RPI Women's Hockey

[rpi_fan03]

hab- thanks for the info:D

leeb- The women actually do have a red/white scrimmage, as well as an alumni game (last year was the first and I have not heard anything about this year). Due to NCAA rules, however, it is a few weeks later in October because the girls are D3 and are not allowed on the ice as a team (ie with coaches) until then and there wouldnt be much of a point in having them scrimmage without a single day of practices under them. If I find out any info on when these games are, I will be sure to post.

On another note....the team started on ice captains practices this week and have been doing off-ice stuff for the past couple of weeks. This week is basically full doubles, with the morning session being on ice and the evening being off ice. I believe as of next week they will be falling into a more regular in season schedule for off ice where they are only working with the strength and conditioning coach a few days a week (but im not 100% on that).
Well, thats all I got for now...anyone who is in Troy and can check out the practices that would be great;)

[leeb]

RPI_fan03 -

Thanks much, I'd definitely attend a red-white game.

hab -

Don't leave us hanging! Have you seen Sarah plat at all? If you have, please give us a little preview of what we should expect from her on the D3 level.

Maybe it's just me but I like the fact that we are getting a few more Canadian recruits lately. I believe Dielwart is Canadian also. Historically, at least from what I've seen, RPI recruits pretty heavily from Mass. Maybe someone could speak to the relative strengths of women's hockey (Bantam / Midget, etc.) in Canada as opposed to say the top high school / prep leagues / Midgets, etc. in Mass / New England in general.

[leeb]

Just to follow up, Lane Dielwart is also from Calgary, Alberta. We may have ourselves a bit of a Calgary connection here at RPI.

I also checked about the Mass. statement. Currently, Bonner, Langille, Vallarelli and Walker are players from Mass. I don't know whether they actually played their hockey in Mass. though. I think also that Katie Hammond (incoming freshman) is from Mass. So I guess my statement is at least fairly accurate.

[hab]

Can't comment on Sarah specifically and its hard to make a generalization on how someone from a strong Canadian midget league might fare in Div III hockey, but I have looked at some stats that might surprise you. Not very many Canadians end up in Div III US womens hockey because of the lack of athletic scholarships....they either end up in Div I with a scholarship, or go to a Canadian college. I looked at the returning player rosters of 40 Div III schools, and only five of them had more than one or two Canadians (most had zero). But of the five who did recruit heavily in Canada, four of them ended up ranked in the top five by the end of last year! #1 Elmira led the way with no fewer than 16 Canadians; #2 Manhattanville had 8; #4 Bowdoin had 6; and #5 Plattsburgh had 15. Only Middlebury cracked the top 5 without a lot of Canadians (they had one). I think that schools with a strong academic reputation, like Bowdoin, Middlebury, Williams, RPI etc will always have a chance of recruiting a few from Canada, but how do schools like Manhattanville, Elmira and Plattsburgh recruit so many?

[rpi_fan03]

hab- there are a few reasons that those schools who have less impressive academic reps are able to recruit such gifted players... both from Canada and the US...

One reason is that these schools give more importance to athletics and thus an athlete will most likely get more financial aide at this type of school despite their academis standing upon entereing

A second reason, for Elmira and Plattsburgh at least, is the close proximity to the border...this works two ways, with families being able to be close and see games, and with kids not having to be a significant distance from home (for holidays etc)

A few other reasons, which are debatable at best, would be that these highly skilled players are not highly skilled academics and thus couldn't get accepted to the more academically reputable schools, or that these teams are able to recruit based solely on their history of strong teams...who wouldn't want to be recruited by a team who has never lost a game to an opponent in their national division???


There are a ton of speculative reasons, but most likley it is a combination of a lot of them depending on which school we are talking about. Another thing to consider is that a lot of schools recruiting budgets are not really high enough to support them scouting all over the place and thus they are unable to tap the talent market that exists up north. HOpe this maybe answers your question a bit:D

[kashmunnie73]

..US women are better represented in D3 hockey as there may be less difference between an 18 year old Canadian vs American hockey player...esp'ly among women players. D3 men's teams dominated by older Canadians who defer college for 3 years or so.....failing to make D1 they fall back on and dominate the recruiting at D3 elite teams except NESCAC which gets its pick of non-D1 prep players. Any 21-22 year old frosh would be attractive to a D3 coach...the Canadian system and tradition just produces more of them than US. But no such system is available to Canadian women...hence they all tend to be 18-19 old recruits..not much difference Can vs US( also women have stopped growing at that age....unlike men). kash

[faceoff]

Concerning academic standards with regard to admission, can someone tell me if Canadian students take the same SAT tests that US students do? Having recently been through the recruiting process, I can tell you that the academic requirements for many of the D3 schools (NESCAC, RPI, Holy Cross, etc) are very tough. Just being a good hockey player is not enough!

[brewar]

Yes they do.

[kashmunnie73]

...didn't they?...there are plenty of good hockey players....you'd better be great to get in with weak academics....it's just a game after all. kash PS some NESCAC colleges have "optional" college boards...Bowdoin, Conn College and others.

[fan for life]

In women's hockey the only place to play after high school is the NWHL. So far the NCAA schools have encouraged females to come straight out of high school. Male players are consistently being told to play junior before starting NCAA. In my experience Americans more frequently start later and erpeat a year in high school. eg. one friend went to a prep school after graduation in Canada. As a PG born in 1980 the other 1980 players on the team were Grade 11/juniors. Hopefully women will continue to go directly to college and if still interested and talented then go NWHL.

Canadians write the same exams for SATI and SATII, ACT, AP and IB.

Strong female athletes are often very good academically. For males it seems that fewer varsity athletes are also strong academically. IMO in hockey in Canada great students on a male hockey team may not find their academic talents an asset from the social/team point of view. ( maybe because they have to study while others socialize) Hockey is played through community organizations, not through school. Travel, late games and training can hurt even a well intentioned student. As strange as it seems the old view was that a person could always put off getting an education till later but hockey wouldn't wait. Hopefully this is changing for the guys and doesn't start for the women. All things considered it is great that NCAA allows hockey players to come after playing junior. Better to get your education a little later than not at all.

[starsparents]

Great info here, but from what I see, (just my opinion) I see it the other way. I see more older Canadien Females than US delaying college and trying to improve their options. Being in Connecticut we see a lot of the Preps, and Clubs. I know some of the high level elite teams take on older players who are out of high school but are looking to improve their college choices. Yes, many US girls going from public HS to Prep do repeat a year, but I also see a lot of Canadien high level kids up there in years too. As far as boys go, it has become almost that the boys parents are being sold a bill of goods. Many boys in our area, are going to Junior B teams, holding off on college, but playing at that level may not get them seen let alone college offers. My thinking is each case is totally individual, some may need a stop in between HS and college, say doing NAHA, or Washington Pride, some are better going right into college.

[lw_lock]

Really have a hard time understanding the mystique about Canadian female players. Most high level US players coming out of the right prep schools, give nothing up to the Canadians. Not only that, the US players are more likely to have played more time with the boys, making them much more ready for the rigors of DIV I than a bunch of ex-Ringette players, or worse yet, ex- figure skaters.:p

[171]

99.9% of the Canadian ringette players don't go on to play hockey. There are a few that do and they are truly gifted to be able to do so...Jennifer Botterill being the prime example.

[hab]

Bit of an exaggeration there #171. Quite a few of the top female hockey players in Canada got their start in ringette. However, when women's hockey became an olympic sport there was quite an exodus from ringette to hockey. But if you check the backgrounds of a lot of Canadian players currently at the highest levels in both US and Canadian college hockey you will find a significant number who have ringette somewhere in their past. And "lw lock"...regarding the "mystique" about Canadian players...I don't think there is a mystique at all. There are plenty of US players who can compete with Canadian players. You just need to look at how tight the games are between the national teams to confirm that. The point is, there is lots of talent on both sides of the border now, and a hockey program that can find a way to recruit effectively on both sides of the border is more likley to be successful than one that hasn't figured out that there are different challenges to recruiting Canadians....the biggest one being financial. Most top notch Canadian universities are heavily supported by government funding so tuition is cheap. You need some sort of angle to overcome that...athletic scholarships....academic scholarships....need based or whatever.

[polarbear2]

A number of Bowdoin women grew up with ringette, including Shelly Chessie who graduated last year (2 time DivIII All American). I think you would be surprized at the number of Canadian girls who began in Ringette. I think that one the transition to ice hockey is made there may be a reluctance to talk about Ringette, as it is a "girls" sport Unfortunate but true.

[starsparents]

Again, MY OPINION ONLY, based on what I`ve seen and heard in the tournament settings in New England, and based on conversations with college recruiters/coaches, there is in some areas a mystique of Canadien players over US players. My experiences have been phrases by college coaches/recruiters such as "we`ll be better next year, we got a couple of canadiens coming in" or the inference is that the Canadien player is always a harder working, more serious, blue collar type player. Of course, this is a broad stroke of the brush, and I am sure does not reflect all mentality in coaching. However, if the myth, mystique, is out there, obviously it can effect the opportunities of many. Again, this is my opinion, from my limited experience, from what I hear and see in my travels. I most certainly am not saying this is the way it is everywhere.

[leeb]

Interesting discussion. I think it's great that RPI has had a few Canadian recruits in recent years but I don't think that automatically equates to more success or continued success on the ice. Is Lane Dielwart head and shoulders above the other players because she's Canadian? Nope, she's just good and there are hundreds of other players just like her in both the U.S. and Canada.

Quality players can be found everywhere these days, it's just a matter of finding them. Look at RPI's current roster. We've got some Canadians, we have a solid New England contingent, we have some Michigan natives, we have a curious contingent from Maryland, and we have a Colorado native in Welte. Quite a mix!

The most interesting group of players to me is the one of Maryland natives. I don't exactly equate Maryland to a hockey hotbed.

[Slug79]

The Montgomry (sp) girls youth hockey out of Maryland, has had one of the hottest groups of younger girls, in the U10 & U12 divisions, in the country. If you have a chance, check them out at the Polar Bear tourney at Christmas.

It is not surprising that Maryland would start producing some quality players.

[Hatrick]

The fact that Canadian hockey players are good isn't "Mystitique" at all, it's a fact of life. In general good football players come from the US, cricket players from Australia, soccer players from Brazil ...
hockey players from Canada.
Players start in boys leagues from the age of 4 or 5 while simultaneously taking figure skating lessons for a couple of years to improve their skating. They switch over to the girls game at about the ages of 13 or 14 once the size differential with the boys becomes to great. That is why most Canadian girls can easily handle the tough physical play in D-1. Plus the fact that many of them play shinny with their Brothers & Dads.That is a typical profile of a good Canadian female hockey player.
LW, a successful transition from ringette to hockey is more the exception rather than the rule & the ringette players generally have a tough time with the physicality of hockey.
The players that come from Canada & go to D-III were basically average players in the competitive Midget & Jr club leagues, that lacked size. But many of these players go on to be stars in D-III.
So the depth of the player pool in Canada isn't an accident, it's a way of life.

[kashmunnie73]

.....my niece's hockey in US seems very/too organized....plays on two teams...all games not much practice. Pick up hockey is more available now vs years ago...as there is more rink capacity...but girls seem few and far between vs young guys playing open hockey. kash