Advice for dealing with a bad coach

[WHKY blogger]

I am a little torn on how to handle the following, regarding my 5 year old. Any advice would be great!

During her game last week we were up 9-0, when what I felt was a totally uncalled for situation occurred. The other team scored to make it 9-1 our daughters coach, called time out and flipped out at the kids for giving up what was a well played goal for a 5 year old, first he yelled at his own daughter, then the rest of the team, then the other team, before finally throwing a water bottle over the boards. We went on to win 12-1, our coach did not even bother to stick around as the kids attempted to shake hands and not fall down.

Myself along with many of the other parents spoke to our clubs coordinator afterwards, who said he would speak to our coach and it would be handled accordingly. Our coach was at practice the following day and even had the kids do "herbies" at the end of practice on the full NHL sized rink (We normally practice inside one of the blue lines and play games with the goals on the blue lines) until most of them cried, at which time the coach just abruptly left. The mothers who were having their usual coffee session in the concession area saw the coach leave at what my wife noted as very early, and when they went out to see what was happening, most had to go onto the ice and carry their kids off, including my own.

I contacted the Coordinator again who ensured he was aware of what had happened at both the game and the following practice. I wanted to pull my kid then and there, but my wife wanted to wait and see what the club did.

Last night we played and won 10-3, our coach was absent for what our assistant called "Family Reasons", even though his daughter played and the rest of his family was there. This morning he was back at practice again and seemed to be very ****y at the kids and the parents. Afterwards our club coordinator appeared and passed out letters to all the parents apologizing for the situation that occurred and stated that it was handled internally.

The entire situation rubbed me the wrong way, from the initial incident to the way it was handled by our governing body. They are 5 year olds, most of which in their first or second year of hockey, they are going to make mistakes, and for a coach to act that way is not what I prefer to have my child exposed to. And for the league to basically do nothing makes me feel worse. For All the money we pay is it worth putting my kid through?

So my question is, do I pull my kid off of this team, 6 games into the season and put her in a different league or should I wait and see if the situation improves?

Thoughts Suggestions?

[sk8happy]

This is pretty straightforward in my opinion. In a word, goodbye. First I wouldn't want my child being led by someone with such a poor grasp of priorities. Second, the governing body sounds like most- impotent. You can speak much louder with you feet than you can with complaints. If enough parents feel the same way- I'd expect they'd make a change.
Parents have a penchant for getting embroiled in the middle of these things. If it were my child, I'm moving him/her to another venue where she can get something positive from the experience.

[videohockey]

You appear to be viewing your coach in a different light since "the incident". Should we assume the parents and players were pleased with him prior to it?

If his attitude and approach have changed in a bad way since that game, and the parents and players agree, the team should immediately send a group of representatives to the organization's officers, and request his immediate dismissal or an immediate meeting with the coach. He gets 1 chance to turn it around.

If the organization fails to act, or the coach fails to cooperate, the team could organize a sit-out at the next practice. And sk8hapy is right... the feet walking away are very loud, especially in a group!

There is no time of grace when 5yrs old are concerned. Too much damage can be done if this is not addressed immediately, IMHO.

[brookyone]

The entire situation rubbed me the wrong way, from the initial incident to the way it was handled by our governing body. They are 5 year olds, most of which in their first or second year of hockey, they are going to make mistakes, and for a coach to act that way is not what I prefer to have my child exposed to. And for the league to basically do nothing makes me feel worse. For All the money we pay is it worth putting my kid through?

So my question is, do I pull my kid off of this team, 6 games into the season and put her in a different league or should I wait and see if the situation improves?

Thoughts Suggestions?
From your description of events, I can tell you if it were my kid she'd be off that team in a hurry...and hopefully onto another ASAP. Don't want the kid(s) to suffer, and or lose out on the good experience youth hockey SHOULD be. Also, If it were me I'd be unconvinced the situation has been handled or corrected at this point...and personally I'd be very concerned with repeat performances from this individual. Not everyone is cut out for coaching youth hockey. It requires a certain / appropriate personality with patience a big virtue, and at this age a much stronger focus on teaching & having fun...as opposed to winning. In my experience you can't count on those with such a disposition to change permanently, and as stated I would fear a repeat of this behavior at some point. So if coach stays...

[vas]

Is this thread a joke? Are we really talking about 5 yr olds?

[EdSasha]

I am a little torn on how to handle the following, regarding my 5 year old. Any advice would be great!

During her game last week we were up 9-0, when what I felt was a totally uncalled for situation occurred. The other team scored to make it 9-1 our daughters coach, called time out and flipped out at the kids for giving up what was a well played goal for a 5 year old, first he yelled at his own daughter, then the rest of the team, then the other team, before finally throwing a water bottle over the boards. We went on to win 12-1, our coach did not even bother to stick around as the kids attempted to shake hands and not fall down.

Myself along with many of the other parents spoke to our clubs coordinator afterwards, who said he would speak to our coach and it would be handled accordingly. Our coach was at practice the following day and even had the kids do "herbies" at the end of practice on the full NHL sized rink (We normally practice inside one of the blue lines and play games with the goals on the blue lines) until most of them cried, at which time the coach just abruptly left. The mothers who were having their usual coffee session in the concession area saw the coach leave at what my wife noted as very early, and when they went out to see what was happening, most had to go onto the ice and carry their kids off, including my own.

I contacted the Coordinator again who ensured he was aware of what had happened at both the game and the following practice. I wanted to pull my kid then and there, but my wife wanted to wait and see what the club did.

Last night we played and won 10-3, our coach was absent for what our assistant called "Family Reasons", even though his daughter played and the rest of his family was there. This morning he was back at practice again and seemed to be very ****y at the kids and the parents. Afterwards our club coordinator appeared and passed out letters to all the parents apologizing for the situation that occurred and stated that it was handled internally.

The entire situation rubbed me the wrong way, from the initial incident to the way it was handled by our governing body. They are 5 year olds, most of which in their first or second year of hockey, they are going to make mistakes, and for a coach to act that way is not what I prefer to have my child exposed to. And for the league to basically do nothing makes me feel worse. For All the money we pay is it worth putting my kid through?

So my question is, do I pull my kid off of this team, 6 games into the season and put her in a different league or should I wait and see if the situation improves?

Thoughts Suggestions?

If the situation is as you portrayed it and it was my daughter involved I would remove her from the team immediately. Where 5-year-olds are concerned, once is enough and no second chances. After the performance that you described, it's too much to expect that the coach will do a 180 degree turn to become the players' mentor rather than their scourge.

[Cargo]

If the coach gets that upset over a single goal against I would hate to see his reaction in a tight game. I appreciate the being optimist that things will improve but personally I would not hesitate and as a Team ask for the dismissal of this coach. The outcome of a season of torment will likely be that not many of these children choose to play hockey again.

[videohockey]

I agree with leaving if necessary, but I would rather see the team as a whole stand up and say he goes or we go. Why should my daughter have to leave playing with her friends because of some moron? Force the hand of the organization, and if they don't cooperate, the team walks away.

[THE Icemom]

My husband has coached for eight seasons in Colorado at the under 8 year old level and we have seen coaches "blow a head gasket" although not quite to the extent you described. They are young and they are impressionable and and this is the time in their life when hockey should be above all else FUN. They should be learning to have fun, improve at their sport, learn to be a good teammate and to listen to the coach just as they would listen to their teacher. So a coach blowing a head gasket over one goal scored is a coach that #1 has placed winning too high up on his list and #2 is someone who I would question his mental stability. The parents need to ban together and make it clear to the clubs heirarchy that he goes or all of you go (with full refunds).

[ARM]

I'd agree that the parents should unite on this. If they all feel as you do, then ask for the dismissal of the coach, but the parents will need to be willing to take on the responsibility of coaching the team. If this coach is as bad as advertised, all he will succeed in doing is ruining the game for any kids he coaches in this or any subsequent year.

[notfromaroundhere]

I had to do a double take on the original post :confused: when I saw that he lost it with 5-year-olds. At first I thought this was about 15 year olds (still not acceptable even at that age).

The only reason to pull a team in for a timeout after that goal was if there was some bad sportsmanship displayed by one of the kids on the ice. But then to yell at them?

So I'm thinking, this guy had a bad day at the office, so instead of kicking the dog (another bad idea), he rips his mini-mite team. Then doing herbies at the next practice? Ok, somebody has got to confiscate his copy of Miracle before someone gets hurt. I think this guy has disconnected from reality and probably shouldn't be behind the bench. The damage to the kids has already been done. Leaving him with a coach's whistle will only inflict more anguish at every practice and game. A new coach needs to start by explaining that there will be no more yelling or punishing drills, just instruction, encouragement and playing the game for enjoyment.

I think it is time the original poster and the other parents become involved in the hockey organization. And not just showing up with pitch forks and torches looking for the head of the coach. There may not be a more hockey knowledgable parent in the bunch (or one with a coach's card), but IIRC all you need is a Level 1 to coach mini-mites and that can be done in a weekend, if there is a Level 4 coach in the organization to teach the class.

The girls team coach my daughter played for the last 2 years (12u and 14u)never played hockey until his daughter took up the sport. He was a lacrosse coach. He took hockey lessons, got his card and to this day will tell parents that he cannot teach skating - he brings someone else in for that. But he is a great motivator. He gets angry. The girls can see it in his eyes (my D says his eyes turn bright red LOL), but keeps his composure. But he also can be a funny guy and a great pal off ice and that has a great impact on young ladies as well. My D would play for him on a mediocre team anyday over some coaches who run championship teams.

Point here is that many parents may not see an alternative to this coach, but anyone (even a lacrosse coach) would be better for these girls than what the original poster has described.

When you get the parents together to discuss going to the board, don't just sharpen your pitchforks and dunk your torches in kerosene, please try to bring them a solution and try to be part of the solution, not the problem.

[notfromaroundhere]

One more thing...

The person I feel the worst for here is that coach's daughter.

You can fire the coach, but she is stuck with him and his over wrought demanding style for a lifetime. She is probably going to end up playing hockey to please the unpleasable parent, never being good enough. Talk about a potential lifetime of psych problems coming...

[Hux]

I agree with leaving if necessary, but I would rather see the team as a whole stand up and say he goes or we go. Why should my daughter have to leave playing with her friends because of some moron? Force the hand of the organization, and if they don't cooperate, the team walks away.

I agree. Don't pull the kid off the team. Get the "coach" out of there. Talk to the club honchos as a group and demand that he be dismissed. The guy has no business being anywhere near kids of any age. He is totally not what being a certified USA Hockey coach is about.

Given their age, just about anyone with a good disposition and a grasp of the fact that they are five can coach these kids. I have a newly minted six year old on my U10 team. We started playing back in September and she didn't have a clue for the first two months. Then slowly she started to get the idea that you needed to skate as fast as you could to get the puck. She plays every shift that her line is up (well except the time she got stuck sitting on top of the water bottle holder on the bench so she could see over the boards) and has a blast out on the ice. She has even had a few breakaways, though she got caught from behind.

Point is, all a coach needs to do with them is open the door and let em go play. Let them figure it out on their own. There are only three things you can "coach" them on at this age: 1) skate hard until you get tired, then come off 2) keep your stick on the ice 3) have fun

[EdSasha]

I agree. Don't pull the kid off the team. Get the "coach" out of there. Talk to the club honchos as a group and demand that he be dismissed. The guy has no business being anywhere near kids of any age. He is totally not what being a certified USA Hockey coach is about.

I can't argue with this. But it'll only work if ALL the parents are able to act together as a group, and quickly. Organization management tend to protect coaches, even when there's a groundswell of opinion that they're not working in the best interests of the kids. After all, it's the organization who made the choice to hire the coach; how many more games on the schedule will be played before the organization will admit to making a mistake? In my earlier post I recommended removing the child immediately if he/she was mine without qualifying my decision with what I've written here. If a quick decision can't be reached I'd still do the same thing, either placing the child on another team or waiting until the coaching change had been made before reintroducing the child to the team. I don't think anyone could accept a repeat of what occurred to prompt the originator of this thread to post his plea.

[sheba]

you said there is an assistant coach who coached the next game while this coach was absent for family reasons... have you had a team meeting with the parents and the assistant coaches??? This may be good time, especially with 5 year olds to try to discuss team goals and policies...if this was a player or parent exhibiting these anger management issues --- there certainly would be consequences... this is is a good time at the beginning of the season to address these concerns..

I have had fifteen years experience in youth hockey from the mighty mites when the youngest players were only 4 up to Div I college hockey...and have personally witnessed many outrageous conduct from coaches and more especially parents at coaches, sometimes not unjustified, but still inappropriate in the presence of the youngsters who see the adults acting out tantrums worst than the kids.

It seems the written apology and the missed game is a start...but there should be a probationary condition that if the behavior is repeated there will be no doubt the coach should be gone... you might file a written letter to the governing youth hockey organization voicing your concerns about the coaches conduct...if they are "handling it internally" chances are they have heard of it. Did the ref see the coach throw the water bottle?? The ref might be another good one to approach -- before you remove your child from the team.

I feel very badly for the coach's daughter...and it makes me feel even more strongly against parents who coach their own children... I think parents can be good assistant coaches on the bench opening/closing the doors for line changes and tightening skate laces etc... but leave the teaching to objective adults with no vested interest of favoritism...

[OnMAA]

I agree. Don't pull the kid off the team. Get the "coach" out of there. Talk to the club honchos as a group and demand that he be dismissed. The guy has no business being anywhere near kids of any age. He is totally not what being a certified USA Hockey coach is about.


Totally Agree. I've coached youth soccer and hockey and this coach is all what you should NOT BE with minors at any age. As a matter of fact doing this in a 9-1 game is despicable, and shows very poor sportsmanship. Anytime you get up 4 goals or more, you let the kids play, say nothing out loud and roll the lines. If it gets beyond 6 goals, you tell the kids to keep it simple and to pass more and shoot less. It's called playing out the string and respect for the game and the opposition.

The solution is simple. Ask the assocation/org to remove this person from the coaching rank, and if they are not willing to do this, vote with your feet. You will look back on this a few years from now as a key first learning experience on how to handle these things in the proper way.

[taz91]

I will preface this by saying I've never coached hockey. Heck, I can barely skate myself. I have coached youth softball for about 15 years. I agree that this is the best time for the parents to ban together and get the idiot out of there. Unless you are playing on a varsity team there is no reason for that crap. As far as the water bottle toss, no room for that anywhere. The last coach I saw pull that got a 2-game suspension. That was a college coach. I am coaching 9th grade softball at a local high school. At that age I still stress playing for fun and learning the game, not win or else. It sounds to me like another parent that had no success as an athlete trying to be a superstar through his child. I would be ready to bet that his daughter won't be playing a sport when she reaches 10 or older. He will be the dad that flips out on a referee.

[lovehockey]

A lot of good posts about this, and I agree with most of them. If this was my daughter or son I would not tolerate this situation. I would go the the hockey board and if no results I would pull my child from this team immediatly. Coaches SHOULD be mentors, teachers, good sports, and role models for the kids under their supervision. This coach is out of line in my opionion for any level of sports, and especially with 5 year old kids. There is no room in hockey or any other sport for a coach to "sour" and wreck the experience for so many kids. Skating punishment at the age of 5 is ridiculous, and hardly has a place at any level in today's day and age. The kids are much different than they were a decade or 2 ago. The days of Bear Bryant and Vince Lombardi are over, you cannot treat kids like that anymore and it should not happen. I certainly feel bad for the situation your daughter had to go through and hope that they either get rid of the coach or you leave that organization. Best of luck!

[pgb-ohio]

The specific problem is that the governing body has decided on a second chance strategy. It's pretty clear that's unacceptable. The *coach* had his second chance the following day at practice -- and flunked the test.

Losing your cool in the heat of battle can be forgivable, depending on the particulars. But this guy had 24 hours to calm down and reflect on the situation. He should have opened practice with an apology for his actions the day before. Not only did he fail to see the error of his ways, he decided to escalate the situation with the herbies.

Frankly, the one game suspension was a third chance -- and again he flunked. The sullen, unrepentant attitude clearly shows the message the governing body was trying to send didn't get through.

A unified team response would be ideal. But if that doesn't materialize, you need to get your child out of there. This guy has decided he has the right, or even the obligation, to force his will on the children. What happens when he decides the herbies aren't working? You don't want to be there to find out.

Had the players involved been teenagers, there might be room to consider alternatives. But this guy should not be coaching 5 year-olds. Period.

[Glaus Boot]

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