. (Maybe it's a plagiarism issue?)

            In the meantime, we all can pull whatever rankings we please from our framma-zammas.

            Who cares, anyway..? Most of the stuff I've seen makes as little sense as the coaches' poll, so why not just pass the time until The Wizard pulls back the curtain and enlightens us all as to the results, if not as to the criteria, involved?

            I know I'm starting early this year, but D-3 needs to come up with a transparent selection process, FCS. If nothing else, that would reduce a lot of hot-air emissions about meaningless polls.
            Last edited by Fishman'81; 01-10-2013, 02:31 AM.

            Comment


            • Re: Utica College Pioneers 2012-13 Season

              Originally posted by Fishman'81 View Post
              I'll be checking in when I can. When will UC offer some streams?!?
              The above link leads to streaming audio.

              Video we will be up a creek, without a paddle for this one.
              Our bite is worse than our bark....
              Top guys, out.

              Comment


              • Re: Utica College Pioneers 2012-13 Season

                Originally posted by Fishman'81 View Post
                Not sure exactly what the conversation has turned-into here, but clearly the coaches/media poll is silly at best... I'll bet that 85% of the voters have never seen 25% of the teams that they vote for, and that's a generous estimate in both respects.

                The NCAA puts out D-3 rankings late in the year that look suspiciously similar to the PWR in recent years, and seem to use those to make their AL selection... I don't have a problem with that at all- it's made for better choices- but one has to wonder about the secrecy involved. (Maybe it's a plagiarism issue?)

                In the meantime, we all can pull whatever rankings we please from our framma-zammas.

                Who cares, anyway..? Most of the stuff I've seen makes as little sense as the coaches' poll, so why not just pass the time until The Wizard pulls back the curtain and enlightens us all as to the results, if not as to the criteria, involved?

                I know I'm starting early this year, but D-3 needs to come up with a transparent selection process, FCS. If nothing else, that would reduce a lot of hot-air emissions about meaningless polls.
                The criteria are well known

                Winning percentage
                Strength of Schedule (OWP * (2/3), OOWP * (1/3))
                Head to Head
                Record against Common Opponents
                Record against Ranked Teams (NCAA regional rankings, not USCHO or d3hockey.com)

                The problem is that the committee is free to weight the criteria any way they want to, the weight they give can vary from one pair of teams to another.
                2007-2008 ECAC East/NESCAC Interlock Pick 'em winner
                2007-2008 Last Person Standing Winner,
                2013-2014 Last Person Standing Winner (tie)
                2016-2017 Last Person Standing Winner

                Comment


                • Originally posted by NUProf View Post
                  The criteria are well known

                  Winning percentage
                  Strength of Schedule (OWP * (2/3), OOWP * (1/3))
                  Head to Head
                  Record against Common Opponents
                  Record against Ranked Teams (NCAA regional rankings, not USCHO or d3hockey.com)

                  The problem is that the committee is free to weight the criteria any way they want to, the weight they give can vary from one pair of teams to another.
                  The record against NCAA ranked teams is where it can make or break you. That's where you can really play around with things and change comparisons. The rest of the criteria is pretty much straight forward.
                  The Poster Formerly Known as Purple_and_Gold10©
                  "The Prezidential Three - Elmira, Oswego, Norwich" © Joecct
                  GO EAGLES!!! R.I.P. L.H. #4 In our hearts forever
                  GO LAKERS!!!
                  GO CADETS!!! R.I.P. Charlie Crosby '63
                  "Reisweber trying to circle in front of the net, he does, HE SCORES! that's it! Oswego State has done it!! The Lakers take home the first NCAA title of any kind in school history. It's celebration time in Upstate New York!"
                  Oswego State '09

                  Comment


                  • Re: Utica College Pioneers 2012-13 Season

                    I apologize if this has been mentioned earlier in the Thread, but I picked up a copy of New York Hockey Journal this afternoon. The January 2013 edition featured a list of the "Top 10 college hockey rinks in New York and New Jersey." Utica Memorial Auditorium was No. 8.

                    At the bottom of its description, the article continues...

                    "A number of other Division 3 rinks are worthy of mention here, including Hamilton's Sage Rink (the second-oldest building in college hockey after Hobey Baker at Princeton), Elmira College's Murray Athletic Center, Plattsburgh's Stafford Ice Arena and Oswego's Campus Center Hockey Arena. However, if you make just one trip to a Division 3 barn, the Aud is the place to see."
                    Plattsburgh State Cardinals
                    1992 & 2001 NCAA Division III Ice Hockey Champions
                    21 SUNYAC Championships

                    Comment


                    • Re: Utica College Pioneers 2012-13 Season

                      Originally posted by CardsFan91 View Post
                      I apologize if this has been mentioned earlier in the Thread, but I picked up a copy of New York Hockey Journal this afternoon. The January 2013 edition featured a list of the "Top 10 college hockey rinks in New York and New Jersey." Utica Memorial Auditorium was No. 8.

                      At the bottom of its description, the article continues...

                      "A number of other Division 3 rinks are worthy of mention here, including Hamilton's Sage Rink (the second-oldest building in college hockey after Hobey Baker at Princeton), Elmira College's Murray Athletic Center, Plattsburgh's Stafford Ice Arena and Oswego's Campus Center Hockey Arena. However, if you make just one trip to a Division 3 barn, the Aud is the place to see."
                      You mean "The Cooler" didn't make the list? They put up a 4th wall and closed the rink in....what the hell else do they need to do to get some respect?
                      Last edited by llama; 01-10-2013, 04:33 PM.

                      Comment


                      • Re: Utica College Pioneers 2012-13 Season

                        Another thursday night, another show.

                        Coach Pags will be in the Studio tonight.

                        http://www.utica.edu/wpnr907

                        7-8 pm.

                        Got a question? quote this post and ask. If it's suitable, i will ask it.
                        Our bite is worse than our bark....
                        Top guys, out.

                        Comment


                        • Re: Utica College Pioneers 2012-13 Season

                          Originally posted by CardsFan91 View Post
                          I apologize if this has been mentioned earlier in the Thread, but I picked up a copy of New York Hockey Journal this afternoon. The January 2013 edition featured a list of the "Top 10 college hockey rinks in New York and New Jersey." Utica Memorial Auditorium was No. 8.

                          At the bottom of its description, the article continues...

                          "A number of other Division 3 rinks are worthy of mention here, including Hamilton's Sage Rink (the second-oldest building in college hockey after Hobey Baker at Princeton), Elmira College's Murray Athletic Center, Plattsburgh's Stafford Ice Arena and Oswego's Campus Center Hockey Arena. However, if you make just one trip to a Division 3 barn, the Aud is the place to see."
                          Im curious what the rest of the top 10 was. Could you post it?
                          The Poster Formerly Known as Purple_and_Gold10©
                          "The Prezidential Three - Elmira, Oswego, Norwich" © Joecct
                          GO EAGLES!!! R.I.P. L.H. #4 In our hearts forever
                          GO LAKERS!!!
                          GO CADETS!!! R.I.P. Charlie Crosby '63
                          "Reisweber trying to circle in front of the net, he does, HE SCORES! that's it! Oswego State has done it!! The Lakers take home the first NCAA title of any kind in school history. It's celebration time in Upstate New York!"
                          Oswego State '09

                          Comment


                          • Re: Utica College Pioneers 2012-13 Season

                            Originally posted by NUProf View Post
                            The criteria are well known

                            Winning percentage
                            Strength of Schedule (OWP * (2/3), OOWP * (1/3))
                            Head to Head
                            Record against Common Opponents
                            Record against Ranked Teams (NCAA regional rankings, not USCHO or d3hockey.com)

                            The problem is that the committee is free to weight the criteria any way they want to, the weight they give can vary from one pair of teams to another.
                            ...And that's a HUGE problem, Prof!

                            If the committee can tinker with the metrics in such a way as to make a de-facto selection of their own, then why even bother to pretend that they are employing a blind and transparent formula..? It's the most recent and cynical incarnation of The Emperor's New Clothes, and we long-suffering D-3 fans are still at the mercy of the committee's whims.


                            To wit: the D-3 selection "criteria" are tailored precisely after the PWR (RPI, SOS, H2H and TUC) but without the set-in-stone objectivity that the PWR was developed to impose in the first place... So, to refer to them as "criteria" perverts the definition of the word, since they can be manipulated at will to guarantee any desired outcome.

                            Ergo, there is still no incumbent accountability to be assigned to anyone in this dubious process. The game, the players, the schools and the fans all deserve better than having to wait to see how this shell-game plays-out every year.


                            PS: Before anyone goes apoplectic, I will allow that the past couple of years' NCAA inclusions all deserved to get in... But they all would have done so anyway, on the basis of the PWR, and without necessitating a few guys meeting behind closed doors to fiddle with things. Guess that was my point. ;-)
                            Last edited by Fishman'81; 01-11-2013, 01:42 AM.

                            Comment


                            • Re: Utica College Pioneers 2012-13 Season

                              Originally posted by Fishman'81 View Post
                              ...And that's a HUGE problem, Prof!

                              If the committee can tinker with the metrics in such a way as to make a de-facto selection of their own, then why even bother to pretend that they are employing a blind and transparent formula..? It's the most recent and cynical incarnation of The Emperor's New Clothes, and we long-suffering D-3 fans are still at the mercy of the committee's whims.


                              To wit: the D-3 selection "criteria" are tailored precisely after the PWR (RPI, SOS, H2H and TUC) but without the set-in-stone objectivity that the PWR was developed to impose in the first place... So, to refer to them as "criteria" perverts the definition of the word, since they can be manipulated at will to guarantee any desired outcome.

                              Ergo, there is still no incumbent accountability to be assigned to anyone in this dubious process. The game, the players, the schools and the fans all deserve better than having to wait to see how this shell-game plays-out every year.


                              PS: Before anyone goes apoplectic, I will allow that the past couple of years' NCAA inclusions all deserved to get in... But they all would have done so anyway, on the basis of the PWR, and without necessitating a few guys meeting behind closed doors to fiddle with things. Guess that was my point. ;-)
                              I wouldn't disagree with you on that. The problem with the D3 selection process is that it one that is mandated for all D3 sports - all of them have the criteria and procedures - the one thing that add to this is a provision (which may or may not have changed - joe keeps up on this better than I do) that game between teams of different regions don't count for inclusion in the metrics, except as "secondary criteria" (which means the committee can consider them if they can't reach a decision on the comparison of two teams after looking at the primary criteria). Most of us have advocated for a more transparent selection process. The other issue is that the process is broken down by regions first and then put together after the two regions have made their rankings...this creates a whole new opportunity for sleaziness - it happened last year.
                              2007-2008 ECAC East/NESCAC Interlock Pick 'em winner
                              2007-2008 Last Person Standing Winner,
                              2013-2014 Last Person Standing Winner (tie)
                              2016-2017 Last Person Standing Winner

                              Comment


                              • Re: Utica College Pioneers 2012-13 Season

                                Originally posted by Russell Jaslow View Post
                                What does a poll voted on by coaches have anything to do with a message board?
                                Im sorry....What?
                                Think about it...
                                Really?

                                Comment

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